The Book of Revelation was Written Before AD 70

HubPages.com ^ | 11 February 2017 | searchinsany

[searchinsany]

John received the Revelation prior to AD 70, to encourage and prepare the Church for the events leading to the vision's imminent fulfillment. I believe therefore, Christ's second coming described in the Revelation took place during the ‘great and the dreadful day of the Lord’ in AD 70. On that 'day' of judgement, Old Covenant Israel ended with the destruction of the temple and Jerusalem; the remaining survivors of the Jewish nation were enslaved and dispersed throughout the Roman Empire. Futurists, Dispensationalism in particular, adamantly oppose this view by insisting on a post-AD 70 date, in an attempt to refute Preterism. However, the AD 95 date is heavily dependent on the writings of certain Church Fathers, primarily a 2nd century quotation taken from the writing of Irenaeus, found in the works of Eusebius, Book 5, and Chapter 8.

[Boogieman]

If you have been fully restored, then your body won’t die, because it would be imperishable (1 Cor 15:42, 1 Cor 15:52). Do you think that is true?

[impactplayer]

I believe that those Baptized in Christ will never taste death - they died to sin in Baptism, never to die again. They will be transitioned into Heaven. And their body will be a heavenly body, indestructible. However, those not saved will die at death, and face a second death at their judgement. This really is the deal of the century! Nothing to lose and everything to gain.

I believe we have lost the power of the Protestant Reformation. Luther was ecstatic when he discovered that we cannot “earn” our way to heaven - nor do we need to. Jesus paid the price for us. He said, “I have come that you may have life, and have it in abundance.” (John 10:10)

So we are no longer to live in grief over past sins, or fear of current sins, but in the abundance of Jesus’ Grace. It really is far more than we deserve or could ever do for ourselves - but there it is - and Luther re-discovered it after years of lost celebration, and I fear we are in danger of losing it again. Celebrate Life In Christ! Free of guild or shame. He loves YOU!! Just as you are.

[WalterSkinner]

..I’m dispensational as far as eschatology is concerned. It has the fewest issues IMHO...

[af_vet_1981]

Not only that, but the author/OP wrote this:

I believe therefore, Christ's second coming described in the Revelation took place during the ‘great and the dreadful day of the Lord’ in AD 70.

The error is doubled with a denial of a physical resurrection here: Since Christians have continued to physically die over the past 2000 years, it is obvious, Christ's commission was resurrection from 'spiritual death’ not physical death.

Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers. Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness. And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work. Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart. But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes. And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

Second Timothy, Catholic chapter two, Protestant verses fourteen to twenty six ,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

As the Creed infallibly teaches, the Second Coming is associated with the end of the world and the Last Judgement. Therefore, it is NOT associated with any earlier time

In matters such as this, the one holy catholic apostolic church is a witness that this did not occur as the OP/author claim.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

The author believes a lot of heresy - taking away the message of the Gospel.

[Boogieman]

Alright, I don’t think I disagree with anything you said there. I do think though, that though we may be saved, we won’t be fully perfected and glorified until we are resurrected. Even those of us saved are still suffering from effects of the curse of sin while we are here on earth. We are still tempted, our bodies still break down, and we can still err, though I believe God will keep us from erring to the point of our destruction.

[Boogieman]

I can’t really say I subscribe to any “ism” completely. Each one I’ve looked at has things that don’t seem to line up fully with Scripture. I think ultimately all of man’s efforts will fall short of full understanding, but eventually God will reveal it all to us.

[af_vet_1981]

The author believes a lot of heresy - taking away the message of the Gospel.

The heresy is a consequence of letting every man decide for himself what he thinks the Bible means and try to teach it to others (in this case he teaches the Second Coming of the LORD Jesus Christ occurred in 70 AD and there is no physical resurrection at all).

This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare; Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck: Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

First Timothy, Catholic chapter one, Protestant verses eighteen to twenty,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

[aMorePerfectUnion]

“The heresy is a consequence of letting every man decide for himself what he thinks the Bible means and try to teach it to others “

I know, I know. Those Catholic Bishops ought to be reigned in somehow.

And don’t even get me started on that Pope!

Or the Gay Vatican Mafia.

Or the hundreds of millions of Buffet Catholics who are their own Biblical authority, deciding what is true for themselves and skipping the other menu items.

And so it goes. At least it’s nice to agree for a change!

[af_vet_1981]

And so it goes. At least it’s nice to agree for a change!

It is like this:

And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs. And they talked together of all these things which had happened. And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. But their eyes were holden that they should not know him. And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad? And the one of them, whose name was Cleopas, answering said unto him, Art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which are come to pass there in these days? And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people: And how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death, and have crucified him. But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the third day since these things were done. Yea, and certain women also of our company made us astonished, which were early at the sepulchre; And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive. And certain of them which were with us went to the sepulchre, and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not. Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself. And they drew nigh unto the village, whither they went: and he made as though he would have gone further. But they constrained him, saying, Abide with us: for it is toward evening, and the day is far spent. And he went in to tarry with them. And it came to pass, as he sat at meat with them, he took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them. And their eyes were opened, and they knew him; and he vanished out of their sight. And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures? And they rose up the same hour, and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven gathered together, and them that were with them, Saying, The Lord is risen indeed, and hath appeared to Simon. And they told what things were done in the way, and how he was known of them in breaking of bread. And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet. And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And he took it, and did eat before them. And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

Luke, Catholic chapter twenty four, Protestant verses thirteen to forty five,,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

[impactplayer]

I agree - we will not be glorified on earth - but we have been perfect in Christ. When the Father looks upon us, He sees the perfection of Jesus. Living into that perfection is our calling, but as we do this we are seen as truly perfected! Religion tries to put obligations on and duties on us that we are not designed to carry. All of the work has been done for us - all that is left for us is faithfulness to this completed work and living a life of Love - for God and for man. But live it in Joy - this is why He came.

Alleluia!!

[JockoManning]

No way could I nor could Arlin have wrapped his Bible or true logic around such an absurd notion. Shocking.

[JockoManning]

Rediculous assertion not supported by historians or science

—nor by the Bible or logic.

[af_vet_1981]

The next problem with the author/op's choice of an early date for the the Book of Revelation is still in the first Catholic chapter. The book is addressed to the seven catholic churches in Asia, members of the one holy catholic church mentioned in the Book of Acts. If the churches throughout all Judaea, Galilee and Samaria had been caught up in the first Roman war against the Jews (remember there were two in the holy land and a third in the Diaspora) and fled, then addressing these seven churches in Asia Minor some twenty five years later makes sense. If the churches of the one holy catholic apostolic church were still extant in the land of Israel, where they began and in communion with any remaining apostles or those eligible to be apostles, then the seven seem out of place with do not make sense with the rest of the Book. Twenty five years after the war, with the Apostle John on the island of Patmos and the brethren dispersed, it makes sense to address these churches.

Then had the churches rest throughout all Judaea and Galilee and Samaria, and were edified; and walking in the fear of the Lord, and in the comfort of the Holy Ghost, were multiplied.


Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

Acts, Catholic chapter nine, Protestant verse thirty one,

Revelation, Catholic chapter one, Protestant verse eleven,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

[free_life]

Robinson’s preterist view was not just held by him, there were many many others.

Luther, Knox, Calvin, the theologians in the 1600’s & 1700’s

********!*!***************************************************

Oh no they didn’t!

What is with this hersey invasion at FR lately?

[WildHighlander57]

To clarify:

Luther, Knox, Calvin, the theologians in the 1600’s & 1700’s would fit partial preterist view as opposed to full preterist:

http://www.theopedia.com/preterism

[af_vet_1981]

The author/OP is teaching a HyperPreterist position (heresy)
1. falsely stating the Second Coming of the LORD Jesus Christ already occurred in 70AD, and
2. denying there is a physical resurrection associated with the Second Coming.
3. How could anyone lend support to such heresy ?

[WildHighlander57]

http://www.theopedia.com/preterism

See partial preterism.

I was making the distinction between end times/dispensational and what Protestant 1600/1700 taught.

I don’t agree with hyper preterism.

Jesus’ second coming is at judgement day & there’s a resurrection of the just & the unjust.

Look at the Westminster confession written in the 1600s; it says this, but doesn’t go into Daniel’s 70 weeks etc.

[af_vet_1981]

See partial preterism.

The posted thread is an assertion of HyperPreterism by the OP. You cannot change the subject and make it about partial preterism.

[WildHighlander57]

Af_vet_79, all y'all Apologies for doing so. af_vet_1981 wrote: " <> The posted thread is an assertion of HyperPreterism by the OP. You cannot change the subject and make it about partial preterism. "