Posted on 12/03/2012 2:15:56 AM PST by DouglasKC
Question: In the passages below a harlot symbolizes something. The title on her head is "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH." One of the titles is "the mother of harlots". This suggests that there are other harlots that have sprung from this harlot.
This is more curiosity then anything else...but what are opinions on what this represents?
Rev 17:1 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and talked with me, saying to me, "Come, I will show you the judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters,
Rev 17:2 with whom the kings of the earth committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication."
Rev 17:3 So he carried me away in the Spirit into the wilderness. And I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast which was full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
Rev 17:4 The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.
Rev 17:5 And on her forehead a name was written: MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
Rev 17:6 I saw the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus. And when I saw her, I marveled with great amazement.
Rev 17:7 But the angel said to me, "Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, which has the seven heads and the ten horns.
Rev 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
Rev 17:9 "Here is the mind which has wisdom: The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits.
Rev 17:10 There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.
Rev 17:11 The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.
Rev 17:12 "The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast.
Rev 17:13 These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast.
Rev 17:14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful."
Spacejunkie: Do tell why you think SDA’s aren’t Christian?
Well, I have been told in the past by various Evangelical and other non-Catholic freepers that Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christian
On reading the links they sent (pasted above for your reference), I am inclined to agree with them
Do you?
Well, I didn't see that and quite frankly you know that FR bans certain websites, so whoever your good boy was, he ought to know that, right?
The obvious truth is that Jim Rob and his religion moderators are Catholic. and as such... this is a pro-Catholic site.**
I don’t think that is necessarily true. LOL!
When you have been around here as long as I have — you have gone through some mighty deep chasms filled with anti-Catholic threads.
Ok, so when Christ said "on this day", He didn't really mean it?
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.ping to others for interesting views by spacejunkie
13 Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep, or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope.14 We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him.15 According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage each other with these words.
Verse 17 says clearly "caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air."
Revelation 19 says:
11 I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war.12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself.13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean.
Prior to that in both Rev 7 and Rev 19, the various saints are in heaven and already dressed in fine linen:
Rev 19:6 Then I heard what sounded like a great multitude, like the roar of rushing waters and like loud peals of thunder, shouting: "Hallelujah! For our Lord God Almighty reigns.7 Let us rejoice and be glad and give him glory! For the wedding of the Lamb has come, and his bride has made herself ready. 8 Fine linen, bright and clean, was given her to wear." 9 Then the angel said to me, "Write: 'Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!' " And he added, "These are the true words of God."
So, the rapture prior to the 2nd coming, Christ's touching down on planet Earth, is easily demonstrable.
Do others have different ways of looking at these events? Sure. But, the pre-return on earth rapture is among the contenders, whether one likes it or not. I am among those who like it.
caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.”
Pre Trib. I sure hope so.
The church, as we know it now, not being mentioned on earth after chapter 4 of Revelation is one of the good reasons for thinking in terms of pre-tribulation rapture.
How is she a false prophet? Anyone who tells God’s truth in these last days (since Christ’s resurrection) is a prophet. I totally agree with what you posted in that there is only a remnant that are true believers and, in reading her last sentence, how does it become more clear than that?
The SDA’s are Biblical through and through. I am not SDA and don’t personally agree with their sticking to the Old Testament rules of eating, or Saturday worship, but I don’t think they’re wrong either.
From your link:
“Space does not permit us to show her many false prophecies but documentation is available.”
First, I’m not SDA. Second, I’ve been to SDA churches, among many other churches, Catholic included. The SDA are completely Biblically sound. The Catholics are not.
I TELL YOU ON THIS DAY....
too bad the Catholics aren’t into reading the Bible. They’d learn so much.
• Matthew 24:37-42, “As were the days of Noah, so will be the coming of the Son of man.”
“…Then two men will be in the field; one is taken and one is left. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one is taken and one is left. Watch therefore, for you do not know on what day your Lord is coming.”
Christ seems to be referring to the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, as he warned “…this generation will not pass away till all these things take place”. Also, notice the people taken away in Noah’s time were the unrighteous, not the righteous, which is the opposite of rapture theory.
In Matthew 24:13 Christ promises “…the one who endures to the end will be saved”. This includes Christians who will endure the Tribulation.
• 1 Corinthians 15:51-52, “Lo! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”
This also refers to the Second Coming of Christ, in that “the twinkling of an eye” refers to the instantaneous change from a mortal body to a glorified body, NOT to the speed of the rapture. Its connection to the blast of the “last trumpet”, heralds Christ’s Second Coming. The Catholic Church has consistently interpreted this passage as such for the last 2000 years.
The Catholic Church rejects the rapture theory for good reason. It is unbiblical and completely alien to the historic Christian tradition surrounding the Second Coming of Christ. Remember that Christ said he would return on “the last day”, to judge the living and the dead. There will be no secret or hidden coming in the meantime.
ALL Protestan theorists use Reveleations to continue their attack on the Catholic Church.
It would not be talking about just the Catholic Church, it would be talking about all of them.
Many then go on to remove themselves from any coming tribulations, by inventing “the Rapture”, which necessarily denies the 2nd coming of Christ, by injecting a third.
Larry, there is an enormous amount of data on last things in the Bible, so for there to be different understandings of it does not surprise me in the least. As one former freeper used to say, “I’m a pan-millennialist...it’ll all pan out in the end.”
There is no position that can be taken, such as those verses you’ve just posted, that doesn’t have a counter-point with different verses.
While I am a pre-millennialist, and always have been, I’m very direct in asserting that it is essential to watch all theories for these things refer to events not yet fully understood since they deal with ultimately future things.
I am not Roman Catholic, but I understand your position is pretty much amillennial. That’s fine. I think it’s natural to find Catholics abiding by the teaching of the Catholic doctrinal teachers.
I would encourage all, though, to have a working knowledge of the other major views.
Thank you for your thoughtful responses to my posts.
No problem. Just know that there are protestants out there who don’t automatically dismiss/reject/hate Roman Catholics.
I believe in true Christian Unity (NOT go-along-to-get-along), and that the body of Christ is always best served when “brethren dwell together in unity.”
Cronos; I apologize for calling you a big Catholic boaster.
Pure conjecture on my part as I have no idea how big you might be.
Wrong. It was a vanity. With no links. But because the open honest discussion turned uncomfortable for Catholics....
"No Thanks".
Aha, a vanity -- more false lies peddled as truths.
This was no "honesty" but bare-faced lies in the vein of "why do you slap your wife?" -- a bad dishonest liar of a poster probably posted it
Just go.
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