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Republican Liberty Caucus as a virtual third party
October 1, 2005 | Albert Abramson

Posted on 10/01/2005 1:18:41 PM PDT by maxxoccupancy

I have been talking to people about the Republican Liberty Caucus, but I have been having a hard time explaining the issue to people. Our statements of principle have always centered around smaller government and proptecting our rights. A surprisingly small majority of Americans support these two principles, but it's enough to form a political movement.

The RLC has its own statement of principles, and its own conventions. Members are not expected to tow the party line, especially for RINO's. I believe that we should sell the RLC as a separate political group that supports libertarians, constitutionalists, reform party members, and independents, as long as they support our core constitutional principles.

The idea behind the RLC was to form a political group that runs candidates (with an R after their name on the ballot) without the third party ballot access problems. There is a strong need for a large, big tent political movement that can get outsiders in. The few RLC members we have serving in state legislatures are good.

I believe we need a stronger base of support, and I think we need to approach the voters with a broad based alternative to the "two party" system. I believe that we need to tell voters that we are different form the GOP, that we have our own group, and the RLC candidates will stick to their core principles.


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: asshatmaxx; ballotaccess; bigtent; byebye; firstpost; gotzot; itszottingtime; justsignedup; parties; slimyrepublicans; thirdparty; troll; vikingkitties; zot; zotbait; zotme; zotmeagain; zotmebaby; zotmedaily; zotmefrombehind; zotmehard; zotmeharder; zotmeintonextweek; zotmetillipuke; zotsfortots
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To: Do not dub me shapka broham
They'd be better off getting Jon Spencer to run as a Conservative/Libertarian fusion candidate. It appears as though the simians who run the NY GOP have made it definite that Attorney General Facelift is the sacrificial lamb against Hillary.

Does ANYONE really like Jeannie Pirro? She's the Lebanese-American Harriet Miers.

41 posted on 10/30/2005 9:20:07 PM PST by Clemenza (In League with the Freemasons, The Bilderbergers, and the Learned Elders of Zion)
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To: Clemenza
She's Lebanese?
42 posted on 10/30/2005 9:23:25 PM PST by Do not dub me shapka broham
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To: Do not dub me shapka broham

Yes. Pirro is her husband's name. Having a vowel at the end of your name helps in Yonkers, Eastchester, and certain other parts of Westchester.


43 posted on 10/30/2005 9:25:04 PM PST by Clemenza (In League with the Freemasons, The Bilderbergers, and the Learned Elders of Zion)
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To: Do not dub me shapka broham; freepatriot32
BWA HA HA HA HA!

Where did you hear this? I would subscribe to the latter assessment, but I don't know what they are trying. Maybe to become the national equivalent of the blue man group.

And THIS kind of stuff is why I only vote big "L" libertarian as an occasional protest vote. Sorry, freepatriot32.

44 posted on 10/30/2005 9:29:14 PM PST by LibertarianInExile (Miers did the right thing. Now the President can, by appointing Alex Kozinski, 9th Circuit COA.)
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To: Clemenza
Something tells me that if Peter King didn't chair the Homeland Security Committee he would be in this race.

I just can't envision a scenario under which he would not improve upon-or at worst, match-the performance of Rick Lazio.

45 posted on 10/30/2005 9:30:17 PM PST by Do not dub me shapka broham
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To: LibertarianInExile
LOL.

Yes, I remember the hijinx of the Blue-or more accurately, purple-Man fondly.

Wasn't he running in Idaho?

46 posted on 10/30/2005 9:31:56 PM PST by Do not dub me shapka broham
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To: LibertarianInExile

Libertarians will not stay unless they see their agenda getting somewhere.


47 posted on 11/11/2005 12:19:04 AM PST by springing interest
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To: springing interest

We should have left by now, then. Most of us have not, simply because we don't see any viable options.


48 posted on 11/11/2005 12:29:31 AM PST by LibertarianInExile (Let O'Connor Go Home!)
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To: LibertarianInExile

I sometimes vote libertarian. Guess that's my small way of sending a message.


49 posted on 11/11/2005 3:07:04 PM PST by springing interest
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To: springing interest

I do the same thing. If I think that an election won't be close, I vote for the Republican, since I don't want to help split the conservaitve vote, helping the Democrat win with less than the majority. If I think that the Republican candidate is too liberal and that the election won't be close, I vote for the Constitution Party candidate, and, if that party doesn't have a candidate, in that race, I vote for the Libertarian. In Oct. 2004, I thought that Bush was too liberal and that Kerry would win 57% of the vote in my state, Illinois. I voted for the Constitution Party candidate, and Kerry won 57% in IL.
I wish that more conservatives would vote the way that we do. It might cause Republicans to become more conservative.


50 posted on 11/13/2005 12:18:38 PM PST by PhilCollins
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To: maxxoccupancy

When I first looked into the RLC it was because I was a life long Republican who developed a libertarian view. I remember at one time the RLC saying it was made up of libertarians who saw the Republican party as the best tool for spreading their philosophy, and for seeing it enacted. I agree with this.

The third party route is a sure fire route to political obscurity. Within the GOP is the best route for these principles to be spread. The important thing is the spread of the principles, but the need for majorities to accomplish an agenda makes alliances with a major party necessary.

A third party would ensure the win of our opponents and the shelving of our agenda. If you are willing to shelve the agenda to claim the moral high-ground then go ahead, but don't be surprised when you get nothing done.


51 posted on 11/15/2005 4:29:55 PM PST by john330
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To: Do not dub me shapka broham

The blue man was running in Montana.


52 posted on 11/15/2005 4:37:00 PM PST by john330
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To: john330
Thanks for the clarification!

I appreciate it.

:)

Maybe he would have had better luck if he had run for Ed Koch's old position as District Leader of the Village.

;0)

53 posted on 11/15/2005 4:47:47 PM PST by Do not dub me shapka broham
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To: maxxoccupancy

I think if you want change, you try to make it in the Republican primaries, then after the result of the primary, it's time to vote Republican and not to split up the conservative vote.


54 posted on 11/23/2005 6:44:58 PM PST by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: maxxoccupancy
I think it is best to make any attempts at change in the primaries as a third party.
After that, everyone is a weasel if they don't vote Republican, because not doing so enables Democrats power.

On the city level, if a RLC or Libertarian wants to run for Dog Catcher and not go for a Republican, that is cool IMO.
55 posted on 12/01/2005 8:14:28 PM PST by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: A CA Guy

Sometimes, if the election won't be close, a conservative can vote for a minor party candidate without helping the Democrat.

In 2000, I lived near San Diego, and I thought that the republican nominee for the U.S. Senate, Congressman Tom Campbell, was too liberal. I knew, because of a few polls, that Sen. Feinstein would beat Campbell by 15%-20%. If I thought that the election would be close, I would have voted for Campbell, since I didn't want to help split the anti-liberal vote, helping Feinstein win with less than half of the vote. Since I knew that Feinstein would get at least 55%, I voted for Diane Templin, of the American Independent Party. Feinstein beat Campbell, about 56%-38%. The thrid and fourth place candidates were the Green and Libertarian candidates. Templin was fifth, with 2%.


56 posted on 12/12/2005 8:27:43 AM PST by PhilCollins
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To: A CA Guy

Sir, I am shocked! If one doesn't vote Republican in a General Election, one is a weasel? I've looked at the Liberty Score of my Senators and Rep and it wasn't good. I'll vote my conscience against my Authoritarian Republicans and be a weasel.


57 posted on 12/28/2005 5:16:06 PM PST by Manwich (Listen to Freedom Radio at FreeTalkLive.com)
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To: maxxoccupancy
I think that the RLC is good in that it is one of the last outposts of fiscal sanity in our party. My main problem with the RLC is that it is a tool for libertarians to run as a mainstream candidate to win elections. They are by the very definition of the word RINO's. They hold no real loyalty to the party or its principals and do not really try to improve the party but to mainly use it as a election tool.

However, I also don't think the republican party should purge those who do not meat the purity test. I think the republican party must fight to remain a purely conservative party, but there are many degrees of conservatism and not just moral conservatives (who if you take there votes for the FMA away,look no different then democrats!).

Basically I don't have a problem with RLC I have a problem with libertarians exploiting the party for political gain.
58 posted on 12/29/2005 12:28:58 AM PST by spikeytx86
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To: Manwich
Yes, voting a third party in a general election gets you Democrats. That was EXACTLY what got us Bill Clinton.

Third parties are directly responsible for the success of Bill Clinton.

So third parties can make believe they are conservative and talk tough, but when their actions get democrats elected, they are no conservative's friend.

The time for a statement is in the primaries. If you want to elect a different Republican, then get a different Republican a victory in the Primaries. Then vote Republican in the general election, unless it is a dog catcher position, in that case Libertarian is a safe bet.
59 posted on 12/29/2005 11:40:06 AM PST by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: A CA Guy
Its my understanding that the Libertarian Party claims that they draw equally from both parties (this has never made sense to me, but who am I to call them liars?) and draw voters who would not otherwise vote (this does make sense).

The Federal Government grew less in Clinton's 8 years than Bush's term so far, and that is barring wars and disasters.

I doubt that Libertarians consider themselves "conservative" at least on the World's Smallest Political Quiz. I certainly don't.

I usually vote Republican, if a Libertarian option doesn't exist, but sometimes I vote Democrat if the Republican is particularly offensive. I just want a smaller government and I don't care how I get it. Am I weaselly for this desire?
60 posted on 12/29/2005 5:30:56 PM PST by Manwich (Listen to Freedom Radio at FreeTalkLive.com)
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