Posted on 09/20/2012 8:34:19 AM PDT by Salvation
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The prayer composed and taught by Christ to the Disciples (Matthew 6:9-13; Luke 11:2-4). Named from the first two words of the prayer in the Latin, Pater Noster (Our Father). The Pater Noster has been part of the Church's liturgy since apostolic times. It was part of the profession of faith for the reception of catechumens into the Church, has more commentary by the Fathers and Doctors of the Church than any other passage in the Bible, and, after baptism, is the best known bond of unity among Christians in every tradition. Its seven petitions are a synthesis of the faith, and its balanced structure is an expression of the true hierarchy of values, first the things of God, and then the needs of man. The longer ending among Protestants, "For thine is the kingdom, the power, and the glory, now and forever," was added in the sixteenth century. It was originally a liturgical ending, which the Catholic Church has recently incorporated into the Eucharistic Prayer of the Mass.
See Also: OUR FATHER
The Lord's Prayer, taught by Christ in answer to a request by the Disciples to teach them how to pray. As recited in the Catholic Church, it says: "Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name; they kingdom come; thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread; and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us; and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. Amen." It consists of seven petitions, of which the first three are concerned with the interests of God, and the last four are requests for divine assistance to man. The single most commented on words of the Bible, the Our Father, is also the common heritage of all Christians, which synthesizes their common belief in the Fatherhood of God, the primacy of the divine over the human, the need for prayer to obtain grace, the source of morality in doing the will of God, and the struggle with evil as a condition for salvation. The longer ending, with the words "For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory," used by Protestants, is a liturgical addition that found its way into some manuscripts of the New Testament but was not part of the original biblical text, either in Matthew (6:9-13 or Luke (11:2-4).
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Why the Our Father is a Pro-Life Prayer, Part 3
Why the Our Father is a Pro-life Prayer, Part 2
Why the Our Father is a Pro-life Prayer, Part 1
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith. Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, The Lord’s Prayer
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, The Invocation: Our Father, Who Art in Heaven”
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray; First Petition: “Hallowed Be Thy Name”
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord,Teach Us To Pray, Second Petition: “Thy Kingdom Come”
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, Third Petition: “Thy Will Be Done on Earth as It Is in Heaven"
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, Fourth Petition: “Give Us This Day Our Daily Bread"
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four:Lord, Teach Us To Pray, Fifth Petition: “Forgive Us Our Trespasses As We Forgive Those Who Trespass Against Us”
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, Sixth Petition: “Lead Us Not into Temptation"
The Essentials of the Catholic Faith, Part Four: Lord, Teach Us To Pray, Seventh Petition: “Deliver Us from Evil. Amen”
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Now if Roman Catholics (and perhaps most of the Protestant community) just understand what Jesus was saying, they would quit using this “many words” saying to feel religious.
Do you really want to be forgiven, “exactly the way you forgive”? If so, you are still under the Law and obligated to fulfill it all (Gal. 3:10). Good hermeneutics and abandoning the “traditions of men” will begin to open eyes...if God allows.
"ton arton hemon ton epiousion"
"give us this day our supersubstantial bread" - Matthew 6:11
In simpler terms; give us the Eucharist.
Peace be with you
Yet another misuse of the Scripture. Your reference has Jesus teaching the Jew the full impact of the Law and its consequence. Notice Matt. 7:12, a telling remark in this so-called "Sermon on the Mount". Tragically, many Gentiles have read the mail to the Jewish tribes in the early part of the "Gospels" and failed to notice that we were not grafted in until the blood was shed (Eph. 2:11ff). The result? Much non-existent "religion" appended to their perception of the Gospel.
Good hermeneutics? Read the information after the resurrection...there is the Gospel. You have been saved by grace, through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God. Big organizations cannot tolerate being set aside by grace. Thus...pater nosters.
Grace to you, my FRiend.
The post is about a prayer that Our Lord taught us to recite. Your conclusion above is a non sequitur.
The history of Christianity is full of sincere people disagreeing over what the Revealed Word of God is and means. One man's scripturally based orthodoxy is another's heresy and visa versa. I suspect that only God knows for sure an how we react to these contradictions is a test of our understanding of the bigger message about love and forgiveness.
Stepping away from arguments (not quarrels) over Scripture St. Thomas Aquinas taught that love between us is best characterized not by our direct thoughts and feelings toward each other, but by those things that we together love. He called this transcendental third. For example you will have those in your life that you love because they share your love of a football team, or fishing, or a political philosophy, or a hobby. You love your family because you love the "us" more than any one member.
Similarly, those of us who love Jesus above all else, even though we differ on doctrine and dogma, share something truly special and have a bond greater than the sectarian rancor and strife seen in these threads. As I continue my conversion I can honestly say that, because you love Him, I love you.
I have learned much in these threads, some directly from those of you who oppose Catholicism and much more by researching and praying over the serious questions raised. I will not try to dissuade you from your opinions and beliefs, but only try to live out mine. Maybe, by example and not sectarian rhetoric we can continue to learn from each other.
Peace be with you.
You did not read the entire interchange. Please review that and then respond.
Here is a perfect example of the way personal, man-made traditions get started: I suspect...
The text has a perspicuity that lends itself to ordinary readers who have been granted the eyes to see. Perhaps there is where you ought to begin. Aquinas was a philosopher much more than a biblicist.
The text is the precious Word of God and explains the Gospel in great detail...but it simply does not support Rome. While you may believe that you are not trying to dissuade me of this perspective, I am not so naive. I am with all the effort I can muster trying to dissuade you from following the traditions of men as promulgated by Rome. They teach an unbiblical message of "religion" that comes dangerously close to the Judaizers' return to Law which Paul despised. In any event, many of those entrapped by Rome may be rescued, but it will be in spite of the teachings, not because of them.
—— I am with all the effort I can muster trying to dissuade you from following the traditions of men as promulgated by Rome.-—
To follow the tradition of Luther? Not much of a trade.
There isn’t any historical evidence of his doctrine of “the Bible ALONE,” prior to the invention of the printing press. Gutenberg made Luther’s heresy possible.
—— I am with all the effort I can muster trying to dissuade you from following the traditions of men as promulgated by Rome.-—
To follow the tradition of Luther? Not much of a trade.
There isn’t any historical evidence of his doctrine of “the Bible ALONE,” prior to the invention of the printing press. Gutenberg made Luther’s heresy possible.
Certainly not. I suspect Luther would not want that any more than you do. The only "tradition" one ought to follow is the Gospel as described in the text which addresses the wider audience following the resurrection. Read the letter to the Romans if you want a clear understanding.
Tragically, there is much evidence of the errant traditions of Rome as they departed this message. Simply consider their positions: The sacerdotalism, the genuflecting, the absolution of sins, the Eucharist (transubstantiation), the threats of purgatory, the sale of indulgences, the cathedrals, the pope & pope-mobiles, the mariolatry, the icons, the canonization of men, the sacraments, the inquisitions, and we could go on, and on, and on. As error compounded error, the Roman Catholic organization wandered further from pure biblical truth into a man-made religion.
The body of real believers (always a minority in the world of religion) has existed whenever and wherever the Holy Spirit blew like a holy wind. Rome will not be able to overpower His mighty work, in spite of winning numbers. Besides, Islam will soon win that race. Read the text and ignore your self-aggrandizing history. You will be amazed at grace...if you are among the elect.
Where did the Bible come from? If Jesus didn’t write it or compile it, how do you know that it’s inerrant?
Your question appears to be a departure from the topic at hand. How do you know that you exist? How far is up? Stay on the topic. If you would like to discuss your side matter, we shall do so at another time. Right now we are dealing with repetitious sayings (like the so-called "Pater Noster") and where they derive.
I maintain that these are a part of man-made traditions of the Roman organization born of a poor use of the Scriptures. That is, bad hermeneutics. We all likely hold that the Bible is the Word of God, an entirely different topic.
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