Posted on 06/15/2015 2:49:32 AM PDT by Cvengr
“Faith without works is dead. A man is saved by what he does and not by faith alone.”
Poor James, he has so much to offer in his letter but the only thing many remember (and reflexively parrot) is FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD.
Religious flesh loves that, but hates his WHOEVER KEEPS THE WHOLE LAW AND YET STUMBLES AT ONE POINT IS GUILTY OF BREAKING ALL (wherefore they ignore it).
Both are true, but the second clearly shows that the first CANNOT mean what many THINK it means. Stumbling at one point is the fatal flaw in our tragic characters. James is speaking to saved people anyway. He’s provoking them to live out their salvation, not questioning it. IMO.
“Works-based salvation” is assuming that you know the relative “weight” of your good works vs your sins on the Cosmic Scale.
That’s betting eternity on your assumptions.
Worse are the “advocacy-based salvation” “doctrines” that the left espouses. If I “care” enough, I’m a “good person”.
It's God's inerrant Word that says:
" For by grace you have been saved athrough faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them."
Ephesians 2:8-10
Note where it says 'not as a result of works' -- and is that not Catholic dogma that salvation is by faith and works?
In Romans 4 we read:
"4 Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. 5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness,"
So, since all of our works are as "filthy rags" it seems to me that those "wages" and our "due" won't be grace, but what we deserve: death. But, if we believe in Christ, our faith is counted as righteousness.
But, if Paul isn't good enough, how about Christ?:
'He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’ 13 But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”'
Luke 18:9-14
So... all the Pharisee did -- not being like the others and tithing... doing works... got him what? It was the tax collector that went home justified; Christ said justified, not "kinda justified until he does some good works...." He went home justified why? Because he called on God to be merciful and believed.
Seems like scripture trumps dogma.
Hoss
God’s Will Is Our Work
In his article (“Justification Sola Fide: Catholic After All?,” September-October 2009) Christopher Malloy unduly restricts the meaning of the word “work” when he says: “But I might not have opportunity to perform a work, to ‘realize’ this living faith.” Every justified person has the opportunity and the obligation to do good work.
Healed and empowered by God through the sacraments, we do good work when we do what God would have us do. Good work is nothing other than obedience to the will of God. Put another way, if God would not have us do anything other than what we are doing in a particular circumstance, then we are doing good work. In fact, we know from Scripture that good work can be something as simple as peaceful sleep. Jesus said, “My Father is working still, and I am working” (Jn 5:17). That is, every moment of his life, Jesus was doing good work. But Jesus was fully human. He slept. If Jesus was always doing good work, even while he slept, we must conclude that sleep can be good work, if that is God’s will for us at the time. And this is obvious when we recall the story of Jesus and his disciples in the storm (Mt 8, Mk 4, Lk 8). As the storm raged, Jesus slept peacefully in the boat, which enabled his disciples to learn a tough lesson about God’s faithfulness and omnipotence. Jesus was clearly doing good work by sleeping.
Let us consider a baby girl who dies just after baptism. Given her circumstance, God would not have her do anything other that what she actually does, and so she does good work, even as she dies. This is why the Church honors the holy innocents who were slaughtered for their association with Jesus (Mt 2:16). These babies did good work—God expected nothing more from them.
Why does this matter? Most Protestants object to this statement: “Good work is necessary for salvation.” But many Protestants agree with this statement: “Obedience to God’s will is necessary for salvation.” For Protestants who agree with the second statement, objections on the issue of justification are rooted in their misunderstanding of the term “good work.” For example, a Protestant might say, “The good thief was saved, yet he did no good work.” They say this because they think that “good work” necessarily means something akin to “serving meals at a homeless shelter.” But in reality, the good thief probably did only good work from the moment of his conversion to his death. This would be so, if he did all that God wanted him to do. As Bl. Teresa of Calcutta says, “Don’t think that sitting, standing, coming and going, and all that you do is not important to God.”
So, Pope Benedict XVI does not err when he says that sola fide is true, if faith is not opposed to charity, because in fact, we do good work whenever we are not opposed to charity. This is no different than saying, “sola fide is true, so long as faith incorporates obedience.” And this is what the Catholic Church has taught since her conception.
http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/god%E2%80%99s-will-is-our-work
Maybe you should stop trying to read my mind and read the Bible. And your CCC. I'm not saying that Catholics believe that they can 'earn their way into heaven' -- I'm saying that the Catholic Cult teaches that justification is by faith AND works.
Is this not so?
What I AM saying is that the Bible, God's Word, says otherwise. I'm not being "holier than thou" by pointing out false teaching and trying to spread the truth the Gospel. Besides, there just may be a lot of 'non-Christians' in the Roman Cult that may come to saving faith by reading posts that point out the truth.
Is not that something to be hoped for?
Hoss
THAT is a works based salvation.
You have to work to attain it. it's works based, not based on the finished work of Christ on the cross which is complete and needs no amending.
So Paul was wrong here?
Romans 3:20-30 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it—the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith. For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, since God is one—who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith.
Romans 4:1-25 What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.” Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness, just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works: “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.”
Is this blessing then only for the circumcised, or also for the uncircumcised? For we say that faith was counted to Abraham as righteousness. How then was it counted to him? Was it before or after he had been circumcised? It was not after, but before he was circumcised. He received the sign of circumcision as a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. The purpose was to make him the father of all who believe without being circumcised, so that righteousness would be counted to them as well, and to make him the father of the circumcised who are not merely circumcised but who also walk in the footsteps of the faith that our father Abraham had before he was circumcised.
For the promise to Abraham and his offspring that he would be heir of the world did not come through the law but through the righteousness of faith. For if it is the adherents of the law who are to be the heirs, faith is null and the promise is void. For the law brings wrath, but where there is no law there is no transgression. That is why it depends on faith, in order that the promise may rest on grace and be guaranteed to all his offspring—not only to the adherent of the law but also to the one who shares the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all, as it is written, “I have made you the father of many nations”—in the presence of the God in whom he believed, who gives life to the dead and calls into existence the things that do not exist. In hope he believed against hope, that he should become the father of many nations, as he had been told, “So shall your offspring be.” He did not weaken in faith when he considered his own body, which was as good as dead (since he was about a hundred years old), or when he considered the barrenness of Sarah's womb. No unbelief made him waver concerning the promise of God, but he grew strong in his faith as he gave glory to God, fully convinced that God was able to do what he had promised. That is why his faith was “counted to him as righteousness.” But the words “it was counted to him” were not written for his sake alone, but for ours also. It will be counted to us who believe in him who raised from the dead Jesus our Lord, who was delivered up for our trespasses and raised for our justification.
Romans 5:1-2 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
Romans 5:9 Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.
Faith alone in Christ alone.
Discern between salvation and inheritance.
Faith gives you the graces to follow God’s will and keep His Commandments.
Faith in God allows you to love God and our neighbor through charity and good works. Good works are pleasing to God.
Salvation is based on God’s judgement and mercy.
Concur.
The only problem with this perspective is that ANYTHING added to faith is no longer faith in the object of Christ on the Cross. ANYTHING added to what Christ sacrificed now presumes He didn't complete it all. EVERY sin has been judged. Without that simple faith alone or adding to it, the faith is not in the same object as saving faith.
This is why the Roman Catholic Cult fails to have saving faith in Christ. The Cross was ALL JUDGMENT. For believers, we do not face judgment for eternal life, but better, the bema seat for the proper issuance of rewards.
Your comment: “The only problem with this perspective is that ANYTHING added to faith is no longer faith in the object of Christ on the Cross.”
I disagree. So you are saying that our faith in Christ should not grow through love of God and neighbor through charity and good works?
Your comment: “EVERY sin has been judged.”
God has told us that there will be a judgement day.
But we still have free will, and we can still turn our backs on God and fall from grace, to use St. Paul’s phrase (Galatians 5:4).
St. Paul is very clear about the possibility of us committing mortal sin. He tells us: “Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God” (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).
“Sola Eccliesia”.
Wow! I missed that when it was posted. Great teaching.
It is commanded. Being obedient is not a good work, it is the expected of His family members. Catholicism turns that on it head, making obedience to the Catholic Church a necessary good works process, and tops it off with teaching a ritual drinking of the literal blood of Christ, a practice which God condemned for ALL THE GENERATIONS of Israel, which included the one into which Jesus was born.
“That sounds like there is more to this justification thing than faith alone.” No, it sounds like Tim and his advocates are purposely conflating justification and sanctification. The former is a judicial declaration that the unrighteous are righteous before God by believing God, while the second, the latter is a process replacing the performance based religion of the prior covenant. Catholicism commands that this conflated error draw the confused adherent-to-Catholicism into the church’s rule for absolution, a typical Nicolaitan trap.
Please read the letter of James.
Hoss stated a Biblical truth. You then agreed, but contradicted yourself at the end and said the opposite of what you agreed with Hoss over at the start. Only a confused mind can hold opposite assertions as both valid simultaneously.
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