Was The Papacy Established By Christ? (Part 1)

triablogue ^ | June 23, 2006 | Jason Engwer

[ex-snook]

Someone that searches as well as you do is bound to find the truth and become Catholic. I’ll pray for you.

[RnMomof7]

JOHN 20 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19 On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, "Peace be with you." 20 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. 21 Jesus said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you." 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained."

That was an ecclestical gift to the church..the right to excommunicate

Look as we will through the NT, we will never find the apostles exercising this as an ability to forgive the sins of men..BUT you do see the right to remove the unrepentant from the church body exercised

The fact is that Rome never saw this as an "apostolic" gift until 1215 ....

[RnMomof7]

Someone that searches as well as you do is bound to find the truth and become Catholic. I’ll pray for you.

:>)... ..Born , raised, educated Catholic ...Then God found me

[kinsman redeemer]

AMEN to that!

[Elsie]

... since Peter was the only of the original apostles to have his name changed by God, thus signifying a change in importance and role...

Nope; his name was ALREADY Peter before your church's teaching on the subject.

Five instances in the Scriptures predate the faulty teaching of Rome:

NIV Matthew 4:18-19
 18.  As Jesus was walking beside the Sea of Galilee, he saw two brothers, Simon called Peter and his brother Andrew. They were casting a net into the lake, for they were fishermen.
 19.  "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men."

 

NIV Matthew 8:14
  When Jesus came into Peter's house, he saw Peter's mother-in-law lying in bed with a fever.

 

NIV Matthew 10:1-2
 1.  He called his twelve disciples to him and gave them authority to drive out evil  spirits and to heal every disease and sickness.
 2.  These are the names of the twelve apostles: first, Simon (who is called Peter) and his brother Andrew; James son of Zebedee, and his brother John;

 

NIV Matthew 14:28-31
 28.  "Lord, if it's you," Peter replied, "tell me to come to you on the water."
 29.  "Come," he said.   Then Peter got down out of the boat, walked on the water and came toward Jesus.
 30.  But when he saw the wind, he was afraid and, beginning to sink, cried out, "Lord, save me!"
 31.  Immediately Jesus reached out his hand and caught him. "You of little faith," he said, "why did you doubt?"

 

NIV Matthew 15:13-16
 13.  He replied, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.
 14.  Leave them; they are blind guides.  If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit."
 15.  Peter said, "Explain the parable to us."
 16.  "Are you still so dull?" Jesus asked them.

 

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As you can see, Simon was already known as 'Peter'

BEFORE the following verses came along.....

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NIV Matthew 16:13-18
 13.  When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say the Son of Man is?"
 14.  They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets."
 15.  "But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"
 16.  Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ,  the Son of the living God."
 17.  Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven.
 18.  And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades  will not overcome it.

 19.  I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be  bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."

[Elsie]

That is also what I was talking about, Peter turned the other cheek instead of slapping Paul silly.

It would be centuries before the amassed power of the CHURCH was large enough to allow such blatent torture to occur.

[ravenwolf]

It would be centuries before the amassed power of the CHURCH was large enough to allow such blatent torture to occur.

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Right,it would have to be some where other than the Church.

[bike800]

John 1:42 You forgot one...

[Elsie]

You forgot one...

Nope; as I was staying within MATTHEW'S writings.

Don't wanna bring up a debatable timing sequence.