Will Smithmas return this year? [Merry Smithmas!? Lds' Joseph Smith b'day usurps Christ's birth?]

Mormon Discussions.com ^ | Nov. 30, 2012 | Aristotle Smith

[Colofornian]

I just realized that Christmas falls on a Tuesday this year, so December 23 is on a Sunday. This of course provides a great opportunity for the LDS church to prove its Christian roots by using that day to talk about Joseph Smith, it is his birthday after all.

So, will the average LDS ward celebrate Smithmas or Christmas on December 23 this year? I'm guessing my wife's ward will split the difference and dedicate part to Joseph Smith and part to Jesus. I may even have to show up and pay attention to see what happens, it could be entertaining.

[Elsie]

It seems double minded to jawbone about how “pagan” it is yet to do it... but again I’m jes’ a red neck.

At least the Jehovan Witnesses know it!

[Elsie]

Although; I’ve not seen any signs of PD or OMM.

[svcw]

Interesting article in the Deseretnews (a mormon newspaper)
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705395947/Two-December-births-to-celebrate-Jesus-Christ-and-Joseph-Smith.html?pg=all
This line especially I found fascinating.......Interestingly, Joseph’s circumstances share many parallels with that of the Savior
Now that this year JS bday will be celebrated on the Sunday before Christmas where will the emphasis be?

[Nifster]

I read yours and it didm;t even bother to address directly anything I had said....except to state that “Christmas” is not pagan. Now it is nice that you make a statement with no proof but there is more than enough history of ‘Christmas” to say that it is pagan....not only is origin ( as is Easter) but in the ‘choice’ of date.

Your current response is not only snarky but without any proof what so ever.

Naming of the day of the week while carrying names from ancient mythologies (Woden, Frigge, Thor, Saturday) does not a celebration make. That is illogical as a construct and really has nothing to do with anything in either the original post or my response to it.

You apparently do not know enough of your own faith to even know the history of the times in which certain events occurred. To bad, it might help you to a deeper understanding.

Don’t bother to respond I don’t want your blood pressure to get any higher than it already is... and I won’t engage any further with the disarmed

[Nifster]

AH but you see I do not celebrate “Christmas”. I do enjoy the lights and music and I am always happy to give other people gifts. If that is double minded so be it but I do not treat this as a religious observance in any way. So I say to you all happy holidays but I will not wish you a merry christmas (any more than I would wish you a happy Easter....another pagan holiday that has NOTHING to do with the resurrection of my Lord and Savior)

[Elsie]

Now that this year JS bday will be celebrated on the Sunday before Christmas where will the emphasis be?

I'm sure that your pastor wouldn't mind if you missed that Sunday at your church, to do a little first hand research at another one!!!

(Take your camera/vcr...)

[Elsie]

(any more than I would wish you a happy Easter....another pagan holiday that has NOTHING to do with the resurrection of my Lord and Savior)

Oh?

Did the pagan holiday hop around datewise to match the Jewish lunar calendar?

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“I read yours and it didm;t even bother to address directly anything I had said....except to state that “Christmas” is not pagan. Now it is nice that you make a statement with no proof but there is more than enough history of ‘Christmas” to say that it is pagan....not only is origin ( as is Easter) but in the ‘choice’ of date.”

False. 1) The proof is that it is CHRIST’S MASS. No pagan celebrated CHRIST’S MASS. As I noted, pagans celebrated their own things on December 25. CHRIST’S MASS was never one of them. Only Christians celebrated that. The fact that you can’t see such an obvious point does not bode well. 2) As the early Christians themselves tell us, December 25th was chosen TO OPPOSE PAGAN CELEBRATIONS. Thus, Christmas is doubly NOT pagan. It was not only a celebration of Christ, but it was chosen in opposition to paganism. 3) Easter is nothing but the Christian Pascha. It is only called Easter in Germanic language speaking countries. In itself Pascha has no connections to paganism at all.

“Your current response is not only snarky but without any proof what so ever.”

Again, CHRIST’S MASS is obvious. No pagan celebrated CHRIST’S MASS.

“Naming of the day of the week while carrying names from ancient mythologies (Woden, Frigge, Thor, Saturday) does not a celebration make. That is illogical as a construct and really has nothing to do with anything in either the original post or my response to it.”

Actually it has everything to do with it. Pagans named the days in honor of gods. We retain those names, but we deny any act of honoring the gods. On the 25th we celebrate Christmas - CHRIST’S MASS - and not any pagan celebration for which that date might have been previously known.

“You apparently do not know enough of your own faith to even know the history of the times in which certain events occurred.”

That’s hilarious. I am a professional Church Historian. What are your credentials? Oh, that’s right, you post on the internet about things which you apparently know nothing about.

“To bad, it might help you to a deeper understanding.”

My understanding is apparently much deeper than yours.

“Don’t bother to respond I don’t want your blood pressure to get any higher than it already is”

My blood pressure is actually very good. Laughter helps. I’m laughing at your posts quite a bit as a matter of fact.

“... and I won’t engage any further with the disarmed”

Yeah, like I said, what are your bona fides on this? I suggest you don’t come to a gun fight armed only with a spork again.

[Nifster]

If you did some basic research you will find that Easter is in fact associated with the goddess Ishtar...it is interesting historically. Read some history....Nimrod et al were associated with a spring festival that was a movable feast.

I don’t care what you ‘celebrate’ but at least have the honesty to know the historical roots of what it is.

[Elsie]

I knew this already; but my question remains: Did the Istar celebration hop around on the calendar?

[Nifster]

yes it was moveable feast determined by full moon dates....

[Elsie]

Ok; did it predate the institution of PASSOVER?

[Elsie]

Now that this year JS bday will be celebrated on the Sunday before Christmas where will the emphasis be?

From article: I may even have to show up and pay attention to see what happens, it could be entertaining.

[Elsie]

You are correct, I did not know restornu was back, and thought Saundra had left.

Her leaving us in January:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2836065/posts?page=160#160

[Elsie]

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/765608255/Ground-broken-for-LDS-temple-in-Indiana.html?pg=all

 

 

 

 

 

It is on the corner of West 116th Street and Spring Mill Road on a 48-acre parcel that will include

"a church building and living quarters for the temple's president," Star reporter Michael Boren wrote.

 

 

The Star quoted Area Authority Seventy Elder J. Christopher Lansing saying during the groundbreaking

that for Latter-day Saints, "all roads lead to the temple, regardless of who you are, young or old."

 

 

 

(It was not recorded that the FACTS of the matter indicate the road will be a DEAD-END

for those MORMONs without a current Temple Recommend card - approximately only 15% have them.)

[Nifster]

It was pagan. Ishtar and Tamuz and Nimrod. It was a pagan legend that involved death and ‘resurrection’ held in the spring time. And is your question did it happen before God had the first passover? The stories and history says yes it was before the time of the pharaoh’s. Passover is not Easter and Easter is not Passover. Do not confuse the two. But the question is truly beside the point.