Posted on 04/23/2004 4:21:45 PM PDT by Cannoneer No. 4
April 23, 2004: The U.S. Marine Corps is looking for a new .45 caliber (11.4mm) pistol. While the American military retired the M1911 .45 caliber in 1985, some commando units still prefer it. This is because the 11.4mm (.45 caliber) bullet weighs twice as much as the 9mm one that replaced it and still has an edge in "stopping" someone hit with it. But the 9mm M9 pistol magazine carries 15 rounds, versus seven in the M1911. The commandos (Special Forces, SEALs, Marine Force Recon) counter that their operations are the type where every round counts, and the fewer you have to fire the better. For the regular troops, the M9 has been popular, and successful. The 9mm weapon is lighter, has less recoil and has the extra ammo for users who are not sharpshooters.
The Marines want to buy 1,100 new .45 caliber pistols and are having a competition to determine which of several models available will get the $1.9 million contract. The Marines have been using M1911s rebuilt from the many old ones turned in when everyone switched to the M9. But even this supply is running out, and it is known that there are newer .45 caliber designs out there that are more reliable, lighter, easier to repair and more accurate. Some Marines (and other troops) buy these newer .45 caliber weapons with their own money. Most American combat units tolerate troops bringing in some additional weapons, especially pistols. Some troops have been buying 10mm pistols, seeing this as a nice cross between the lighter weight of the M9 (2.55 pounds versus three for the .45) and the greater stopping power of the 11.4mm M1911 bullet. But there are new .45 models that weigh as much as the M9, carry more bullets (10) and are easier to repair than the M1911.
Afghanistan also raised the issue of stopping power once more, when individual troops went into caves or other tight places, where only a pistol could be used. In these cases, every shot counted, and the guy firing larger (like 11.4mm instead of 9mm) bullets was more likely to win. But most troops agree that any arguments over pistols is minor compared to issues involving all the other more frequently used weapons and bits of equipment. Nevertheless, there's something about pistols…
I don't think so in the situations we are involved in, but I don't know if the question has ever actually been addressed by (international) courts. The problem I see is who would be lawful and unlawful combatants under Geneva rules. Obviously, the only parties that could be held to the accord would be those in a regular military unit (our soldiers), not individual insurgent/guerrilla units.
That would make a nice close carry piece.
It is. But there's a .45 ACP version with two, four or six-and-a half inch barrel options. I'll settle for either a 2-incher or four if the .45 autorim version comes out, but a 3-inch .45 autorim version would be a real sweetheart.
I can settle for a .45 ACP model very happily enough though. I've got a very old S&W M49 bodyguard that's served me honorably and well, but finally deserves retirement. The Taurus .45 or .45AR Tracker may just be the one that gets that job.
If all you have is a 9mm handgun, you may sensibly look around for something more serious before going out looking for trouble, not a bad policy. I've BTDT with my own 9mm GP and with 9mmSMGs a couple of times.
I like .45 ACP revolvers.
Me too. But it's the announcementv of a possible .45 autorim version that's gotten my interest. See the Stellar clip in the pic above.
Question to all: Does anybody know anything of the European American Armory "Witness" .45 compact? I like the double action first shot and the ergonomics seem awesome, but I've never fired one of these. Anybody know anything of the reliability factor? My carry gun has to be 100% reliable and smaller than a 45 Commander of which I already have one. If that last sentence doesn't seem to make sense, I'm exhausted...so please work it out.
MK IV Series 70
(Cute kid, ain't she?) :-D
Glock 36 I might could live with. All the other Glocks feel like bricks in my hand.
Or this period piece:
(OK, OK, I don't carry mine . . . although if I ran out of bullets I could always whack the goblin over the head with it. But it sure is a show stopper at the range. For some reason when it's loaded with Unique it jets flame and a huge cloud of smoke out of the muzzle AND the forcing cone.)
We used to have a judge known as "Two Gun Charlie" because he presided with a matched pair of .44 Bulldogs . . . loaded . . . and used one for a gavel. Hope he had an empty cylinder under the hammer . . .
SIGARMS is mighty proud of their guns and they price them to reflect that. I have no trigger time on any, and they feel a bit clunky to me compared to a 1911, but better than a Glock.
I belong to a gun club and it's a running joke about the police's poor shooting ability. Police officers tend to be reluctant to practice because they don't want to spend the money for the ammo!
I had one of the early PT145s, which experienced some problems with the plastic frames cracking out at the pin holes- *chunking* would probably be a better description. We had a FR thread going about it, and I could probably find it in my bookmarks if you're interested. Taurus kept their word on their outstanding guarantee though and many of those who'd had problems with the 145 went for the 945 instead as a replacement.
I got in an involved trade with a county deputy whose department had gone to the .40 S&W...and I had a Glock 22 he wanted, and got. And his wife wanted to get him an off-duty/backup gun for their first anniversary present, and she knew he liked my PT945, and what did I want for it...? So i got away from it, and in the last couple of years, he's put around 4000 rounds through it without the slightest problem. Figures.
I wouldn't feel at all badly equippped with a 945. The stainless versions are especially night, but also available in an aluminum allow frame if light weight is a requirement.
There are those who claim that short-barrel [4¼-inch, for the 945] barrel .45s may not generate enough velocity for some hollowpoints to expand. Likewise, they note that .45 ball from a 5-inch GI barrel can pass through an unarmored opponent and injure those who may be behind them. While I like the idea of someone I'm mad at trying to plug as many leaks as possibly, I've come to the conclusion that one answer to both problems is to run the most reliable possible .45 ball ammo through the shorty barrel guns. I'd try a few different 230 ball loads for your pistol and use whichever one was most reliable. How many rounds total do you have through it so far? It takes 150 rounds to establish 98% reliability, 600 to prove 99%, and over 2000 to ascertain 100% reliability with a particular gun/ammo/magazine combination...
I don't have as much time on the Sig as I do on my Combat Commander, and it will take some catching up since I started carrying the CC when we lived in a Bad Neighborhood back in the late 70s . . .
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