Overseeing the collapse of Catholic parish life
Posted on 05/14/2014 1:50:48 PM PDT by NYer
I’ve been following with some bemusement the interchanges between Cardinal Mueller, head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF), and the Leadership Conference of Women Religious (LCWR). For readers unaware of the developments, I'll present them here in abbreviated form:
CDF: “Sisters, do you believe and affirm that Jesus Christ is the eternal Son of the Father, begotten and not made, the second Person of the Holy Trinity?”
LCWR: “Why are you asking us that question? What gives you the authority to ask it?”
CDF: “Again, Sisters, do you believe and affirm that Jesus Christ is the eternal Son of the Father, incarnate by the Holy Ghost in the womb of the Virgin Mary?”
LCWR: “You have no right to pick on us simply because we’re women. You arrogant misogynists! We believe that hierarchical structures must be dismantled!”
CDF: “Sisters, you seem to argue that you are ‘beyond Jesus.’ Do you in fact believe that man may be saved in the name of Jesus alone? That Christ alone reveals the Father to man, and man to himself?”
LCWR: “Why are you using sexist language? We are offended by your pronouns.”
CDF: “Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the eternal Son of the Father?”
LCWR: “We have advanced degrees in theology. We have received awards from our friends – we mean, from prestigious theological societies. Why are you suggesting that we are incompetent? Is it because we’re women?”
CDF: “Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the eternal Son of the Father, yes or no?”
LCWR: “Where were you when bishops were hiding pedophiles? Why are you picking on us all of a sudden? Is it to distract people from your incompetence?”
CDF: “Sisters, the question is fundamental. At every Mass we affirm that Christ is the eternal Son of the Father, the second Person of the Holy Trinity, the sole savior of man – of the human race. Do you believe this or not?”
LCWR: “We don’t like your attitude! Why are you shouting? What is this really all about?”
CDF: “All right, let’s move to something else. Do you affirm the Church’s teachings regarding marriage, sexual relations, the family, and the sanctity of human life, from conception to natural death?”
LCWR: “Why are you ignoring the work we do with the poor?”
CDF: “Work with the poor is not at issue. Do you affirm the Church’s teachings?”
LCWR: “Too many people forget that the Church has many teachings regarding the poor!”
CDF: “Those are not in question. Do you affirm the Church’s prohibitions against contraception, abortion, sodomy, and divorce?”
LCWR: “Why do you assume that we speak with one voice?”
CDF: “We assume no such thing. We want to know whether you affirm the Church’s teachings.”
LCWR: “The Church needs women in positions of leadership.”
CDF: “As to that, the question is whether you or other women should be leading this organization. Do you affirm the Church’s teachings?”
LCWR: “Which teachings?”
Overseeing the collapse of Catholic parish life
CDF: “Do you affirm the Church’s teachings on the broad range of sexual issues?”
LCWR: “We are distressed that women’s voices have not been heard!”
CDF: “Do you affirm the teachings?”
LCWR: “Stop shouting! We don’t like your aggression!”
CDF: “Do you affirm the teaching authority of the Church? Are you Catholic?”
LCWR: “Of course we’re Catholic! We attend Mass.”
CDF: “That is not the question. Let us ask again. Protestants do not believe in the teaching authority of the Church. That is what makes them Protestant. Do you believe in the teaching authority of the Church?”
LCWR: “We believe that even laymen share in the teaching authority.”
CDF: “Please attend. Do you believe that, when the Church has declared a thing to be evil, such as abortion, or sodomy, the faithful must learn to think with the mind of the Church? Do you believe that the Church is our Mother and Teacher?”
LCWR: “We believe in dialogue, and you don’t. The good Pope John believed in dialogue.”
CDF: “The good Pope John called the Church our Mother and Teacher. Do you believe that?”
LCWR: “Mothers don’t impose hide-bound rules and legalistic definitions.”
CDF: “Do you believe in the teaching authority of Holy Mother, the Church?”
LCWR: “We cannot have a conversation with someone who continually accuses us.” sniffle, “berates us,” sniffle, “looks down upon us,” two sniffles, “believes that he is right simply because he is male,” snort, toss of the head, “is not as qualified as we are to discuss difficult points of theology,” purse of the lips, “and is obviously not in accord with the Church that is to come.”
CDF: “I take that to mean no.”
LCWR: “Don’t you dare put words in our mouths!”
I have a dream. I have a dream that the orders of religious women in America will think of competence, if not of faithfulness, and show the door to women who have overseen the collapse of the glory of Catholic parish life in this country.
When you begin as the general manager of the Yankees, and in three decades your club finds itself overmatched against a good Little League team, it’s time to step down and give the job to somebody else. As it happens, there are orders of sisters that are stocked with novices, and enthusiasm, and love of Christ and His Church. Let their leaders, who are women and religious, lead this conference, and move from strength to strength.
The LCWR has it dead wrong. We want them out, because we want more women religious, more faithful, more influential in schools and hospitals and colleges, and more effective in converting a very silly, sad, and vicious world to Christ.
Jocularity, ping!
Might ask the same questions of Joe Insurance Policy and NacyPulousi and the rest of the child-molesting CINOs.
Interesting questions, eh?
And the most interesting one is that, if “the Church” stands independent of the Clergy, of what use is the CDF?
After all, it’s just opinions.
Right?
I am speechless. Why can’t these sisters answer the questions with a simple yes or no?
Meeting of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith with the Presidency of the LCWR
LCWR Announces Top Award for Theologian Criticized by US Bishops
Reforming the LCWR: Where Does It Stand?
Of the Viet Cong and Radical Feminist Nuns
New LCWR head says assessment is about Church's future
No real cooperation from women's religious group, author says
At the LCWR Woodstock in Orlando the sisters learn that “we are stardust”
Nuns in Arms! Sr. Fiedler runs down Archbp. Sartain as the LCWR Games begin
Religious women press for change (BARF ALERT)
Sr. Simone Campbell spins the CDF smackdown of the LCWR. Hilarity ensues
Pope Reaffirms Vatican's Call for Reform of U.S. Nuns' Group
The Honeymoon May be Over....
Communique of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith...(lcwr report reaffirmed)
MSNBC Features Liberal Nun Slamming Catholic Church: 'One Of The Last Bastions Of Sexism'
NCR teams up with Ford Found backed entity to hide truth about Holy See’s ‘Doc Assesment’ of LCWR
Bishop Robert Morlino Cracks Down on Madison Nuns for Espousing 'New Ageism' and 'Indifferentism'
Sister Simone Campbell, ‘Nun from the Bus,’ rips Republicans at Democratic convention
The plot sickens (LCWR)
US nuns facing Vatican order to reform, quash dissent will hold talks with church leaders
Cardinal Burke on nuns’ group: ‘If it can’t be reformed, then it doesn’t have a right to continue’
LCWR Assembly Update: How did keynote speaker Hubbard do?
LCWR Assembly Begins. What their keynote speaker brings to the Nuns. VIDEO
LCWR assembly begins; Vatican representative told attendance 'would not be helpful'
LCWR Prepares to Discuss Response to Vatican Mandate to Reform
Bishop Explains Vatican's Criticism Of U.S. Nuns (promoting non-Catholic theology)
Sr Patricia Miller in op-ed canonizes St. Obama for his respect for religious liberty. No, really.
LCWR nuns: “Catholic Church is pro-foetus but keeps silent on other essential issues”
Analysis of NPR’s interview of LCWR Pres. Sr. Pat Farrell: like a 7-y/o’s manipulative obfuscation
Biden brings cookies and ice cream to (dissenting) LCWR president’s motherhouse
Oh Sisters! Renegade Catholic nuns engage in media campaign (Nuns on Bus Alert!)
GUEST POST: “the sisters chose to put this out there for the public”
American Nuns Say Questions Not Defiance
Sister Keehan, CHA push dangerous compromise on HHS mandate (again)
Traditional Sisters Big Hit With Trendy Teens
LCWR reform is not criticism of religious orders, [Archbishop J. Peter Sartain] says
Sisters of Mercy doctors say LCWR is injecting politics into dialogue
Cardinal Sean P. O’Malley Laments Discord on Nuns
Vatican Official Warns of 'Dialogue of the Deaf' with LCWR
Bishop Blair Pounds the Facts; LCWR Pounds The Table
Nun Who Leads Network Disparages Bishops, Hesitant to Call Herself Pro-Life
Analysis: Dispute With US Nuns Began Decades Ago
Vatican: LCWR under direction of the Holy See; must promote doctrine "taught through the ages"
“The Biggest Distortion of All” [LCWR vs CDF]
Nuns Brace for Vatican Meeting
Catholic Identity Once Again
Crisis of sisterhood: ‘Radical’ U.S. nuns clash with Vatican doctrine guardians
Franciscan Friars Back American Nuns in Vatican Spat
Pastor Completely Loses It Over LWCR
Roman Catholic Womenpriests-USA stands behind LCWR
Nun Too Accurate Reporting
Sisters of Mercy President Defends Farley, Criticizes CDF
Major Vatican Assault Coming in October, Says Former Maryknoll Provincial
Vatican Warns Against Errors in Mercy Nun's 2006 Book on Sexual Ethics
Priests Come to Nuns’ defense
Leaders of U.S. Catholic Nuns to Address Vatican Reprimand About 'Radical' Feminism
Toldya About the Lesbian Nuns in Leavenworth [Ann Barnhardt]
Split over nuns' role plays out online (LCWR nuns complain about blogosphere)
ANOTHER WAY TO BEAUTIFY THE CHURCH or 10 REASONS NUNS SHOULD WEAR HABITS (Warning-graphic images)
Dallas bishop ‘communicating’ with nuns on their support for Gates’ global contraceptive campaign
When Reverend Mothers Cease Being Motherly
Nuns Issue Statement Defending Billionaire Contraceptive Campaigner Melinda Gates
Important Background Information About the CDF-LCWR Situation
Nuns Gone Wild: A Trip Down Memory Lane
Exhibit A for Explaining the LCWR Report
Vatican Crackdown on U.S. Nuns a Long Time Brewing
LCWR: getting to the truth of the matter (the blogosphere response to CDF document)
Radical feminist nuns’ group ‘stunned’ by Vatican criticisms, reform plan
Vatican announces reform of US women's religious conference (more details)
Citing doctrinal problems, Vatican announces reforms of US nuns' group
In hard-hitting document Vatican launches clean-up of feminist nuns in United States
LCWR Having a Bad Day. Vatican Names Archbishop Delegate to Continue Watching LCWR and Network
I don’t seem to have much of a sense of humour these days, I guess. Are these women mostly of Vatican II time?
It's a parody!! These questions were not actually addressed to the sisters.
“CDF: “That is not the question. Let us ask again. Protestants do not believe in the teaching authority of the Church. That is what makes them Protestant. Do you believe in the teaching authority of the Church?”
I will venture that conservative Protestants are more “Catholic” than these “ladies” are. On second thought, perhaps these “ladies” need to join the Episcopal Church. They definitely have more of a home there than in either the Catholic church, or even the Baptists.
(above said in partial sarcasm)
I didn’t see the humor marker. Sorry.
Esolen is very good. Thanks for this.
Maybe things are worse but not because people are worse, but because there are so many more of us.
=================================================
NO, Salvation is pulling your leg!
CDF: “That is not the question. Let us ask again. Protestants do not believe in the teaching authority of the Church. That is what makes them Protestant. Do you believe in the teaching authority of the Church?”
So if the Catholic church is being compared to Protestantism, why is this labeled a caucus thread?
Sadly, this parody isn’t much different from what Jamie Manson wrote in the National Catholic Reporter that was posted by Mrs. Don-o.
See http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3156061/posts
Are you still going on about not being able to tell the difference between an official pronouncement and a personal opinion? How strange. You should know, however, that these questions and answers above are not real, but are meant humorously by the author. It is called satire.
metmom, you may have a valid point, but I believe the Rules of Engagement cautions us to not come into a caucus thread to challenge whether or not it should be a caucus. Rather, we are to send the Religion Moderator a Freepmail for a resolution of the question.
There is little to no tolerance for non-members of a caucus coming onto the caucus thread to challenge whether or not it should be a caucus. Gross disruption usually follows.
If you question whether the article is appropriate for a caucus designation, send me a Freepmail. I’ll get to it as soon as I can.
Well, justice and been done and it is now a moot point. If you are so worried keep your FRoman Catholic FRiends off of Protestant threads that do not mention Rome at all. That is far more egregious than what happened here.
I am aware of that and I did follow protocol as well.
Interestingly, there was a thread just last week or so where it was labeled Protestant caucus and crashed by the Catholics with no acknowledgement on their part of wrongdoing, even after it was pointed out to those involved. I do believe that it was gamecock’s IIRC.
I do understand that two wrongs don’t equal a right, but I also note there is a double standard being applied here (not by the RM). Instead of acknowledging their error, the Catholics in question got defensive and justified their actions.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.