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Posted on 09/09/2012 3:08:47 PM PDT by CHRISTIAN DIARIST
A recent sermon by Pastor David Jeremiah has been weighing heavily upon my mind.
He recounted the true-life story of contemporaries William Franklin Graham and Charles Templeton, up and coming young evangelists who began their ministries during the 1940s.
Most thought Templeton, rather than Graham, would achieve greater things in the name of the Lord.
But, in fact, the former fell away from his Christian faith – actually declaring himself atheist – while the great Billy Graham remained a good and faithful servant of the Most High.
Pastor Jeremiah shared the story of Graham and Templeton to remind his congregation (as well as those of us watching on TV or listening on radio) that, as Christ followers, “we are expected to run with endurance the race that has been set before us.”
Yet, in his next breath, the pastor said that, while Templeton did not finish the race he started, he still has a place in God’s kingdom.
Because, said Pastor Jeremiah, it mattered not that Templeton renounced the Christian faith he espoused as a young evangelist, nor that he went to his grave an atheist, since he one time gave his life to the Lord, he’s secure for all eternity.
That is the doctrine preached in many, if not most Christian churches, with which I have the most difficulty:
Once saved, always saved.
No matter how it is preached, or by whom it is preached – including Pastor Jeremiah, whom I greatly admire – I am unable to accept it.
For why would the Apostle Paul encourage us to run with endurance the race set before us if simply answering an altar call one Sunday gives us a lifetime Get Out Of Hell Free card?
And speaking of the Apostle Paul, suppose his life story was reversed. Suppose he spent the first part of his adult life preaching Christ’s salvation, but the second part persecuting Christians.
Would he be today in Paradise?
I think not.
“For it is impossible,” the Scripture warns, “for those who were once enlightened and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, if they fall away, to renew them again unto repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.”
The takeaway from that Scripture is that it is not enough to give our lives to Christ for a season, then fall away from our faith. We do not have a free pass to sin as it pleases us. We are expected to abide in Christ, as He abides in us; to live our lives according to his Word.
So those of us who believe ourselves saved should not be deceived. The Scripture warns, “Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.”
Those who abide in such sins will spend eternity separated from their Creator. Even if they were one-time Christ followers, like Charles Templeton.
Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:
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How do you reconcile your personal interpretation of that against the dozen scriptural quotes that salvation posted?
Finally, FINALLY, a Baptist bashing thread. Its to be expected since Romney is Mormon, so hands off Mormons for now, and Obama has been doing so much Catholic bashing.
I believe jesus has already chosen who he wants. The saved or jesus’s chosen is already written in the book of life- He has explained in the bible that the road to hell is wide while the road to heaven is narrow. everybody wont make it
This is exactly what I'm talking about when I wrote "immature." You are completely missing the spiritual context of the scripture.
So, what you think John 3:16 actually means is those who "believe" in God's Son, may also perish, even if you believe in his son.
This is why it's so hard for a prideful man to hear God. If you think you control your salvation based on whether you "sin" or not
after you've accepted Christ, you're still drinking milk!
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,
that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Now, I can show you many versions of this scripture that does not use "MAY." What Bible are you quoting from? Furthermore, your misinterpreting "may."
When I asked for salvation, did he not know- better than even I knew- the extent of the grace he was granting me?
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Yes God knew and knows your future and what your about to do— the Bible is mostly predictions of the future and things to come.. Jesus himself told peter ahead of time that he would deny him 3 times— and he did
So what? I posted the Scripture in it’s entire context rather than a single verse. What’s your problem with Scripture you personally did not post? I guess you’re not aware that the KJV is inaccurate in quite a few places and those inaccuracies are part and parcel of the errors so many folks believe these days.
Get the Greek and you’ll find that what I posted is accurate and what you post from the KJV is not.
have a nice day
So far, I can't think of one battle that I've won yet....
So I have to ask: is the textbook the professor?
I will leave the details for someone more motivated this evening to document.
Suffice it to say, only God knows who is saved. The once saved, always saved camp believe that once the Holy Spirit is dwelling inside a person, they cannot go back. they may stumble but they will not fall away.
The always saved camp believes that a person can for a variety of reasons insincerely accept Christ. It is such person that can fall away since they were never saved in the first place.
“Or Judas, who knew the gospel, professed faith, walked with Jesus, actually kissed Him - yet betrayed Christ.”
The Bible tells us clearly that this was taken out of Judas’ hands. When he asked Jesus who the betrayer would be, Jesus handed him the bread, then the Devil entered Judas. Jesus then said, to the Devil, “What you are going to do, do quickly.”
Even after the betrayal Jesus said, “Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one.” If Judas was damned then what did that mean?
I think of every snide comment I can make but keep to myself as a little win.
see post 52- “the son of perdition” is Judas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_of_perdition
In John 17:12, Jesus, in reference to Judas Iscariot, says that of all his disciples, none has been lost except the “son of perdition”.
Presumably there is more background to the story than we are told in scripture. Judas may have felt slighted by some perceived favor Christ showed to a rival disciple.
The Apostle Paul, who wrote much of the NT, inspired by the Holy Spirit understood that what God begins, He completes. The same grace and power of God that saves us; is the same grace and power that keeps us. Neither are by our own works. I cannot save myself, and I cannot keep myself, only God can; and He has promised that He will. Can God die spiritually? No! When I was born again, God supernatually changed me, he gave me a divine spiritual nature, defined as the new man. It is a divine nature empowered with perseverance that will take me through to the very end.
"Therefore, there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ."
Once you're in, you're in, you've made the final decision. A decision that is sealed with the blood of Christ, with the Holy Spirit, and secured by the Father Himself. There is no turning back for those who are TRULY IN. According to John, those who turn back, were never really genuine. They professed, but never really possessed.
I'm not even saying MAY is not correct, I'm saying you are misinterpreting it in context.
You get the greek and show me I don't have time to look it up. If you're so inclined to get into this I will, but be prepared with facts not some vague, bogus interpretation.
I will have nice day, thank you.
bump for later.
Which is why after thirty years as a Lutheran and a decade of study I became a Catholic. The One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church has taught the same things ever since 33 AD and those things all are in agreement with Scripture. Only the Catholic Church can trace the authority to interpret Scripture back to Christ and the Apostles. The various and sundry spirits folks claim to be relying on can't possibly all be the Holy Spirit and lead to tens of thousands of different denominations. There's even, for example, many an argument over the word "whosoever" in John 3:16 just like there are arguments over "may" or "should" meaning the same thing as "will".
Those who prefer to read the Scripture through the glasses of their own preconceptions with the aid of whatever spirit happens to be hanging around are free to disagree.
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