Posted on 02/17/2016 6:03:07 AM PST by NRx
There have been thousands of words written about Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia, who died on Feb. 13. Most describe his political and legal views, which were very conservative. But I have read very little about his religious beliefs. And they were easily as conservative as his legal views.
Scalia was a Roman Catholic, one of six on the Supreme Court. But Scalia was a very traditional Roman Catholic. He was not comfortable with the changes brought about by the Second Vatican Council. He was so traditional that, in fact, he searched out and attended a Tridentine Mass in Latin when he lived in Chicago, and later in Washington, D.C. Reportedly, he travelled to St. Catherine of Siena church in Great Falls, Va., to attend a Latin Mass -- a distance from Washington, D.C.
And of course, he was married with nine children. "Being a devout Catholic means you have children when God gives them to you," he told his biographer, Joan Biskupic. One of his sons, Paul, entered the priesthood.
Maybe you don't hang out with the right ones.
Inappropriate, even if you forgot the sarcasm tag.
Please look elsewhere.
Now comes the practical application of the maxim, “one man in the right place at the right time can make all the difference in the winning of a battle or the saving of a nation.
I hope the Requiem Mass will be televised. The world could see a beautiful rite celebrated, as opposed to the prevalence of the modernist hoe-down style funerals performed in so many places.
“Also, though, I wonder if the article’s author knows that a Mass said in Latin is not necessarily a Tridentine Mass. I haven’t yet attended a “Latin” Mass that wasn’t a simple Latin translation of the post-Vat II Mass.”
The original post Vatican II Mass, i.e., the source document, is in Latin. Any vernacular versions are translations of the official Latin; thus, the recent re-translation is an attempt to be more faithful to the Latin of the original Novus Ordo Mass, e.g.,”...and with your spirit...” as opposed to “... and also with you ...”
Interestingly, when you read the rubrics (such as they are) of the original post Vatican II Mass, it is clear that those who wrote the Mass expected the priest to continue to celebrate the Mass with his back to the people (this is deduced from the “stage directions” instructing the priest to turn to the people to give a blessing, for example).
It is also fairly easy to convert the altars used for the Novus Ordo Mass to the “ad orientem” configuration with priest and people facing the same direction. This is done routinely in my area, in a very modern “theater in the round” abomination of a church.
If you haven’t been able to find a real Traditional Latin Mass in your area, please email me backchannel, and I will try to help you find one. There is even a “TLM Finder” app that I have on my iPhone that I use when I am travelling.
It is my hope that Mr. Scalia’s funeral mass is a proper Tridentine Requiem Mass.
BTW, my usual church on Sunday celebrates the "Novus Ordo" ... ad orientem, with lots of incense, a communion rail, and at least the ordinary sung in Latin. :-)
What an absolutely beautiful space.
Sadly, according to some freepers, that mere fact alone means that Scalia "wasn't a Christian".
According to them, the only people who "count" as "Christians" are those "who can tell you the exact moment they were saved". Someone like Scalia, who was baptized as a baby, would be exempt from their definition of "Christian". It doesn't matter how pious Scalia was in his life, the fact he fervently prayed to Christ before every Supreme Court session, or worshiped daily at church each morning using traditional latin language prayers, or even that he raised his nine children as Christians and inspired his son, Rev. Paul Scalia, to become an ordained minister. Scalia wouldn't be able to name the "exact day" he went to a tent revival meeting and "accepted Christ" and got "saved" (because such an event never happened in his life), so therefore he "never became a Christian", according to them.
Not only would EVERY single Catholic in the world be excluded from being recognized as "Christian" under this definition, but so would every single Orthodox Christian, and a huge amount of protestant Christians who practice infant baptism (Lutherans, Methodists, Anglicans, Presbyterians, etc.) Not only was Scalia "not a Christian", neither was his fellow justice William H. Rehnquist (as a Lutheran, he was baptized as a baby), or Justices Alito and Thomas. Nor was George Washington, Ronald Reagan, etc. Famous figures who devoted their lives to Christ, like Joan of Arc and Mother Teresa, would likewise be labeled "non-Christians" since they had accepted Christ since they were old enough to understand the concept, and thus, wouldn't be able to tell you "the exact moment they got saved"
Ironically, the Catholic sacrament of Confirmation means that every single practicing Catholic would be able to cite their confirmation as an exact time where they made a public, voluntarily profession in front of a community of fellow believers that they accepted Christ and would live their adult lives as a Christian. But this doesn't "count" towards "becoming a Christian" in the eyes of those naysayers, since confirmed Catholics like Scalia don't cite their confirmation as the moment they got "saved". They believe salvation is a lifelong process, not an instant moment in time.
I'd hope the life of people like Justice Scalia might cause people to rethink their narrow definition of "Christian" so they don't exclude 90% of their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, and see them as "non-Christians". Unfortunately, I don't think reflecting on Scalia's faith will cause them to rethink their worldview.
I was baptized as an infant (Catholic). Was confirm at about 10 years old. Can’t remember the exact age, but all it amounted to was memorizing answers to questions the bishop might ask us. I didn’t become regenerated by the Holy Spirit in my late 30’s. About 15 years after I escaped from Catholicism.
I'd like to know who these "some" Freeper are who would assert that. It's usually some FRoman Catholics who insist that anyone who isn't a Catholic cannot be a Christian.
I have a deep respect and appreciation for Justice Scalia and his death is a tragedy for ALL Conservatives especially at this time. Would that the other five Catholic justices had his same convictions.
Two of the ones I pinged in my original comment on this thread. Both were on a Ted Cruz thread asserting that Ted Cruz's family didn't "become" Christian until they switched to Southern Baptist. Being baptized in another Christian denomination didn't count, according to them.
As a lifelong Catholic, Scalia never claimed to have an "exact moment" when he was "saved", therefore, by their own definition, he was "not a Christian"
Wonderful man and a REAL Catholic!
I’m not questioning your honesty but in my ten years here I can’t recall a single time I’ve read such a statement. Are you sure you understood their point? We are discouraged from dragging arguments across threads but I can tell you that someone’s salvation is based upon their faith in Jesus Christ and not on which church they belong to. Only God sees the hearts of men and knows if faith is genuine. It’s not for me or you to proclaim who is or isn’t a Christian. I was born and raised a Catholic but didn’t become a real Christian until I was sixteen and heard the gospel in a Southern Baptist Church Sunday school. Jesus said we can know others by their fruit. Scalia bore good fruit by his life, words and actions. I have no doubt he was a Christian - Catholic or not - and that he is rejoicing in the presence of our Savior.
Catholics are saved at the moment of their Baptism. The Sacrament takes away all sin.
Disagree, I've seen numerous freepers argue flat out that "Catholics aren't Christians". It got so bad that Jim Robinson had to start a thread warning the anti-Catholic FReepers to stop post anti-Catholic threads or get banned. This is NOT to say that a majority of this forum or even a significant minority holds those views, or even that its a common viewpoint in protestant circles. Most of the protestants I've met have no problem accepting non-Protestants and non-evangelicals as Christians. Nevertheless, there is a small but vocal group of fundamentalists who believe the ONLY people who "count" as Christians are those who joined some evangelical protestant church in the bible belt.
I've actually never met a single Catholic claim that you're not "Christian" unless you join the Catholic Church. I recall when Pope Benedict XVI made the statement that protestant churches can't properly be called churches because they don't have apostolic succession, and some protestants went ballistic here and claim the Pope stated that protestants aren't Christians. He made so such claim that the individual members of those churches aren't Christians. He simply made the argument that they belonged to new ecclesiastical communities rather than the historic original Christian church.
>> Are you sure you understood their point? <<
The poster on the Cruz thread didn't flat out state that Catholics aren't Christian, but the argument that you CANNOT be Christian UNLESS you are able to "recall the exact moment you were saved" would automatically exclude all Catholics, all eastern Orthodox Christians, as well as numerous major protestant churches.
If he had made the point that Ted Cruz's dad wasn't a PRACTICING Christian until he joined a protestant church, then it could have been a valid point. But that doesn't mean the Cruz family "wasn't Christian" unless they joined the Southern Baptist Church. If I buy a car, leave it in the garage, and never drive it, it doesn't mean that my car doesn't exist, it means its not being used. If you're baptized into another church and pledge to live a Christian life, but DON'T, then you'll just failing to exercise the grace that got gave you when you entered that faith -- not that you "never" became a Christian in the first place.
Miley Cyrus can "name the exact moment she was saved", since she was baptized at age 13 in a fundamentalist protestant church. But she no more PRACTICES her faith than lapsed Catholics do. This doesn't mean I should deny that her baptism ever happened, isn't valid in the eyes of God, or that she's "not Christian" unless she joins the Catholic Church. She's perfectly capable of exercising her faith if she chooses to do so.
>> Only God sees the hearts of men and knows if faith is genuine. It’s not for me or you to proclaim who is or isn’t a Christian. <<
Again, you're not distinguishing between whether someone BECOMES a Christian and whether someone chooses to PRACTICE their faith.
I can certainly proclaim who is a Christian and who isn't, based on what religion they join. Catholics are Christian, Baptists are Christian, Greek Orthodox are Christians. Muslims AREN'T Christian, nor are Jews or Mormons.
Whether they are good people, actually PRACTICE their faith, and whether they are "saved" and will go to heaven isn't for me to say. God will judge their heart. I simply evaluate whether the church they belong to is Christian based on what it professes.
>> Jesus said we can know others by their fruit. Scalia bore good fruit by his life, words and actions. I have no doubt he was a Christian - Catholic or not - and that he is rejoicing in the presence of our Savior. <<
Agreed 100%. It would be nice if the people claiming you're not Christian unless you can "remember the exact moment you were saved" would acknowledge that. Not only do they deny that Ted Cruz's relatives are Christians, they would deny George Washington and Ronald Reagan were Christian, simply because those individuals couldn't tell you about the moment they were "saved".
That's not right and that definition of "Christian" excludes about 90% of their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. Citing Scalia's life was simply a way to prove their defition is flawed.
I hope it will be televised. It may be on EWTN.
Obama will not attend...Thank God! I would not like to see that beautiful structure collapse upon the appearance of the Son of Satan.
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