Posted on 07/21/2021 4:40:51 PM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal
So what is the Gospel that both Peter and Paul preached? Did Peter preach the same gospel that Paul preached when Christ told him and the 11 in MMLJ to “Go ye and preach the Gospel”? Did Peter preach the same gospel on the day of Pentecost as Paul was given?
Your post79. I don’t think you do know what I’m getting at. Please tell me
Staying in God’s Word. Staying sober and vigilant. Telling people the truth and believing the truth.
We are to be prepared to tell people the GOOD NEWS of the gospel and the time that’s coming is prime time for those who believe.
sounds very sci fi ish and convoluted. we should not complicate the Word of God; nor add anything or take anything away from it.
So can you lose your salvation if you don’t stay on God’s word, stay sober and vigilant? And what is the truth you believe and tell people? I would like to know
Did Peter preach the same gospel on the day of Pentecost as Paul was given?
>Not sure what you are getting at, but it appears to me it must have been very hard for the eleven apostles, all of them Jews, to attain to the level of revelation that Paul had came to (the hard way) - which we see in everything he wrote.
I.e., a new covenant universal elect people of God by grace of every nation, kindred, tongue, Jew and Gentile - as opposed to a tribal (racial) elect old covenant national people of God by the works of the law...and Christ.
Did the apostles see all this at Pentecost? you would think so, as the great commission was commanded them before Pentecost to go to every nation.
But it took the call of Paul and his revelation, to bring this to a head at the Jerusalem council, and get them all believing the universality of the gospel as Paul saw it, that they were all originally commanded.
I believe in progressive revelation. God progressively revealed the fullness of the universal gospel to the apostles. We have God to thank on this, he’s the one that knocked Saul off his horse to get him to “see the light.”
On that line of thought, All these pretribs will eventually see the light. Even if takes the mark of the beast to get it done. Progressive revelation.
We are not appointed to GOD’S wrath which comes at the end, upon Christ’s return.
What I’m attempting to show you, straight from God’s word and not the writings, doctrines and traditions of men is the very epitome of 2Tim.2:15.
The Gospel that was given to Peter and the 11:
Luke 18:31-34.
“Then He took unto Him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.
“For He shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitef ully entreated on ntreated, and spitted on:
“And they shall scourge Him and put Him to death: and the third day He shall rise again.
“And the understood NONE of these things: and this saying was HID from them, Neither KNEW they the things which were spoken.”
The apostles had been preaching “the Gospel” for two years or more, yet they did NOT have the slightest idea what the Lord was talking about when He predicted His death. So what gospel were they preaching?
Matt. 9:35, Luke 9:2
The Gospel of the Kingdom
Which is not the same Gospel that Paul preached. He preached the Gospel of the Grace of God. Acts 20:24.The preaching of the cross.1Cor.1:18.
Please tell me how those Gospels are the same when the twelve didn’t even understand His death, burial and resurrection resurrection, while Paul preached the Gospel of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ for you salvation.
I am not SDA but listen to a few who are and they are quite Biblical in their positions. JW’s and Mormons are cults (as is catholicism) but if you read/watch any SDA presentation they are Biblical
The LAST Trump, isn’t that the 7th? Clearly, this is when Jesus returns. Not the third coming.
Please tell me how those Gospels are the same when the twelve didn’t even understand His death, burial and resurrection resurrection, while Paul preached the Gospel of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ for you salvation.
Acts 2 shows that Peter knew about Psalm 16.
The Psalm that talks about His Body not seeing Corruption.
Peter spoke of His death and burial and resurrection in the same year of His death, burial and resurrection.
Before Paul..
At Pentecost..
What one should sorry about is why today’s church doesn’t have the same chief importance of the gospel as Paul and the first disciples..
Almost like a completely different Jesus is being proclaimed today that Peter and Paul didn’t encounter.
Have you actually read the Bible? Have you read Daniel chapter five? The Bible is full of supernatural accounts, which if you comprehend the hyper-dimensional reality of the Universe God has Created are not super natural, they are natural given more spacetime coordinates.
Um, still going in pre-wrath circles eh ... what happens with the Lamb opening the first seal? How many die in the first four seals opened? Looks like the wrath of the Lamb to me! The wrath poured out in increasing severety upon the unbelievers. And don’t forget tht a huge number of humans are saved DURING the tribulation. God doesn’t want any to perish but those who reject His grace do perish.
We will explain it to you on the way up ...
Just what did Peter know about His death, burial and resurrection? Please show me one scripture in Acts 2 wherein Peter preached the Good News that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again the 3rd day for our salvation. That we are saved by grace through faith, not of works, that there is neither Jew nor Greek now, These are the Gospel of the Grace of of God.
When Peter stood up and gave his great sermon in Acts 2 he wasn’t giving good ridings of great joy to those Jews gathered for Pentecost.Read it carefully.
He began his sermon telling them that they were in the last days that Joel prophesied about. And the Holy Spirit being poured out on them to prepare them to go through the wrath that was about to come. And the imminent return of The Messiah, Jesus Christ, who he flat out accused them of murdering. What kind of Gospel of the Grace of God is this?
When they cried out what could they do he told them 2 things they could do for the remission of their sins: repent and water baptism.
Repent of what? Of everything his sermon lated on their guilty shoulders.
Why would he tell them to repent and be baptized for their remission of sins if he knew that the death, burial and resurrection of Christ was for their remission of their sins.
Paul wrote in 1Tim.1:16 that in him first he had shown all long-suffering to and mercy, for me a PATTERN for them which should HEREAFTER believe on Him to life everlasting. “HEREAFTER” what? HEREAFTER Paul. He was given the Gospel of the Grace of God to preach to both Gentiles and believing Jews. That’s what the Gospel of the Grace of God is about, a Body of believers. With a heavenly inheritance.
Peter and the eleven were given the Gospel of the Kingdom to preach, which they fulfilled until Israel was blinded and set aside at the end of Acts. They will once again take their place of prominence when God restores their sight and begins dealing with them as a nation again. That’s what the Tribulation is about. That is what the Gospel of the Kingdom is about. A Kingdom of believers. With an earthly inheritance.
If Paul was given the Gospel of the Grace of God to preach directly from Christ, and he wasn’t saved until Acts 9 how could Peter possibly have preached about it? Read Acts 2 and see that not once does Peter speak of the Cross as good news.
I have a hard time labelling "Pre-wrath Theory" a heresy, much less a damnable one. There are mysteries in God's word that are not fully explained and should not be cause for disfellowshipping others who may not see everything the same way as we do. On the other hand, there are major tenets of the Christian faith that are not disputable but absolute of which we must be firm and steadfast defending and upholding the truth that was once for all delivered unto the saints.
I fully believe in the pre-tribulation Rapture of believers and have no problem saying why I do. And if someone disagrees, then as long as they are of the redeemed in Christ, they will not be left behind when it does happen. Faith in Jesus Christ is the prerequisite, not faith in the Rapture.
Acts 2:21-41
Maybe what you see as a gospel of grace is really disguised as a gospel that doesn’t include repentance. A sort of license to sin.
Just note, the Apostle Paul and the church do not share the same Jesus and gospel..
That’s not Peters problem.
Nor is that Paul’s problem.
That’s the Church riding a Beast problem.
Now that’s a gospel of Grace.
That a church can ride the Beast and still not end up in a lake of fire.
Amazing Grace indeed..
You should re-read Revelation and understand that the Tribulation IS God's wrath upon the ungodly, unbelieving world. It is not Satan via the Antichrist who pours out the judgments and calamities upon the world during this time. I don't disagree that during the later part of first three and a half years there will be new believers who will suffer persecution and martyrdom for not taking the mark of the beast and especially those who are Jewish believers in Jesus Christ as their Messiah after the preaching of the 144,000. But this is called "the time of Jacob's trouble" for a reason.
You earlier said you thought the Millennium (Christ's 1000 year reign on earth) happens after God creates a new heaven and new earth after destroying this one but that's backward. The millennium on THIS earth happens first and at the end of that, God creates a new heaven and new earth where righteousness dwells (see Revelation 21:1 and 2 Peter 3:13).
Nah, not interested. Have already had several debates with others who hold to your belief and frankly am not impressed when traditions of men are used with the same authority as scripture, which they’re not. So we’ll just leave it that we disagree.
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