Posted on 08/21/2003 8:42:43 AM PDT by RussianConservative
Then this viewpoint is wrong, because Jesus said otherwise. He said no one comes to the Father, except by Him.
The point on which the Orthodox confess ignorance is precisely who will be saved: we do not know whether any outside the visible bounds of Christ's Holy Church are saved (though evidence from our tradition suggests this is possible), nor do we know (save in the case of those whose glorification God has been pleased to reveal to His Church, who are thus revered as saints) who among those whom it would seem from this-worldly observation are a part of His Mystical Body (the Church) are indeed saved. ('Call no man holy until he has died,' is a saying of the Fathers.)
On another thread I pointed to the incident in the life of St. Gregory the Dialogist as recorded by a monk of Whitby, in which the sainted Pope prayed for the soul of the Emperor Tarjan (a pagan) because of a deed of charity the Emperor had done, and the dead Emperor was 'baptized with the tears' of the saint. Observe that the salvation of Tarjan was salvation through Christ: the prayers of a Christian provided the 'motive power' for his removal from hell to paradise.
The Church prays generally for all mankind, and every Pentecost for those confined in hell. We are forbidden from believing that all will be saved, but who, in spite of dying outside the communion of the Church, in spite of the falsehood of beliefs held during life, but aided by the prayers of the Church and perhaps by fragmentary true belief and deeds worthy of Christian, may be saved who would seem lost, we do not know.
Revelation through God's glory, even though the mystery is "beyond" Our exploration of an Orthodox attitude toward non-Christian religions begins with the Christian understanding of God. Emphasis is on the mystery of divine reality - the essence of God - which exceeds human capabilities. It is a basic truth of Orthodox Christianity that God's essence is incomprehensible and inaccessible to the human person; it is "beyond" all creaturely approach. A prayer in the Divine Liturgy expresses it as follows: "... for you are God ineffable, beyond comprehension, invisible, beyond understanding, existing forever and always the same ... "[2] A minor change in the rendition emphasizes the fundamental truth. God's essence is totally "beyond" - "beyond verbalization, beyond comprehension, beyond vision, beyond understanding."
Yet, while the essence of God is beyond communion, God reveals Himself through His Glory. The human person participates in God's energies manifested as theophanies "The glory of the Triune God embraces the universe (ta pania) and brings all things within the scope of His love."[3] God's glory (doxa, kaboth, shekhina) is revealed to human persons in their true intimate relation as an, end and fulfillment of the original creation of man.
The revealed glory of God - his energies - penetrates all creation and is the starting point for Christian life and hope. This central truth of Christianity was communicated doxologically to Isaiah (6:3), and is articulated in the angelic hymn of the Divine Liturgy which accompanies the prayer noted above: "Holy, Holy, Holy are You the Lord of Hosts, heaven and earth are filled with Your glory." This hymn, on the one hand, expresses the total mystery of God and, on the other, notes that His divine glory and love encompass all forms of life, His entire creation.[4]
Then there is concept that if one grows up in culture where only taught that Christ is evil, then that person automatically damned because he knows nothing else? Then God creates man to be damned and or abandoned? No.
Orthodox emphasis on the creation of the human person in the image and likeness of God (Genesis 1:26) means that the personhood of each human being is indelibly imprinted with God's image. And it follows that, carrying God's image, each person has access to revelation and salvation.[7] God is ever present - at all times, in all places and in all things. He did not create man to abandon him but to guide him to redemption, to perfection. God's purpose is the salvation and glorification of man.
The Christian message of the Good News of Salvation is central. Jesus Christ tells us, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through me" (John 14:6). Peter confesses at Phillipi, "You are the Christ" (Mark 8:29). Saint Paul declares, "He is the Image of the invisible God, the first born of all creation; for in Him all things are created" (Col. 1:15). The Scriptures abound with unequivocal affirmations of the Incarnation and the foundational beliefs that in Christ humanity is saved, is reconciled to God, worships Him, and attains eternal life. "And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12). "For God so loved the world that He gave His only Son, that whoever believe in Him should not perish but have eternal life" (John 3:16). "For in Him all fullness of God was pleased to dwell and through Him to reconcile to Himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven" (Col 1:19-20). "All knees shall bow to Him" (Rom. 14:11; Is. 45:23). He is "the same yesterday and today and forever" (Heb. 13:8). Orthodoxy continually affirms the centrality of Christ, in the Church and in the world.[12]
These and other similar Biblical statements affirm the Truth claim of Christianity. They are the Word of God, explicitly and implicitly proclaiming fundamental beliefs of the Christian Orthodox Tradition. And, it is to be noted, these statements speak to all humanity; "For God so loved the world ... " is not a limiting statement; God's love extends to all the world. Nor does the objective "... to reconcile to Himself all things ... " have limits; Trinitarian objectives are universal. They encourage an attitude of inclusiveness as we inquire into relationships with other religions. We are reminded that the "Spirit blows wherever it wills" (John 3:8). Peter the Apostle states that. "Truly I perceive God shows no partiality, but in every nation anyone who fears Him and does what is right is acceptable to Him" (Acts 10:34-35). St. Paul, addressing the Athenians at the Areopagus, observes that they worship an unknown God, whose name and message he came to proclaim (Acts 17:23-31).
Further:
Saint John Chrysostom, in the fourth century, tells us that God is "not particular but He is the Father of all" and His providence brings the "nations" to salvation. To the Jews God gave the "written law" but to the nations He gave the "natural law," the law innate in human conscience and reason.[17]
In our times. Professor John N. Karmiris, University of Athens, based on his studies of the Church Fathers, concludes that the salvation of non-Christians, non-Orthodox and heretics depends on the all-good, allwise and all-powerful God, who acts in the Church but also through other "ways." God's saving grace is also channelled outside the Church. It cannot be assumed that salvation is denied non-Christians living in true piety and according to natural law by the God who "is love" (1 John 4:8), In his justice and mercy God will judge them worthy even though they are outside the true Church.[18] This position is shared by many Orthodox who agree that God's salvation extends to all who live according to His "image" and "participate in the Logos." The Holy Spirit acted through the prophets of the Old Testament and in the nations. Salvation is also open outside the Church.[19]
The pre-eminent scholar Leonidas Philippides also takes the position that the "seeds" of salvation are available to all people and that "no people are deprived of God's Providence."[22] Philippides inaugurated twentieth century scholarship in the history of religion and the study of comparative religion at the University of Athens. He produced numerous studies and was also a major influence at the University of Thessalonike. An early work, Comparative Religion and Christian Theology, points out that common ground exists in all religions, while simultaneously emphasizing that the Christian Faith has the fullness of Truth.[23] His monumental History of New Testament Times, decades later, historically, philosophically and theologically analyzes the understanding of God and salvation in world religions.[24]
Here one for Christian love.
For Orthodoxy there is a fusion between the truth claim of Christianity and a mandate for tolerance. We may say that one can not be a Christian without embracing tolerance as a concomitant of Christian love. This most significant and long-standing teaching of tolerance in Orthodoxy is emphasized in an encyclical letter of Ecumenical Patriarch Metrophanes III (1520-1580). This document was written to the Greek Orthodox in Crete (1568) following reports that Jews were being mistreated. The Patriarch states, "Injustice ... regardless to whomever acted upon or performed against, is still injustice. The unjust person is never relieved of the responsibility of these acts under the pretext that the injustice is done against a heterodox and not to a believer. As our Lord Jesus Christ in the Gospels said do not oppress or accuse anyone falsely; do not make any distinction or give room to the believers to injure those of another belief."[32]
And here is main point all seem to miss
The salvation of all people, including non-Christians, depends on the great goodness and mercy of the Omniscient and Omnipotent God who desires the salvation of all people. Those who live in faith and virtue, though outside the Church, receive God's loving grace and salvation. Saint Paul reminds us, "O the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and how inscrutable His ways!" (Rom. 11: 33).
I think the Orthodox reply would be that Christ is the path of salvation for those both in and out of the Christian faith. They would say that the death of Christ purchases salvation for everyone who lives a pious life, whether they are Christians or not.
But the problem with this notion is that it ignores the very simple John 3:16: "For God so loved the world (they will say "see, the whole world is the target of God's love), that He gave his only begotten Son (again, so far, so in agreement with the article), that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life." And there's the key, belief. Belief in Christ is required. People outside of Christianity obviously do not believe in Christ, else they would be Christians.
Then there's Saint Paul's statement in Romans 10:9, "If you confess Jesus as Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved." People outside the Christian faith do not do that.
But those in Orthodox clergy tell them "that's ok, no need to believe in Christ, your soul will be fine." I would not want to be in their shoes when they face the judge of all men and are called to given an account for their divergence from God's clearly written word.
The Gospel is simple, not intellectual.
Well since we around since the day of Peter and Paul and we not ever broken selves, I am not worried. Most that broke selves were new churchs with narrow theological basis to work on. We have the words of Apposals and founding Fathers.
Exact reason why 40,000+ branchs protestants in America and half scream other half going to Hell. Funny how beside Great Schism with Patriarch of Rome, Orthodox have no splits.
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