Posted on 11/25/2013 9:03:35 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
Are you skeptical of blood/alcohol levels for drunk driving convictions? Or are you skeptical of someone saying that the bible supports helpful laws of governments?
So, once again, how can one ever differentiate here in the here and now, and at this moment b/w those who are or will be known later as the “never saved” and the “fallen out of fellowship with Christ”?
*****
It’s not your job. The Lord knows what’s in each heart. Relax.
Recommend the below sermon. It will be a blessing:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3093981/posts
As far as being drunk and what that means for any alcohol consumption, we are told to not be drunken, or controlled by wine or any other thing that would prevent the Holy Spirit from filling us and being in control of our lives - in EVERY area.
Take fresh grapes (no suppressive chemicals added).
Squeeze the juice out.
Wait a week.
The result is wine, featuring alcohol.
And no, a nice glass of the stuff with dinner isn’t going to put anyone in a box.
Mate after all that reading I could sure use a pint of beer - just one though :)
Somewhere between thispy and sot.
On the contrary, alcohol is a natural occurrence as a byproduct of the yeast consuming the natural sugars in the juice. It happens in beer, mead, grains, etc. It is how bread rises, even.
LOLOLOL!!! You get the “Fractal Wrongness” picture because you pointed out the fractal wrongness of what was posted! From what I read, the “theologians” couldn’t decide which side of the fence they were on just like you said.
That's nice, and it is true, but the phase of ethanol (EtOH) formied is only a transitional phase as the sugars pass from dissolved molecules of fructose to molecules of acetic acid (EtOOH) in vinegar, when the process is completely open to air. In such a process, the amount of ethanol at any moment is very low.
Are you not aware that in order to stop the oxidation of the sugars, the process must take place in the absence of free oxygen from the air?
One way is to place the juice in an elastic container, a new sheepskin, and seal it. Then, in presence of yeast, the sugars break down anaerobically to form EtOH and carbon dioxide (CO2). This is not a natural process. It only occurs when mankind intervenes with some kind of device to to interrupt the natural transformation to vinegar. Capisce?
A more modern way to produce wine is basically to put the juice into a container, add some manufactured sugar to drive up the alcohol percentage, add yeast, then seal with an exhaust tube in the stopper. Then connect a length of Tygon tubing to the exhaust tube, and submerge the other end of the tube in a beaker of water or vegetable oil.
This allows the excess CO2 to bubble out, without having air allowed back into the container. Then allow the process to complete. At some point, the alcohol content reaches about 12% maximum, enough to stop further enzymatic action. (Human intervention required, eh?)
Forming intoxicating beverages is a man-made process, not a natural one. It was discovered very early on, after the atmospheric conditions and yeast contamination of everything occurred after the flood. Doubtless, righteous Noah had no idea that his first batch of bottled grape juice was going to become intoxicating after the flood catastrophe.
Apparently his antediluvian culture did not know much about fermentation processes. I see little mention of bread as a principal food until Abrahams time, although God did mention it in Genesis 3. But God declares that their principal food was to be green herbs, not baked bread. Nor is there any mention that Noah formed a habit of recreational use of intoxicants subsequent to that unique post-flood experience.
Well, at least I know what drunkenness isn't. Whatever the government decides is sure to be wrong by default.
Like I'd trust THEM to define morality?
OK, now that we know what it isn't, we can finish trying to figure out what it IS.
I’m glad to see you agree with me. I thought it was wrong on every level as well.
Then Obamacare is also the LAW of the land. Why are we fighting it?
Whoa!
Now it's HELPFUL ones?
Render to Caesar that which is Caesar's, but more to the point, "obey every law and ordinance..."
Similar to Godwin’s law, FR seems to have the law of the Babbling Fool.
SELF control seems to be mentioned a LOT in Scripture, without DETAILING just WHAT it is that needs to be controlled.
Oh goody!
Now he’s gotten the dog to bark at him thru the fence!
I believe that recreational use of alcohol controls a person as long as he/she insists that they will not abandon it and cling only to the Christ of The Cross and his Spirit. I believe the "two master" (Mt. 8:24, Lk. 16:13) principle of two opposites applies here, just as it would for avarice (or for gluttony, or gossip, or pornography, etc.)
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