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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

I am only one Catholic woman and I do not speak for anyone but myself. As a devout traditional practicing Catholic I would prefer a conservative parish, however I would travel a very very long way indeed to worship and receive the body and blood of Jesus. He is still there, even at a liberal parish.


6 posted on 01/13/2020 8:15:42 PM PST by longfellowsmuse (last of the living nomads)
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To: longfellowsmuse

I think that’s the problem with churches in general, taking God out and replacing it with religion of politics. My former pastor (female) was a good preacher until Trump got elected. Every sermon was like listening to MSNBC.Was about to quit, when she decided to retire. Now have a pastor from Uganda who actually preaches just the word of the Lord. Like breathing fresh air now!


8 posted on 01/13/2020 8:42:13 PM PST by Bommer (2020 - Vote all incumbent congressmen and senators out! VOTE THE BUMS OUT!!!)
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To: longfellowsmuse
I am only one Catholic woman and I do not speak for anyone but myself. As a devout traditional practicing Catholic I would prefer a conservative parish, however I would travel a very very long way indeed to worship and receive the body and blood of Jesus. He is still there, even at a liberal parish.

Actually while I believe the Catholic contrivance of the Lord's supper to be erroneous, in RC teaching although the character of the minister does not invalidate a sacrament (contra Donatism), yet as stated in the Roman Catholic teaching below the validity of the Eucharist, (and sacraments in general) requires the intention of the priest to do what the church does. But which proper intention may be doubtful in the case of liberal priests (only about half of Catholics polled affirm the Catholic "Real Presence)" though (according RC teaching) proper intention is to be presumed unless there is serious ground for doubting that.

Council of Trent: If anyone says that in ministers, when they effect and confer the sacraments, there is not required at least the intention of doing what the Church does,[6] let him be anathema.” (Session VII, Canon 11; http://www.ewtn.com/library/councils/trent7.htm).

DE DEFECTIBUS, Papal Bull decreed by Pope Saint Pius V in ratifying the Council of Trent I - Defects of the Missing 1. The priest who is to celebrate Mass should take every precaution to make sure that none of the things required for celebrating the Sacrament of the Eucharist is missing. A defect may occur with regard to the matter to be consecrated, with regard to the form to be observed and with regard to the consecrating minister. There is no Sacrament if any of these is missing: the proper matter, the form, including the intention, and the priestly ordination of the celebrant.

VII - Defect of intention 23. The intention of consecrating is required. Therefore there is no consecration in the following cases: when a priest does not intend to consecrate but only to make a pretense;.. (http://www.dailycatholic.org/defectib.htm)

The Catholic Encyclopedia>intention: The Church teaches very unequivocally that for the valid conferring of the sacraments, the minister must have the intention of doing at least what the Church does. ..The common doctrine now is that a real internal intention to act as a minister of Christ, or to do what Christ instituted the sacraments to effect, in other words, to truly baptize, absolve, etc., is required. (www.newadvent.org/cathen/08069b.htm)

Catholic Encyclopedia>Sacraments:“To be a minister of the sacraments under and with Christ, a man must act as a man, i.e. as a rational being; hence it is absolutely necessary that he have the intention of doing what the Church does. - www.newadvent.org/cathen/13295a.htm

PONTIFICIUM CONSILIUM: Sufficient intention in a minister who baptizes is to be presumed, unless there is serious ground for doubting that the minister intended to do what the Church does. (www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/general-docs/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_19930325_directory_en.html)

10 posted on 01/14/2020 3:00:44 AM PST by daniel1212 ( Trust the risen Lord Jesus to save you as a damned and destitute sinner + be baptized + follow Him)
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To: longfellowsmuse
He is still there, even at a liberal parish.

Then an awful lot of FR Catholics ought to apologize to the pope!

13 posted on 01/14/2020 4:00:06 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: longfellowsmuse

Quite true. The Divine Liturgy (the mass) is the Repentence, the Liturgy of the Word and the Liturgy of the Eucharist.

The High Priest at each mass is present in the Host - that is Jesus Christ.

His ministrants are flawed humans, like us all. Whether he can preach or not, whatever he is, the priest is ultimately the assistant.

The Key focus is Jesus Christ, who is present there, at each mass.


21 posted on 01/14/2020 5:46:16 AM PST by Cronos (Re-elect President Trump 2020!)
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To: longfellowsmuse

As an aside - I’ve found it amazing how the mass parallels the structure of the book of the Apocalypse of St John:

The book of the Apocalypse has the Penitence - chapters 2 and 3, the Gloria, the Alleluia, the Holy, Holy, Holy, the readings, the Eucharist (rev 12-22) where the Church is united to Christ.

And of course, it all starts with St. John talking of their gathering on the Lord’s Day


22 posted on 01/14/2020 5:50:24 AM PST by Cronos (Re-elect President Trump 2020!)
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