Posted on 05/15/2003 2:02:36 PM PDT by Polycarp
I never said they did.
What I did say was that I, and others who shared my beliefs, were repeatedly accused of wanting gays dead, locked up or in concentration camps because of our convictions that the Bible was accurate in describing homosexuality as sexual immorality and a sin.
Most Americans are more than a little sick of the perpetual lavender campaign to be in our faces 24/7 demanding equality for perversion.
I don't know where you live, but I have not been aware of any 24/7 "lavender campaign" demanding "equality for perversion".
But then maybe it's because I am not as obsessed with this issue as some others seem to be.
I am aware of and agree with equal rights under the law for gays as well as all Americans...this is not the same as supporting the normalization of homosexuality...and in any case I still don't see this issue being shoved in my face 24/7.
To the extent that you wish to express respect for the lavender queens by calling them homosexuals or "gays"
Let me see;
I believe homosexuality is a sin and a bioliogical perverion of the created intent by God for human sexuality...yet you claim the term homosexual is a title of "respect"????? Huh?
(what on earth is gay about the habitual abuse of the nether end of the digestive sustem?)
I don't know. But a simple search of the internet will bring up far more heterosexual sites dedicated to the abuses you describe above, than it will homosexuals sites.
To the extent that you want to marginalize normal folks who marginalize the perversion in question, it is hard to discern a rational excuse for your priorities or how those priorities fit within a conservative rather than a libertine mold.
What on earth are you talking about?
I'm not even going to try to untangle the above convoluted sentence....but I don't see how you can dispute that belief in the Biblical definition of homosexuality as a sin in God's eyes does not fit perfectly with conservative Christian views.
See…that’s a blatant lie. I don’t know anyone who accuses ALL homosexuals of being pedophiles.
So because you don't know anyone who's made such accusations therefore nobody ever has and I'm lying.
LOL.
Well you're wrong. I've encountered individuals online who've made precisely this claims.
And while the threads I refer to above may not have stated outright that ALL gays are pedophiles...they implied as much by claiming pedophilia is a normal, accepted and integral part of the homosexual community.
It’s NOT my so-called definition it’s the APA’s, go to their web site and look it up. Homosexual activists in 1969, to demonize anyone who thinks their behavior is wrong, coined the “dictionary” definition. The pejorative comes from the Stonewall riots that spilled into the annual APA meetings. In psych circles it was defined as anxiety experienced by people with unacknowledged homoerotic proclivities and repressed homoerotic feelings. Current use of the word is just a pejorative to straight people which suggests they should seek remedial counseling. You’re nothing more than a public schooled lemming believing what ever the left wing media/homosexual propagandists tell you to.
So to avoid verbal contortions, I was of course refering to the *normal usage* of the term.
The only contortions are your tap dancing around the truth of you parroting homosexual propaganda. You might as well call us “breeders” while you’re at it.
Everybody on both sides of the debate knows what the term "homophobe" means..
Not really, I had to explain it to you and its propaganda connotations. Apparently your education doesn’t go any further than slang words out of the dictionary.
I am only accused of being "one of their propagators" by people who either don't have a clue as to where I actually stand,
Yes, we’ve read them over and over…YAWN.
or they are completely unable to respond to my challenges and therefore must resort to personal attacks.
Identifing your use of homosexual propaganda is hardly an attack. You being simple-minded enough to accept its genre is quite telling. Your words have consequences…grow up.
So because you don't know anyone who's made such accusations therefore nobody ever has and I'm lying. LOL. Well you're wrong. I've encountered individuals online who've made precisely this claims.
You specifically addressed it personally as “Polycarp’s pedophile threads” NOT other “individuals” online. (Sound of Texas Two-step in background)
And while the threads I refer to above may not have stated outright that ALL gays are pedophiles...
Ummm…you referred to Polycarp’s threads but I’ve read a high percentage of “other” threads so maybe you can cite who you’re talking about.
they implied as much by claiming pedophilia is a normal, accepted and integral part of the homosexual community.
Now you’re just being a liar… YOU implied Polycarp says ALL gays are pedophiles. “How many people do you think you're winning to your side with these kinds of positions?” And what kind of positions are “these”??? ALL GAYS ARE PEDOPHILES…you have no credibility only sophistry.
Hah!! I have always maintained that the forces of deliberate personal destruction levied against Dr. Kopp (which we have discussed privately, and whose harassment is entirely real IMHO) were more likely external anti-Christian adversaries from the ranks of the so-called "Christian Liberals", than harassment from the FReeper Calvinist Brigade (at least, if any so-called "calvinist" has ever accosted Dr. Kopp in private life, I am both shocked and abysmally disappointed).
For us Calvinists... our disagreements with Orthodox Roman Catholicism are always Business (theological, that is), never Personal. You cannot trust the "theological liberals" to observe such norms of "lawful theological warfare", and so I do not trust them.
At this point, I elect to dissect the "Declaration of the Priests-Federation" according to Orthodox Presbyterian opinion -- of which I arrogantly choose to consider myself qualified to speak, as a diligent Son of Orthodox Presbytery. (My Traditionalist Protestant biases will be readily evident, so I shan't apologize for them).
Priests Federation of Altoona-Johnstown Johnstown, Pennsylvania
Therefore, we, the Priests Federation of Altoona-Johnstown, joined with our fellow clergy, ask the following from our bishop: Whereas our bishop insists on publicly defending lawsuits against this diocese and thus increasing the threat that more names of our priests be exposed in the media, we demand that our bishop cease and desist his public defense of any and all lawsuits concerning alleged priestly misconduct and instead settle these cases out of court so as to protect the reputation and well being of those priests so named and others that may be revealed in the course of any trial.
Whereas our bishop placates those who attack our diocese and its priests, we demand that our bishop turn the attention of his legal representation towards stopping the hateful and homophobic actions of George Foster, Brian Barcaro, Dr. Brian Kopp [FReeper "Polycarp"], et. al., who are set upon destroying the reputations of homosexuals priests and this diocese. Whereas our bishop ignores the actions of certain priests who consistently act against the unity of this diocese, we demand our bishop suspend Fr. James Foster and Fr. John Nesbella immediately, for repeated and constant acts which threaten the unity of our community of faith.
Whereas our bishop removed Dr. David Brown [of "GoodBye, Good Men" book fame] from his position as intake psychologist and from candidacy for the permanent diaconate program due to the incessant demands of several Talibanic conservative clergy and laity, we demand our bishop reinstate Dr. Brown both to his position as intake psychologist and to the permanent dioconate program.
Whereas our bishop has ordained several men to the priesthood over the last several year who are unfit to serve the modern, post-concilular (sic) church, we demand our bishop conduct a complete review and overhaul of the priestly recruitment program: I. Review the psychological reports of the men ordained since 1995 and order to counseling all those who are deemed to have serious mental deficiencies or proven inability to serve in the church of Vatican II. II. Cease and desist sending seminarians to the present rigid seminaries used by our diocese and begin to use more pastoral seminaries for formation. III. Deny orders to the present candidate for ordination to the priesthood because of a very negative psychological report and his inability to serve the present day church. IV. Examine all present and future seminarians in greater psychological depth to determine their fitness and desire to serve the modern church. We believe that it is better to have fewer clergy and more lay involvement than to have many rigid and juridical priests who drive women and men away from the community of believers. Whereas the present staff our (sic) diocesan finance office (Larry Sutton, et. al.) shows no respect for our clergy and little if any knowledge of the day to day life of our clergy and our parishes, we demand that our bishop retrain or replace the staff of the finance office so as to respect the dignity of our clergy and their office.
Whereas our chancery shows little care or concern for our retired priests at Dimitri Manor or elsewhere, we demand that our bishop review and overhaul the priests retirement program so as to provide them with the comfortable retirement due to them after many years of thankless service: I. Immediately increase the present monthly retirement benefit payment to $1,500.00. II. Fully fund all future retirement needs 20 years into the future in a pension trust fund so as to guarantee monthly payments regardless of the future financial state of the diocese. III. Separate all retirement monies from diocesan funds so as to protect them from being taken in lawsuits. IV. Immediately form a committee to examine the deplorable living conditions at the Dimitri Manor priests retirement home. Whereas the compensation of our priests under the present formula is inherently unjust as priests whose workload is heavy due to parish size are paid the same as priests in small parishes, we demand that our bishop install a new payscale to reflect a more appropriate and just salary based on workload and parish size.
We want YOUR Money in OUR Pockets.
And we want it immediately, you selfish reactionary Capitalist thieves. How do you expect such Noble, Self-less, un-Employed, Progressive Shepherds such as we are to guide the Flock to new Revelations of Tolerance and Universal Brotherhood unless you quit bitching and give us your MONEY??
By the virtues of Apostolic Succession, we are your trustworthy Shepherds. Would you PLEASE fork over the F***ING cash, already??
We believe this list of demands is the same list Jesus himself would ask for if he were a priest of this diocese.
Cough it up. Jesus would approve.
If our requests are not met, we ask our fellow clergy to prayerfully consider ways of peaceful protest. Each should follow his or her conscience in discerning ways to show civil disobedience to our hierarchy until our voice of change is heard. Sincerely in Christ, Priests Federation of Altoona-Johnstown
So unless you submit to our Demands (and by the way -- did we mention the Money?)... we're gonna go Revolutionary on your arse.
After all, we believe in a "Church that Serves". WE ain't here to serve the Mother Church; the Mother Church is here to serve US.
That's probably rather Cynical on my part. As an Orthodox Protestant, I am cynical about a great many Roman Catholic affairs.
But that is how I read the "Declaration of the Priests-Federation" -- at least, according to my own Orthodox Presbyterian opinion.
best, OP
To wit: It is of critical importance that adolescent male Catholic Youth be encouraged to undertake the Vocation of Altar-Boy. This is a fine and time-honored Roman Catholic tradition, and one of especial importance in these troubled times....
We passionately desire to Nurture them. ~~ Priests Federation of Altoona-Johnstown
Sweep up your spent brass
You are (at times) my hero.
mouth breathing cattle
.....I'm still giggling over that one
Evidently you live under a rock, or in the Yukon Territory.
The campaign is not, of course, as much a campaign as is the Light Beer v. Real Beer or Oreos v. Keebler...but in everyday reading of the mainstream media, various 'social justice' screeds, and in both legislative and judicial arenas, this campaign is ongoing.
Both the tempo and the intensity of same has increased steadily over the last 10 years. Unlike BlaEl, I would define it as 18/6. Close enough.
Not to worry. While Black Elk's lyric-writing exercises are not excellent, this particular sentence made perfect sense to me.
Of course, some on FR also suggest that I am convoluted, which is Biblically acceptable, unlike the grave disorder of homosexuality and the mortal sin of practicing same.
(Shrugs) Sometime I encounter a situation which tangentially reminds me of the fact that the American Presbyterian Church (to which I have covenanted myself, of sorts), which was largely responsible for the Independence of these United States (at least in terms of blood and bullets)...
...is now largely useless (if not actually counter-productive) to Her as a guiding Biblical watch-guard. Largely because of the infiltration of Pseudo-Christians, and pseudo-christian arguments, very much like those above. Even when it concerns the Roman Catholic Church (an institution for which I would usually have little favorable passion), it gets my dander up, and I'm compelled to out-do myself.
At least, that's my present excuse for entering the conversation with all guns blazing. (As if you'd expect otherwise)
Best, OP
;-)
--Brian
For anyone who missed it, please review OP's truly brilliant post above!
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