Pope wants new international order to keep peace

Reuters | January 1, 2004 | Claire Soares

[HAL9000]

VATICAN CITY, Jan 1 (Reuters) - The world needs a "new international order" to solve its conflicts and ensure peace, Pope John Paul said in his New Year's Day address on Thursday.

The ghosts of 2003 -- when the United States invaded Iraq without United Nations approval -- dominated the pope's first speech of 2004.

"More than ever we need a new international order which draws on the experience and results of the United Nations," the 83-year-old pontiff said at a mass in St Peter's Basilica.

"An order which is capable of finding adequate solutions to today's problems, based on the dignity of human beings, on integrating all society, on solidarity between rich and poor countries, on the sharing of resources and the extraordinary results of scientific and technological progress," he added.

Speaking at Christendom's largest church, the pope urged people not to lose hope of finding peace in the Holy Land, which the Vatican feels is vital to winning the war on terror.

"The land in which Jesus was born sadly continues to live in a dramatic condition. And in other parts of the world sparks of violence and conflict have not been extinguished either. But we need to persevere and not bow to the temptation of losing hope."

Turning to Africa, the pope paid tribute to his Burundi ambassador, Michael Courtney, killed on Monday in an ambush the army has blamed on rebels who have refused to join a peace process to end a 10-year conflict.

"(He) was tragically killed...while he was going about his mission of promoting dialogue and reconciliation. We pray for him and hope his example and sacrifice will bear the fruits of peace in Burundi and the world," the pope said.

The leader of the world's one billion Catholics, who suffers from Parkinson's disease that makes it difficult for him to talk, seemed alert and read all of his homily in a clear voice.

But it is unclear what 2004 holds for him. For the first time since his election in 1978, the pope enters the new year with no firm plans for travel, although there have been some invitations.

He was particularly weak on his last foreign trip, a visit to Slovakia in September, when aides had to read most of his addresses for him.

[BlackElk]

As Tom Hanks said in Sleepless in Seattle: She looks like my Third Grade Teacher. Wait, She IS my Third Grade teacher.

[BlackElk]

Your reformed comments are also free game for criticism when directed at Jesus Christ's Vicar on earth. Quit your own whining.

[MississippiMan]

I fully realize the staggering bias of the media--it was in fact a front line of the battle in which liberals seized control of this country--but there's a limit as to how much they can twist quotes like these from the pope. He clearly made a pro-UN-one-worldesque statement here, and it doesn't much matter who reports it.

MM

[BlackElk]

Quite evidently the heart and soul of your faith is hatred of Rome. We are proud to regard you as opposition. You have seen the YOPIOS box, I trust.

[Bluntpoint]

I am a Knight of Columbus

Which one is you?

[cebadams]

He clearly made a pro-UN-one-worldesque statement here, and it doesn't much matter who reports it.

I just don't see it -- the pro-UN-one-worldesque statement. Please point it out.

[MississippiMan]

"More than ever we need a new international order which draws on the experience and results of the United Nations," the 83-year-old pontiff said at a mass in St Peter's Basilica.

"An order which is capable of finding adequate solutions to today's problems, based on the dignity of human beings, on integrating all society, on solidarity between rich and poor countries, on the sharing of resources and the extraordinary results of scientific and technological progress," he added.

---

If you don't see that as a pro-UN-one-worldesque statement, then we're unlikely to agree on much of anything.

MM

[Bluntpoint]

Please point it out.

"More than ever we need a new international order which draws on the experience and results of the United Nations," the 83-year-old pontiff said at a mass in St Peter's Basilica.

[cebadams]

I'll just repost what I posted way back on #273:

The U.N. is a complete and utter failure, a "new order" implies something other than an existing order. So we see here that JPII is in essence advocating for an international coalition (NOT the UN) to combat terrorism and bring pease to the middle east.

An order that can find solutions to today's problems; i.e., a coalition of forces to combat international terrorism. Maybe something just like this one:

The Proliferation Security Initiative reflects the need for a more dynamic, active approach to the global proliferation problem. It envisions partnerships of states working in concert, employing their national capabilities to develop a broad range of legal, diplomatic, economic, military and other tools to interdict threatening shipments of WMD and missile-related equipment and technologies.

A new order that produces results just like this one: U.S. find led to Gadhafi decision.

Hard not to agree with this message.

The U.S. cannot go it alone. Some coalition will exist. That coalition will not be the U.N.

[Bluntpoint]

The Pope was against us going to war with Iraq.

The U.N. failed to stop us.

The Pope wants a new and improved U.N. to stop us in the future.

[cebadams]

The Pope wants a new and improved U.N. to stop us in the future.

The posted article does not say that. And doing a quick google search I find no statements or other articles that support your point.

And who is the "us" that you refer to? I hope you are referring to the 30 some counties that comprise the Iraq coalition.

[Bluntpoint]

Pope: War Threatens Fate Of Humanity

VATICAN CITY, March 22, 2003







(AP) Pope John Paul II on Saturday denounced the war against Iraq as threatening the "fate of humanity" in his first public comments on the U.S-led attacks.

"When war, as in these days in Iraq, threatens the fate of humanity, it is ever more urgent to proclaim, with a strong and decisive voice, that only peace is the road to follow to construct a more just and united society," John Paul said. "Violence and arms can never resolve the problems of men."

The pontiff said that peace is "a gift of God and a humble and constant achievement by men."

John Paul, with impassioned speeches and Vatican diplomacy, lobbied against war and in favor of a negotiated solution in the months before the conflict.

He made his remarks Saturday in an address at the Vatican to members of an Italian religious television channel, Telepace.

A few hours after the war began, the Vatican expressed "deep pain" and faulted both sides for failing to find a peaceful solution, but until Saturday, the pope himself had not spoken publicly about the attacks.

John Paul has said there is no legal or moral justification for military action. He has also expressed concern that war would harm relations between Christians and Muslims.

Before the war, the pope sent a cardinal to Washington to plead with President Bush not to attack, and another cardinal to Baghdad to press Saddam Hussein to cooperate completely with U.N. weapons inspectors.

©MMIII, The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

[A CA Guy]

As a Catholic, I think that statement reflects the Pope does not keep up to speed with the actual goings on of the UN or the Pope sees them in light of what they are to represent, not what they ARE!

I am disappointed, yet again he may be trying to avoid a bomb in his compound, one never knows.

[Bluntpoint]

During the Clinton years of rolling over for the U.N. and treating it like an equal, there was little noise coming from the Vatican about the need for a new international order of states.

[A CA Guy]

During Clinton, there wasn't an international war on terror or threats directly positioned by Al Q at them as there seems to be now.

I think some of the speech is about that IMO!

[Bluntpoint]

There was a war going on, Clinton just did not want to openly enter the battle.

As long as everyone pretended what was happening was not happening, none of the interested parties feared the scorn of the Muslim community of wackos.

[cebadams]

As long as everyone pretended what was happening was not happening ...

How true and including us all.

[A CA Guy]

Of course, but the difference is we went on the offensive with Bush and the radicals are attempting to make this a Holy War with Christianity.

Pope might be trying to avoid that. Maybe, I don't know, but I don't agree with his view of the UN.

I think they are dangerous and mostly ruled by evil dictators.

[Hotdog]

Lets clean up your own house before you go any further...

[Bluntpoint]

We were attacked.

The Vatican was not.

If the Pope took a pricipled stance, he may very well have to face attack himself.

IMO, he is just covering the Vaticans patootie.