Vatican To Publish New Document On Marian Apparitions Next Week

One News Page ^ | 5/6/24 | Courtney Mares

[Roman_War_Criminal]

The Vatican’s doctrine office will publish a new document next week on discerning Marian apparitions and other supernatural events.

The Holy See Press Office announced on Tuesday that Cardinal Víctor Manuel Fernández, the prefect of the Dicastery for the Doctrine of the Faith (DDF), will unveil new norms for discernment regarding “apparitions and other supernatural phenomena” on Friday, May 17.

In an interview with the National Catholic Register, CNA’s sister news partner, last month, Fernandez said that the document will provide “clear guidelines and norms” for discernment.

The new norms will be the first time that the Vatican’s doctrinal office has issued a general document on apparitions in four decades. Pope Paul VI approved norms on “the discernment of presumed apparitions or revelations” in 1978.

[ebb tide]

I see it from personal experiece and I see it right here on this forum.

I haven’t seen one ex-Catholic that is now a God-fearing protestant. They all claim they’re already saved and have absolutely no fear of their Final Judgement by God. They have already judged themselves as saved, with no temporal punishment.

Good luck with that.

[ealgeone]

Still relying on that scapular, ebb??

[ealgeone]

You're holding up Scott Hahn????? Now that's comical. I've read some of his works.

The dude has a bad way of handling the Word.

In fact, I'll go so far as to say a dishonest way of handling the Word.

[BipolarBob]

LOL!

[af_vet_1981]

Show me in Scripture where Mary ascends to “heaven” before death.

Show me in Scripture where Purgatory is declared by The Lord.

Crickets....I hear them.

2 Kings 2:

11. And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
12. And Elisha saw it, and he cried, My father, my father, the chariot of Israel, and the horsemen thereof. And he saw him no more: and he took hold of his own clothes, and rent them in two pieces.

Matthew 11:

15. And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
16. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
17. But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows,
18. And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.

Matthew 27:

50. Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
52. And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53. And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Luke 12:

35. Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning;
36. And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.
37. Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them.
38. And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants.
39. And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through.
40. Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.
41. Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all?
42. And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season?
43. Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
44. Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath.
45. But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken;
46. The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.
47. And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
48. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

[Angelino97]

Scott Hahn is one of the editors of the Ignatius Catholic Study Bible, my favorite study Bible, from which I read every day.

[ealgeone]

I’ve read his book on Mary. So many errors.

[ealgeone]

You’ve quoted several passages yet none support your positions.

[one guy in new jersey]

It’s at least fair to ask: Where is Cardinal Burke coming from here? What is he saying, what is he implying?

Catholics understand the Blessed Virgin Mary as the Co-redemptrix, and as the Mediatrix of all heavenly graces. Her every painful trial, in terms of positive injuries to her blessed soul, and to her immaculate heart, came to an end with the gruesome death and final piercing of her only child and holy savior on the cross at Calvary, leaving only the quiet pain of waiting with other mourners through Holy Saturday, knowing that she would be first to see Him again in his resurrected glory (this pursuant to pious belief down through the ages) on the third day.

Cardinal Burke thus observed that Mary, with her infused knowledge, and having long pondered Simeon’s prophesy (your own heart a sword shall Pierce) knew that all was consummated...and was able to say the same, in unison with her Son, whether or not she actually said it. Holy scripture of course being perfectly silent on this point (as you have rightly stated) .

Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant whose fiat, freely and humbly given, ensured our subsequent salvation, and saw her become the font through which would flow all heavenly graces. Catholics know she is now Queen Mother of heaven. Cardinal Burke’s remarks recalling as they do her infused knowledge over a lifetime of piety and sinlessness, as well as her inherent dignity as the Mother of God, are therefore well within the bounds of ages-old Catholic tradition.

[af_vet_1981]

You’ve quoted several passages yet none support your positions.

That is what some other religious said about Jesus, and they were sure they were correct too.

John 7:

40. Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
41. Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
42. Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
43. So there was a division among the people because of him.
44. And some of them would have taken him; but no man laid hands on him.
45. Then came the officers to the chief priests and Pharisees; and they said unto them, Why have ye not brought him?
46. The officers answered, Never man spake like this man.
47. Then answered them the Pharisees, Are ye also deceived?
48. Have any of the rulers or of the Pharisees believed on him?
49. But this people who knoweth not the law are cursed.
50. Nicodemus saith unto them, (he that came to Jesus by night, being one of them,)
51. Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?
52. They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
53. And every man went unto his own house.

[metmom]

What a joke.

Most Catholics aren’t even Catholics enough for you. From everything I’ve seen you post and how you treat your fellow Catholics, your church has a very limited membership.

One.

[metmom]

I haven’t seen one ex-Catholic that is now a God-fearing protestant.

You'll never see what you don't want to even when it's staring you in the face.

They all claim they’re already saved and have absolutely no fear of their Final Judgement by God. They have already judged themselves as saved, with no temporal punishment.

The born again/born from above believer has already been judged.

John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

...and thus has no reason to fear the Final Judgment.

Romans 8:15 For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!”

[metmom]

Not a single one of those verses demonstrates ANY of the claims Catholicism makes about Mary.

She’s not mentioned ONCE in any of those passages.

Luke 12 has nothing to do with the subject at all.

[metmom]

That’s a whole lot of titles and conjectures about Mary that cannot be supported from Scripture.

And apparently you know that because all you’re doing is quoting a Catholic theologian and Catholic tradition.

And Mary, mother of Jesus was not listed in any of the gospels as among the first to see the risen Jesus. It was Mary Magdalene who had that privilege and she is mentioned by name in the gospels of Matthew, Mark, and John. It’s implied in Luke that Mary Magdalene was among the first to see Him.

In none of the gospels is there any mention of Mary, the mother of Jesus after the crucifixion.

[Hieronymus]

When the document does come out, please make the discussion caucus.

I only same this thread just now, and while I see that the FR sniping on non-Caucus threads is still fairly robust, the quality of the sniping and counter-sniping has declined over the years.

MeganC—there are ample examples of “private” apparitions and revelation in the Bible, so to call them non-Biblical is an error that could be refuted in an interesting thread. Unfortunately, most of my co-religionists are incapable of doing so. I should know—I’ve been teaching Scripture to Catholics for two decades. I just finished off a course on St. Paul, and my start students were converts. One raised Baptist and one raised Quebecois.

There used to be Freepers who would engage intelligently on these sorts of subjects, but with some of the Jack Chick types there isn’t much of a point other than educating others. If the idiotic posts are overwhelming in number and aren’t event all that witty engaging in dialogue with an edge becomes rather unrewarding—and pointless as well because no one is likely to follow the dialogue.

Perhaps because this thread is now stale there may be a point in addressing the Biblical examples of private revelation and the problems they pose. I’d probably begin with Samuel to Saul, but there are other examples.

[Hieronymus]

Catholics, officially, believe Scripture is inerrant. Communicators, not communications, are the subject of infallibility; communications, not communicators, are inerrant.

Still, that is not your point.

The Hebrew concept of faith/belief is broader than the Greek concept of faith. James gets into this with demons.

The Hebrew root is the one from which “Amen” is derived.

It the Greek term used in a Hebrew milieu might be better now translated as “living faith.” I prefer “Amening” because it gets the point across.

[Hieronymus]

You are probably more deserving of the title “Defender of the Faith than King Charles, but Roma locuta, causa finita est.

Glad to see Pope Francis’ great defender (I still fondly recall a discussion on recycling where you showed your true colours) is still around.

If King Charles still lays claim to the title of “Defender of the Faith’ (although I understand that he would like Francis or Parliament rather than His Royal Self to change it to “Defender of the Faiths”), I see no reason why you cannot lay claim to the titles “Defender of the Pope” and “Defender of Dialogue”

[Hieronymus]

He is a successful popularizer. That said, there is a spectrum of acceptable positions on Scripture within Catholicism, and while I cannot label him a heretic, I would agree with you that at times his manner of handling the Word can leave something to be desired?

Have you read any of John Bergsma? He, not Hahn, would be my nominee for best Scripture scholar at Franciscan.

[ZULU]

NOTHING The Communisy Pope says is worth reading. Yesterday Greg Kelly on his radio show saud Berglio was dancing on a stage with Drag Queens!!!

[one guy in new jersey]

That’s some pretty good 2D accounting right there, MM.

Immaculate, you might say.

We who live in three dimensions could use a gal like you.