Posted on 08/17/2015 6:07:35 PM PDT by NKP_Vet
It is that time of week again, where we talk about the Mary, the Mother of God. This is definitely the single most important title that Mary has. If someone gets this wrong, then they get the Divinity of our Lord wrong, and that means the whole plan of Salvation is just messed up. So let us look at this most important title.
Theotokos, God-bearer in Greek, is what the council of Ephesus declared in 431. It specifically says this “If anyone does not confess that God is truly Emmanuel, and that on this account the Holy Virgin is the Mother of God (for according to the flesh she gave birth to the Word of God become flesh by birth), let him be anathema.” Now just that statement alone proves the early Church believed that there was Authority given to the bishops to decide sound doctrine, Mary was a Holy Virgin her entire life, and that She bore God. However, we only have time for one today.
Now many times we will hear non-Catholics tell us that this title is nowhere found in Scripture, explicitly at least. However, they cannot themselves find a Scripture verse that says that all doctrine and dogma must be explicitly proven in Scripture. I bet they can never find that. This is a trap they set up for themselves and it is a very unfair double standard that they expect us to meet, but they do not have to. However, on top of this double standard is if we used that same standard, then the doctrine of the Trinity is thrown out, since it’s not an explicit teaching, but instead is implicit in Scripture. This double standard seems to cause more problems that it’s worth wouldn’t you say?
Here is the cold hard truth of it though, all Christians rely on some Church Tradition, as well as Scripture, to validate their doctrines, whether they admit it or not. With that being said, Scripture and Tradition can never contradict one another. The Traditions of men can contradict the Word of God, but the Traditions God left us, through Christ, in the Holy Spirit, are binding upon us, as we are to hold fast to Traditions. So then, what is the real question? The real question is, Does Scripture contradict the teaching that Mary is the Mother of God, and is that doctrine found in Scripture at least implicitly?
Let us begin with Luke 1:43, where Mary visited Elizabeth. There Elizabeth exclaimed “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?” Because Mary was the Mother of the Lord, who is the Second part of the Holy Trinity, Mary is truly and rightfully called the Mother of God.
We also see in Isaiah 7:14 “Behold a virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and they shall call His name Emmanuel, which is interpreted God with us.” Jesus is God. He was God when He was in the womb, conceived, lived, died, buried, resurrected, in the Eucharist, and in Heaven. The Messiah, who is God, was to be born of a virgin, according to Scripture. God was born of a virgin, and it’s right there in Isaiah, who prophesied of Christ birth. That means both Old and New Testament support the Catholic Doctrine of the Mother of God.
However, this may not be enough for some non-Catholics. Some say that Elisabeth called Christ Lord, and not God, saying that Mary was only to give birth to the human child, the Lord Jesus Christ. So then the question becomes, does lord here mean divinity or just authority? Let’s look at the context.
First let us look at 1 Cor. 8:5, which states “Indeed there are many gods and many lords, yet to us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.” St. Paul makes it clear that Jesus is the one True, Lord, as opposed to all the false ones, that the pagans who converted in Corinth were probably worshiping. So then, they would understand that Jesus is God. This holds true to the Jews who converted too, who would know Deut. 6:4 “Hear, therefore, o Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord.”
So then that brings us back to Luke 1:43. Elizabeth calls Mary the mother of her Lord. The Mother…Mothers give birth to persons, not natures, let us remember that. Mary did not just give birth to the human nature of Christ, she gave birth to the person of Christ. Christ personhood is Divine, it is God the Son.
Then let us look at 2 Sam. 6:9 where the King, who was David says “How can the ark of the Lord come to me (being the ark of the covenant)” Then in 2 Samuel 616 we see King David leaping in the presence of the Ark, just as John the Baptist did. Then we yet again see another parallel, which says that the ark of the Lord abode in the house of Obededom the Gethite for three months (2 Sam. 6:11), and according to Luke 1:56 Mary remained in the house of Elizabeth about three months. Then, we see that the ark of the covenant carried three items, manna, the Ten Commandments, and Aaron’s rod. These are all types of things Christ are, the Bread of Life, Word made Flesh, and our true High Priest.
Even knowing all this though, there are still those who would deny that Mary is the Mother of God. So then we have to ask, who is Jesus Christ to them? If Mary is not the Mother of God, then who did she give birth to? Many would say it was an earthly human lord, not God. So then, what does that make Christ? If Mary did not give birth to God, then who did she give birth to? Was not Christ God when He was conceived?
If someone says Mary only gave birth to the person of Christ one of two errors, or both could happen, and that is the Denial of the divinity of Christ, and that one would have to say Christ is two distinct persons, and that he is not One. Both were considered heresy in the Early Church. Christ is one Person, with two natures, Divine and Human, which go together and are not separate of one another. If one denies that, the ultimately they are speaking about a different Christ, and St. Paul warns us about that problem, and to not to give heed to them (2 Cor. 11:4).
So then, some say that Mary is the mother of the Trinity if we take it that far, however, this is not true. Mary gave birth to the 2nd part of the Trinity, the 2nd Person, who is still God just not the Trinity. However, we must never forget that each Person in the Trinity shares the same Divine Nature and is fully God.
One thing some still point out is that Christ is eternal, so for Mary to be the Mother of God she would have to be God. However the Church does not say Mary is the source of the Divine Nature of the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity. To better understand this let’s look at humanity. Parents give birth to a person, however they are not the author of life, and certainly did not give the child it’s soul. Thus is true with Mary, she did not give Christ His Divine Nature, though she was the Mother of more than just the human form of Christ, because she gave birth to a person, who was God.
Who cares whether the title is in Scripture or not? The important thing is that the title has a rational justification, based directly on what Scripture tells us about Jesus and Mary.
I have never found “Reformation Sunday” in the New Testament. Yet millions of Christians use the term, and celebrate it!
Are you saying that you don’t believe that Jesus Christ was God? True man and true God at the same time?
Our Deacon in Oklahoma used to say, “If you’re not Marian, you’re probably Arian.” The truths about Mary safeguard the truths about Jesus.
And as Professor Diggory said in the Narnia books, “What do they teach them in these schools?” Not logic ...
I don’t claim to be Orthodox. I am. I don’t have a problem with Mary as the Mother of God, because Jesus is God, and because I know that the term does not imply that she was the source of Jesus’ deity. The term also shows up in passing in some Orthodox liturgical texts. But the preferred title is Theotokos, and I think the term Theotokos (God-bearer) is more precise, and somehow doesn’t set off the same knee-jerk reactons from people who reject any honor to Mary, and who don’t wish to understand why and how the Church’s theology developed. As the poster I replied to says, “Theotokos” says more about Christ than it does about Mary, without diminshing her role in God’s work of salvation. She deserves that recognition. And her inclusion in our theology and devotion also affirms important christological doctrines.
Davidic tradition. The mother of the King is the Queen. The King still rules.
“Who cares whether the title is in Scripture or not?”
Only those who treasure the words of God as truth.
Only those who base theology on Scripture.
“The important thing is that the title has a rational justification, based directly on what Scripture tells us about Jesus and Mary.”
Well, no Arthur.
Why did God leave that title out of Scripture Arthur?
OK. After there is a sudden disappearance of a lot of people sometime between now and September 23, 2017, please realize that you have been following a religion founded in Babylon by Satan to deceive believers. This religion is described in the Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Remember! DO NOT TAKE THE MARK! They will cut your head off, but you will only have to die ONCE. If you take the MARK OF THE BEAST, you will die twice, and the second death is forever.
Acts Chapter 4
8†Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, “Rulers of the people and elders of Israel: 9“If we this day are judged for a good deed done to a helpless man, by what means he has been made well, 10“let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, †that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, †whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole. 11“This is the †‘stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief cornerstone.’ 12†“Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”
Nelson, Thomas (2009-02-18). Holy Bible, New King James Version (NKJV) (p. 1060). Thomas Nelson. Kindle Edition.
Mary the Mother of Tammuz can not save you! Only Jesus Christ (Yeshua HaMashiach) can save you.
“Are you saying that you don’t believe that Jesus Christ was God? True man and true God at the same time?”
Salvation, Christians believe Christ is true man and God both - from the point of His conception onwards. Before that, He was God, but not human.
For this reason, it is true to refer to Mary as “bearing God.”
It is wrong to imply or call her Mother of God.
Best.
To say that “God-bearer” is more precise than “Mother of God” separates gestation/delivery from motherhood. There’s a lot of that going around these days, but rent-a-wombs weren’t a thing back in the day.
To be honest I’ve never heard of that. But with as many feasts catholics have that are not mentioned in the Word or saints that ya’ll celebrate I’m not sure you’re one who should be talking.
**For this reason, it is true to refer to Mary as “bearing God.”
It is wrong to imply or call her Mother of God.**
Are you talking out of both sides of your mouth.
So your don’t believe that Jesus Christ was true God and true man either?
That he never rose from the dead?
I’ll take that as a yes.
Is that what he said? Go back and re-read the post. I understood it just fine. Catholics have this stumbling block on certain passages/truths.
“If you deny that Mary is the Mother of God, then you deny that Jesus is God.”
Amen.
“Are you talking out of both sides of your mouth.”
No dear Salvation. I’m being biblically accurate to avoid theological error.
I would be willing to bet that a Catholic priest has forgotten more about scripture than you will ever know.
““If you deny that Mary is the Mother of God, then you deny that Jesus is God.”
The divinity of Christ is well established in Scripture.
I guess many people are still Catholic Bashing.
Well I try to be a witness. Didn’t realize I was a hostile witness :).
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