Posted on 10/28/2014 3:19:32 PM PDT by Faith Presses On
In an exciting declaration, Pope Francis I stated that God should not seen as a “magician with a magic wand,” while unveiling a statue of his predecessor Pope Benedict XVI at the Pontifical Academy of Sciences. Pope Francis also stated that evolution and the Big Bang theory are both true and not incompatible with the church’s views on the origins of the universe and life.
“When we read about Creation in Genesis, we run the risk of imagining God was a magician, with a magic wand able to do everything. But that is not so,” Francis said, according to the Independent. Francis continued by stating that God “created human beings and let them develop according to the internal laws that he gave to each one so they would reach their fulfillment.”
(Excerpt) Read more at thedailybeast.com ...
Wow, just wow.
Thank you for sharing this. Welcome home. Please consult the Catechism and other official documents when you have questions. Take everything you read here with a grain of critical salt please.
And for goodness sakes, please visit www.catholic.com An apologetic site without comparison IMO.
>>What I mainly mean is a FReeper who is so swayed by the anti-Catholic vitriol here that they decide to leave the Church.<<
That certainly would be an interesting post.
Please ping me if it comes to pass.
I’m sure that is not the response that the Catholic bashers were looking for but I’m so happy you were able to dig through all the muck and find the truth! Welcome home!! May God bless you and your family.
Not only did I correctly pen my thoughts but I know how/when to use "to" and/or "too" correctly.
“...posting “God the trickster” was always a bad road to walk.”
“God does not want to trick us. He made a wonderful universe and tasked us tiny Humans with: “Go figure it out.””
As an example of “trickery” (if you will), is the encounter that Abraham had with the angels after his self-circumcism. They appeared as men, which was a test for Abraham - was he going to be a truly hospitable host for these “men” when in pain and recovering, or not. Well, of course, he passed that test...but it wouldn’t have been a test if he had not thought that the “men” were angels. What God did there (as I understand it) was to deceive Abraham so as to offer a true test of that aspect of Abraham’s morality under the duress of pain. No deception = no true test. I’ll grant that this was for a limited purpose, but it was “trickery” of a sort. Nonetheless, it was not the general rule, to be sure.
>>As an example of “trickery” (if you will), is the encounter that Abraham had with the angels after his self-circumcism. They appeared as men, which was a test for Abraham - was he going to be a truly hospitable host for these “men” when in pain and recovering, or not.<<
Testing for a particular circumstance is not the same as creating an entire milieu.
To suggest that God placed fossils and other corresponding evidence, such as the tree rings and other geological data, including the speed of light and how these register on our understanding of data and time, would indeed posit not only a conspiracy by God but a complete attempt to hoodwink us stupid humans. It would necessitate changing the dating of billions of fossils, ensuring they are consistent with the strata found, etc. etc.
God, as the maker of all reality, can certainly do this — but to what end? To test us to reject what we find and determine and thus reject His greatest gift: the ability to think and discern?
That might be how you see God, but I can’t traverse that Rubicon.
I don’t think I said anything about evolution.
As a matter of fact, I DON’T think there’s solid evidence for evolution. There certainly is evidence that the earth has teemed with species that are now extinct, and that other species have come into existence at later times. But evolution? That’s a different matter entirely.
I don’t see what the Virginal Conception and the Virgin Birth of Jesus has to do with evolution—or biology in general. If it happened, it had to be a direct act of God.
As a matter of fact, the Catholic Church DOES teach that all human beings are descended from one man and one woman, whom Genesis calls “Adam” and “Eve.” The Catholic Church teaches everything you outlined—i.e., that they sinned, and as a consequence all of us are conceived without grace, and are damaged as a result.
In his remarks, the Pope didn’t deny any of that.
A commendable approach. Might I make a suggestion? Before you do so, spend some time in prayer in His Presence. Around the world and across the US, there are parishes with ADORATION CHAPELS. Follow this link to find one in your area. Is this important? Very much so. Allow me to share another story with you.
I met a young priest, recently ordained, who was assigned to prison ministry. He made great strides in bringing the word of God to the inmates. There were some, however, whose hearts had turned to stone. After receiving permission from the proper authorities, he set up a table in a room on which he placed a monstrance containing the Blessed Sacrament. The inmates were invited into this room to sit in quiet meditation; no explanation was given as to the monstrance which none had ever seen. During that time, some of them, inexplicably, broke down into tears. He continued this practice one day each week. Many were received into the Church.
Place yourself in our Lord's presence. There is no need to speak or even pray. Pour your heart out to Him, your fears, concerns, your anger, bitterness ... whatever ... and allow Him to speak to your heart. Ask Him to guide you to the right priest.
If you have never visited this web site, I would encourage you to - CATHOLICS COME HOME. Earlier this year, I was asked to prepare some youth for the Sacrament of Confirmation. I began the lesson by visiting the above link and had them watch the Epic Video. Even though these kids attend catholic school, they came away with a better understanding and appreciation of the history and contributions of the Catholic Church.
Finally, it is worth remembering the words of Jesus Christ. He said to go to the Church as It is the final authority in Christianity. (Mt 18:17). The Church is Christ's bride (Ephesians 5:29) and has "no spot, wrinkle or blemish" (Ephesians 5:27). Christ also stated that the gates of Hell will not prevail against His Church (Matthew 16:18) so how can the Church commit error? Individual clergy may commit sins, even popes commit sins because in the Church there are both "weeds and wheat" (Matthew 13:30).
It is so easy to find fault with members or aspects of an organization. These become excuses for absenting us; ironically, in so doing, we punish ourselves by denying us access to the True Presence of Christ. Whenever some parishioner or priest or bishop or pope begins to grate my nerves, I remind myself that I come to church to worship God, not the priest, not the parishioners, etc. It is my time to be in the true presence of God, a truly humbling thought.
Thank you for sharing what the Pope actually said. As usual, it is more nuanced than the headlines make it out to be.
My statement has more “heft” than his.
I base mine on the Word of God, Genesis. I don’t believe the bible is fairy tales or misinterpretations so that fanciful stories can entertain us, of what actually happened.
And if you’re going to start in with man’s problematic dating methods that have all sorts of presumed assumptions behind them, I will pick the Word of God over anything man can claim, if they are at odds. Time and again top archaeologists have said the bible isn’t true because of this or that not being found (yet), only to later find the very thing the bible said was where it was, or what it was. Never has the bible been disproven when it aligns with discoveries in antiquity. It has always been proven correct.
I stick with God’s Word. Those that want to believe the pope are free to believe the pope.
>>My statement has more “heft” than his.<<
A lay person who not only cannot read Aramaic, nor ancient Roman nor Greek (all requirements to be Pope) tells me his opinion has “heft.” It is to laugh.
>>
I base mine on the Word of God, Genesis. I don’t believe the bible is fairy tales or misinterpretations so that fanciful stories can entertain us, of what actually happened.<<
Nice straw man — I can provide a Bic lighter if you need one. The Pope spoke DIRECTLY to Genesis and made a strong statement that Genesis (the Big Bang) DEMANDS God as we know Him.
>>And if you’re going to start in with man’s problematic dating methods that have all sorts of presumed assumptions behind them, I will pick the Word of God over anything man can claim, if they are at odds. Time and again top archaeologists have said the bible isn’t true because of this or that not being found (yet), only to later find the very thing the bible said was where it was, or what it was. Never has the bible been disproven when it aligns with discoveries in antiquity. It has always been proven correct.
I stick with God’s Word. Those that want to believe the pope are free to believe the pope.<<
IOW, science is too complicated for you so better to substitute theology for that hard “science” stuff.
The Pope is crystal clear: for science to have started, it needed God to get things going.
Thanks NYer — you and Sal and all the rest of the Catholics (sorry “all the rest” — I have difficulty keeping track) here at FR represent the RCC quite well in word and deed.
I will look at the Catholics Come Home site and do some serious contemplation.
It might even get my dander down (in re S.A.M. lol).
Praise God and welcome home.
“It is FR anti-Catholicism that has pushed me ...”
FR anti-Catholicism caused me to do much more extensive research into sacred scripture to find the scriptural proof texts for our (catholic) doctrinces and was always thrilled by how the scripture always supports the catholic position!! It has deepened my “apologetics” considerably and I am very grateful. I have always loved scripture and apologetics and this has made it even more meaningful.
Congrats!
of course it was written so we could understand it....it was written by man...There was no one there during the period of creation...God did it on His time scale, not ours...to God time is irrelevant....a moment, a year...a century...a thousand years...totally meaningless to God. When the book was written so man could understand it, terms had to be used so we could have some concept of the passing of time as we understand it....our understanding is not God's understanding!!
Yes, I agree that the Catholic church teaches all those things. But I don’t understand how evolution after the “big bang” can get us to Adam and Eve. How do you, or the Pope, explain that?
Discuss the issues all you want, do not make it personal.
Attempting to make a thread about another poster is making it personal and takes away from the purpose of the thread.
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