Posted on 07/30/2010 7:57:36 AM PDT by NYer
Novelist Anne Rice remains committed to Christ. But she is quitting Christianity.
The “Interview With The Vampire” author, who in recent years has spoken publicly about her faith and written a series of novels tracing the life of Jesus, wrote on her Facebook page Wednesday that she was finished with organized Christianity.
For those who care, and I understand if you don't: Today I quit being a Christian. I'm out. I remain committed to Christ as always but not to being "Christian" or to being part of Christianity. It's simply impossible for me to "belong" to this quarrelsome, hostile, disputatious, and deservedly infamous group. For ten years, I've tried. I've failed. I'm an outside. My conscience will allow nothing else.
She followed that post a few minutes later with more details:
As I said below, I quit being a Christian. I'm out. In the name of Christ, I refuse to be anti-gay. I refuse to be anti-feminist. I refuse to be anti-artificial birth control. I refuse to be anti-Democrat. I refuse to be anti-secular humanism. I refuse to be anti-science. I refuse to be anti-life. In the name of Christ, I quit Christianity and being Christian. Amen.
On Thursday, Rice posted a series of passages from the New Testament:
Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household.
But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.
(Excerpt) Read more at weblogs.baltimoresun.com ...
You know, it seems to me that the key to true biblical humility is to hold oneself as a nothing, and to submit to others more knowledgeable when in doubt on points of interpreration.
NYer has been humble, but you fail the test. You can't be a Christian without being humble.
No, consider this, please:
21"You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, 'Do not murder,[a] and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.' 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother[b]will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,[c]' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.
23"Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, 24leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift.
Since you're literate, I'm sure you will understand these words, and that you owe someone an apology.
For your own eternal good, of course.
-Theo
‘Do you know allot of Catholics vote for Demoncrats in the name of “social justice”? Many Catholics voted for Obama and see what he stands for being in line with Catholic teachings.’
And so did many protestants, especially mainstream protestants.
I haven't read the whole thread, but I hope you realize that was a cheap shot, way wrong...and beneath you.
And so did many protestants, especially mainstream protestants.”
That was my silent point to Nyer. The Catholic Church advocates “social justice”. Just what is that? Why, it's what Obama wants - leveling the financial playing field through wealth redistribution. Then life on earth will be “fair”. This has more appeal to Catholic over Protestants.
My direct points were these:
“Luther opened Pandora's box when he said anyone could interpret scripture. Here is yet another victim.”
Really?
How do you explain “gay” Priests?
They're not “anti-gay” either.
Do you know allot of Catholics vote for Demoncrats in the name of “social justice”? Many Catholics voted for Obama and see what he stands for being in line with Catholic teachings.
If I were you, I'd pipe down and save my venom for the individual rather than broad brush a group, namely Protestants, that you HATE.
The Catholic Church has more than enough embarrassment and wrong headed teachings. Thankfully Luther brought singing back into the church by the congregation and pointed out it is FAITH that saves you, not works. Faith is dead without works but it is FAITH that has you doing works for Him through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
Eph. 2:8&9
[8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
[9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.
The Catholic Church is having HUGE financial problems due to paying off folks molested by Priests. Oh, the church could easily get in the black, if they sold off some useless relics but they won't do that ... .
I am not “anti Catholic”. I find it sad that MANY Catholic Schools are closing. Catholics do acknowledge Christ and there is some common ground but if I were you, I certainly wouldn't be haughty about Catholicism and the never ending scandals etc. that are nonstop with the Catholic Church.
What we have here, is a woman that never knew Christ. If she did, she wouldn't be making such silly statements. Her statements are opposite what is written in the Bible. Like others, she is creating her own humanistic religion. This is nothing new ... .
Perhaps you could gently ask NYer to keep her Protestant hostility to a low roar. I've never read in the Bible that we are to HATE and PROVOKE others to anger. I find her comments deplorable,unnecessary and a nasty attempt to hijack the thread to an off topic. I fail to see “love” in them.
NYer's unnecessary remarks were out of the blue, haughty and certainly unchristian. Perhaps she should spend some time with the Bible? Her actions are certainly not applauded by Christ! How is Nyer so much better than this lost soul who the thread is about? Neither seems to "get it".
No! Yah'shua clearly said:
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name,
Seek the face of YHvH in His WORD.
He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.
So JAK, are you saying that anybody can read the text, but without knowing the context of the text, that comprehension is almost impossible especially if the context is not understood?
Her flaky beliefs would be right at home there.
She has so totally been “Eclipsed” by the Twilight (and True Blood) sagas. She is irrelevant. You can’t be a Christian and still support immorality. I can see her conundrum. You can try to do it, but it gets harder and harder. I used to have gay friends. I can still be kind and courteous to gay people, but it gets harder and harder to ignore the coprophilia that goes on behind closed doors.
Thanks!
It's not the chore you imply. It is an obligation of every individual who wishes to follow Him to SEEK Him.
This hasn't changed:
Deut.4:29
[29] But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.
Who does He love?
Prov.8:17
[17] I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.
Here's another beseeching you to SEEK Him:
Matt.7: 7,8
[7] Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
[8] For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Anyone that reads the Bible KNOWS that.
“I begrudge no man the effort he has put into being a priest and the extra insight it gives him into the scriptures. What is more important than the scriptures is having the communion with the Holy Ghost that will let you apply the Holy Word in your own life. The same scriptural reference may have different meanings for different people and all of them be correct.”
I don't blame anyone for studying to show thyself approved however not all “study” is worthy nor does it have His approval.
2Tim.2:15
[15] Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
“The advantage the Catholic church has is that they have a person on earth where the buck stops.”
No, that is not Biblical. We have the Bible to look for His wisdom. If you are honest about Catholic Church history, you cannot deny the flip flops that go on all the time on “doctrine”. At one time Popes were married ... is a more neutral one ... .
“The bible (at least to my knowledge) does not have a well spoken reference to abortion yet the Pope says it is wrong.”
When you KNOW the nature of God, through reading the Bible, it is common sense to know that abortion is wrong.
Did you know heathens would offer their babies as sacrifices to their phony gods? That's in the Bible and strongly condemned. While a person may not be “sacrificing” their babies to a god when having an abortion it is premeditated murder.
If there is any doubt, one of the Ten Commandments clears that up by stating we should not murder. Abortion is clearly murdering or killing a human being. Our nature is sinful but a baby has not had the chance to do anything wrong yet! I'm sure you can see the connection between abortion being wrong without God explicitly using the word abortion in the Bible.
He cares so much about children, that this verse often comes up on FR in defense of aborting babies or molesting children. BTW, not just one, but THREE disciples stated it.
Matt.18:6
[6] But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark.9:42
[42] And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke.17:2
[2] It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
“Many Protestant churches do not agree.”
Clearly many Catholic Churches do not agree on doctrine. You have your general Catholics, Jesuits, Roman Catholics etc.. Their teachings VARY. They are NOT identical teachings. You also have your godless liberal Catholic Churches. The same problems are with the Catholic Church.
“If Christ is the head of their churches how can there be more than one answer to such an important question.”
Christ is the head of the body of believers.
We are specifically warned AGAINST another MAN'S FOUNDATION.
Rom.15:19-21
[19] Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
[20] Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
[21] But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
1 Cor. 3:11
[11] For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
It Christ that is the foundation for believers and followers of Him.
I don't want to get side tracked from this question:
“If Christ is the head of their churches how can there be more than one answer to such an important question.”
Since when has a sinner been completely obedient to God? Why do you assume the blame is with God? It isn't. The blame is on fallible sinners, with an agenda to preach and teach what they PREFER over His Word made flesh. It's always been that way and all the more reason to stay with the Bible rather than elevate man's words. The Holy Spirit will NOT, absolutely NOT abandon you when you seek God.
“When I look for churches I will not consider a church which does not have the moral strength to say no to a horrendous practice like abortion. “
I have no problem with that. I believe that is one of others tenants you should look for.
“When you look for churches with the “right” answer you must also ask how they got that answer.”
I most certainly do just that!
“There are but a few churches that can answer that in a good way. Not that there are few churches against abortion but that there are few churches that make the decision based on communion with God through The Holy Ghost.”
I agree, if they are trying to follow Him on the topic of abortion, the Holy Ghost will make clear that this is wrong. Also the Bible confirms it through letting you get to know His nature. It's impossible to ignore what He really wants from us, when you read His Word.
There is a real lack of understanding there. Christians aren’t called to be “anti-gay person”, but we are called to not call evil good and good evil. I suspect that what she really wants is to not have to say homosexuality is a sin.
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Thanks for so many conflicting statements. That is my point.
God is not the author of confusion. There are many people that are trying with all their hearts to follow The Savior to best of their ability yet they have many different ideas, beliefs on what the bible says. There are people who belong to different faiths that have differing views on what the Gospel is and What the Bible means. I was not supporting any one particular Church. Certainly I was not advocating the Roman Catholic Church with it's varied historical problems as better than another. What I did say was that a church like The Catholic Church has an advantage because with one head on earth to speak for The Savior who they say is the head of their church, they can stop confusion in the bud.
If the Pope really does commune with God and really does hold the keys of the priesthood which Christ gave to Peter for good reason then he really should be who all Christians look to for leadership on earth. If the forgoing is true then when the Pope says the Holy Bible says this or that then that is what it says.
If Luther was right and did the right thing by leaving the church then did he inherit the Keys of Peter? What I want to know is who has them now. I would say that the Pope has a better claim on them than most. That is not to say that he has them but why would The Savior give them at all just to take them away. If they were needed two thousand years ago surly they are need now more than ever.
Individual scholarship in search of the truth I believe is a very good thing. To be puffed up in pride is likewise a very bad thing. It is not fortunately up to me to judge anybody and their beliefs but I will try to be as warm in the faith as I can possibly be.
When ever I see someone saying they are saved by grace alone then what I really hear is that they don't have to prove their faith. That whether they are good or bad is immaterial only that they profess Christ. James says show me your works and I'll show you your faith. In that respect I agree with you that by faith through grace you are saved. Without the works you don't really have faith and are an empty vessel, like tinkling brass, making noise but having no value.
I read and study the scriptures. I am grateful for those who have studied much more than me and have been able to give me wonderful insights I would not have had by just reading The Word.
Allow me to translate: "I got divorced, and asked if I could marry again in Church. I was told that, since marriage is indisoluble, I could petition for a decree of nullity, which would involve an investigation of whether my first marriage was, in fact, valid to begin with, and with the understanding that my case would be determined on the evidence presented with no guarantees. Since the good people who work in the marriage tribunal do so full time, those making such a petition are asked to remit a filing fee, with the understanding that no one is denied the opportunity to make a petition solely on the grounds that they can't afford the fee. In my particular diocese, that fee is $400. Since it's an involved process which takes a lot of time and effort on my part, it's much easier for me to simply quit the Church, and misrepresent what I was told."
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Whether or not you believe the marriage is indisoluble, it great to have a pope with keys to undo the marriage on earth and in heaven. That is of course if you believe the pope has those keys.
If you are a Roman Catholic of course you believe he does. If you are a Protestant you have to believe like Luther that he does not. If you believe like Luther then you have to believe that the Roman Catholic church is a dead church and not truly Christian since it went astray. If it is a dead church the question must be asked, “What day or year did it go astray?” Until you can find the point when it was not true it is hard to say it is not true.
If it did not go astray then the Protestant had no reason to leave and the Popes excommunication of all Protestants must stand. A real conundrum here.
Splinter. Beam.
I don’t need a child-molesting priesthood to interpret scripture for me either.
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I’ve never met any of the child molesters but I have met a lot of very selfless priest who have dedicated their lives to The Lord through The Church.
If their church was wrong but they thought they were dedicating themselves to The Saviors service from what they read in the Holy Bible which has been said to be the only authority we need on earth then are they wrong?
In the Old Testament we had Prophets. In the New Testament The Lord left us with his Apostles and Peter at the head. Why would he leave us devoid of such leadership for 2000 years?
You clearly did not read my response to Mr. K. carefully. In any case, no one believes the Pope has "keys" to dissolve a valid marriage. What the Church does possess is the ability to determine, based on the objective criteria of what constitutes a valid marriage, whether a particular union was, in fact, a valid marriage. A decree of nullity does not dissolve a valid marriage; it is a declaration which states that, after investigation, what was believed to have been a valid marriage was not because certain conditions required for any marriage to be valid did not exist at the time the marriage occured, and that this deficiency was unknown to the parties involved at the time.
According to Herr Docktor: Who, but the devil, has granted such license of wresting the words of the holy Scripture? Who ever read in the Scriptures, that my body is the same as the sign of my body? or, that is is the same as it signifies? What language in the world ever spoke so? It is only then the devil, that imposes upon us by these fanatical men. Not one of the Fathers of the Church, though so numerous, ever spoke as the Sacramentarians: not one of them ever said, It is only bread and wine; or, the body and blood of Christ is not there present.
Surely, it is not credible, nor possible, since they often speak, and repeat their sentiments, that they should never (if they thought so) not so much as once, say, or let slip these words: It is bread only; or the body of Christ is not there, especially it being of great importance, that men should not be deceived. Certainly, in so many Fathers, and in so many writings, the negative might at least be found in one of them, had they thought the body and blood of Christ were not really present: but they are all of them unanimous
Luther’s Collected Works, Wittenburg Edition, no. 7 p, 391
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