Ban This Racist Hymn, Says Bishop (Why the Britain we knew is swirling down the memory hole)

The Telegraph ^ | August 12, 2004 | Jonathan Petre and Jonathan Wynne-Jones

[quidnunc]

A Church of England bishop has called on churches to ban the singing of I Vow to Thee, My Country, one of the best known hymns, because he says it is heretical and has racist overtones.

The Bishop of Hulme, the Rt Rev Stephen Lowe, said the hymn's popularity was a symptom of a "dangerous" increase in English nationalism which had parallels with the rise of Nazism.

Its associations with the British empire were also questionable in a multi-faith, multi-cultural society.

The patriotic hymn, which is set to music from Gustav Holst's The Planets, is a popular choice for Remembrance Day services and other national occasions.

It was sung at the wedding of the Princess of Wales, who said it had been a favourite of hers since her schooldays. It was also sung at her funeral in 1997. A version was adapted as the anthem for the Rugby World Cup.

The bishop said the words, written by Sir Cecil Spring-Rice in 1918, were "totally heretical" because they suggested that people should pledge their allegiance to their country before God.

"My country, right or wrong is not an appropriate sentiment for Christians to uphold," he said.

He had no objection to the second verse but would not allow the first to be sung at any of his services and urged clergy to think "long and hard" before permitting it.

-snip-

"It is like American culture where there is this view that America is the land of the free when we know it is not. But there are those in America who want to maintain that it is and want to impose their understanding, their culture, their way of doing things on everybody else. That is dangerous."

-snip-

[faq]

"It is like American culture where there is this view that America is the land of the free when we know it is not."

The UK can't really brag about their freedom of speech:

No Porking Allowed
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,151638,00.html

A man in the United Kingdom has been formally chastised by a court for labeling his parking lot a "porking yard" and offending Muslims from a nearby mosque in the process, according to the Scotsman.

Leroy Trought, owner of the Swan With Two Necks pub in Bristol (search), was ordered by a court to change the sign in his car park to the more proper "parking yard" and not to display any more signs that could be considered threatening, abusive or insulting at his establishment.

Apparently, Muslims attending a nearby mosque told police that the sign was racially and sexually offensive. The reference to pork was also deemed provocative and insulting.

[TheRealDBear]

Oh dear, looks like they'll have to impound all copies of Emerson, Lake and Palmer's "Brain Salad Surgery" then.

[Incorrigible]

Brit Bump.

[Republican Wildcat]

Well he had a bit of a point in that we should not make say that faith and patriotism are one and the same - but adding in the America bashing causes any point to be lost.

[Verginius Rufus]

John Lennon's lyrics are those of a simple-minded idiot, but they remind me of a passage in Joinville's Life of St. Louis. Joinville was a contemporary who knew Louis IX personally. At one point they encounter a crazy old woman who has a bundle of sticks and a bucket of water. Her intention is to use the sticks to make a fire to burn up heaven, and the water to put out the fire of hell, so that people will do what is right for its own sake, rather than from hope of reward or fear of punishment.

[Frank_2001]

LOL I watched a show recently on The Discovery Channel (I think) dealing with hogs, it was mentioned that the wild boar population of England is increasing greatly. So, perhaps the ROP will be a bit nervous about this, but of course boars can't be hunted because hunting is illegal; hehehe, I love the dilemmas of the PC!;)

[Peelod]

Let His Lordship have it-

Lowehulme@btinternet.com

[JimRed]

"My country, right or wrong is not an appropriate sentiment for Christians to uphold," he said.

Unless you add the rest that was conveniently left off:
..."when right, to keep her right; when wrong, to set her right".

[goldstategop]

Yes. Augustine was a Roman. But he was also aware the world he lived in was dying and he would not miss its demise. There are greater things than worldly concerns; the City Of Man may decay and crumble into ruin while the City Of God endures unchanged and whole forever.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[A. Pole]

John Lennon's lyrics are those of a simple-minded idiot, but they remind me of a passage in Joinville's Life of St. Louis. Joinville was a contemporary who knew Louis IX personally. At one point they encounter a crazy old woman who has a bundle of sticks and a bucket of water. Her intention is to use the sticks to make a fire to burn up heaven, and the water to put out the fire of hell, so that people will do what is right for its own sake, rather than from hope of reward or fear of punishment.

This is more tricky. Somewhere in the Patristics(I do not recall the place at this moment) is written that there are three kinds of people who are saved:

The first is similar to the slaves - such are saved by the fear of punishment,

the second is like the hirelings - such are saved by the hope of reward,

the third are like the children - they are saved by the love of Father.

[SWAMPSNIPER]

When did You last hear this one?

1. My country,' tis of thee,
sweet land of liberty, of thee I sing;
land where my fathers died,
land of the pilgrims' pride,
from every mountainside let freedom ring!

2. My native country, thee,
land of the noble free, thy name I love;
I love thy rocks and rills,
thy woods and templed hills;
my heart with rapture thrills, like that above.

3. Let music swell the breeze,
and ring from all the trees sweet freedom's song;
let mortal tongues awake;
let all that breathe partake;
let rocks their silence break, the sound prolong.

4. Our fathers' God, to thee,
author of liberty, to thee we sing;
long may our land be bright
with freedom's holy light;
protect us by thy might, great God, our King.

[SuziQ]

I've loved the hymn "Jerusalem" since I heard it in the movie Chariots of Fire. The Church is free to ban certain music, but it should have told the girl when she first reserved it for the wedding.

The hymn was sung at Ronald Reagan's funeral service in the National Cathedral, but with different words.

Catholic Churches here in MA will no longer allow "O Danny Boy" to be sung at funerals; apparently it was very popular to do once upon a time. So someone wrote words that are appropriate to the Mass of Resurrection to the tune, and that's what folks sing.

[B Knotts]

Am I the only one that thinks it, well, ironic that a clergyman of the Church of England, should be denouncing a hymn as too "nationalistic?"

I mean...it's the "Church of England" ...a national church, fer cryin' out loud.

[goldstategop]

You forgot the final verse - taken from the Psalms - "and her ways are ways of gentleness and all her paths are peace."

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[P8riot]

Beautiful song. I sang it at a friend's wedding a few summers ago. He married a young lady in Cornwall. He flew me over to be part of the ceremony.

[goldstategop]

A hymn in praise of God and the ways of gentleness and paths are peace are "too nationalistic?" What a blooming idiot! They should sooner ban the Anglican Church before they throw this lovely hymn on the trash heap of history.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[rudy45]

I believe "Jerusalem" was the recessional hymn at the funeral of Harold Abrahams, at least as depicted in "Chariots of Fire."

[steve8714]

I see nothing about gebder identification...

[nmh]

What's racist about this?

[GSlob]

Well, since the prison population is about 1%, it follows that the other 99% are free. I'll grant the bishop that much.