Posted on 02/12/2010 2:03:10 PM PST by Graybeard58
VATICAN CITY -- Pope John Paul II whipped himself with a belt, even on vacation, and slept on the floor as acts of penitence and to bring him closer to Christian perfection, according to a new book by the Polish prelate spearheading his sainthood case.
The book "Why He's a Saint" also includes previously unpublished speeches and documents written by John Paul, including one 1989 signed memo in which he said he would resign if he became incapacitated.
The book also reported for the first time that John Paul forgave his would-be assassin in the ambulance on the way to the hospital moments after he was shot on May 13, 1981, in St. Peter's Square. And it reported that he initially thought his attacker was a member of the Italian terrorist organization the Red Brigades.
The book was written by Monsignor Slawomir Oder, the postulator, or main promoter, for John Paul's canonization cause and was released Tuesday. It was based on the testimony of the 114 witnesses and boxes of documentation Oder gathered on John Paul's life to support the case.
At a news conference Tuesday, Oder defended John Paul's practice of self-mortification, which some faithful use to remind them of the suffering of Jesus on the cross.
"It's an instrument of Christian perfection," Oder said, responding to questions about how such a practice could be condoned considering Catholic teaching holds that the human body is a gift from God.
In the book, Oder wrote that John Paul frequently denied himself food -- especially during the holy season of Lent -- and "frequently spent the night on the bare floor," messing up his bed in the morning so he wouldn't draw attention to his act of penitence.
"But it wasn't limited to this. As some members of his close entourage
(Excerpt) Read more at suntimes.com ...
“Fasting is prescribed in scripture,,but not self flagellation.”
So nothing that is not explicitly, in so many words, prescribed in Scripture, may be practiced?
Is posting on Free Republic prescribed in Scripture?
Is driving an automobile prescribed in Scripture?
Is using a computer prescribed in Scripture?
Is aerobic exercise prescribed in Scripture?
Is milking a cow prescribed in Scripture?
Is playing a piano prescribed in Scripture?
Is watching TV prescribed in Scripture?
Is voting in a primary election prescribed in Scripture?
Is watching Fox News prescribed in Scripture? CNN? MSNBC?
Is voting for Sarah Palin prescribed in Scripture?
Is changing the oil in your car prescribed in Scripture?
Is going into the hospital for surgery prescribed in Scripture?
Is eating filet mignon prescribed in Scripture?
Is wearing a coat and tie prescribed in Scripture?
Is joining the NRA prescribed in Scripture?
When you come up with an credible method for interpreting Scripture, let us all know.
This may explain why the superstitions of Rome are so attractive.
Sorry, that doesn't make sense.
Sound Theology is scripturally based.. when thinking about cars read a manual on your car, Join the NRA, read the membership requirements. need surgery, explore the options with surgeons
Your list is meaningless because it evades the question.. does scripture teach us that one way to deal with our sin is to beat our body to produce pain.. is masochism a sacrament?
We had a Savior that was beat for us, flagellated for our sin.. who do we think we are that we can better what he did in our place? That is either spiritual ignorance or tremendous spiritual pride..
1 Peter 2:4 He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed.
That is PAST tense.. "it is finished"
Is training to be a Navy Seal masochism? Is training for the Boston Marathon masochism? Is diet and exercise masochism? Is training for Everest masochism? Is doing anything difficult and unpleasant masochism? Is giving birth without drugs masochism? Is life supposed to be lived without discipline, without sacrifice, without working up a sweat? Is fasting masochism?
I lost faith in Timothy Dolan when 1) he allowed Weakland to be present at his installation, and then to continue living in the diocese and doing Confirmations; 2) He failed to announce (at his installation), “I am instituting a $20-Million fund for the restoration of the cathedral, to undo everything Weakland did to it.”
My faith in Dolan has not been restored. He announced, shortly after arriving in New York, that he intends to defy Canon 915, like the majority of American bishops.
http://tinyurl.com/canon915
http://tinyurl.com/pont915
http://tinyurl.com/southbendscandal
Matthew 4: 1 1 Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil. 2 He fasted for forty days and forty nights, 2 and afterwards he was hungry. 3 The tempter approached and said to him, "If you are the Son of God, command that these stones become loaves of bread." 4 3 He said in reply, "It is written: 'One does not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes forth from the mouth of God.'" 5 4 Then the devil took him to the holy city, and made him stand on the parapet of the temple, 6 and said to him, "If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down. For it is written: 'He will command his angels concerning you and 'with their hands they will support you, lest you dash your foot against a stone.'" 7 Jesus answered him, "Again it is written, 'You shall not put the Lord, your God, to the test.'" 8 Then the devil took him up to a very high mountain, and showed him all the kingdoms of the world in their magnificence, 9 and he said to him, "All these I shall give to you, if you will prostrate yourself and worship me." 5 10 At this, Jesus said to him, "Get away, Satan! It is written: 'The Lord, your God, shall you worship and him alone shall you serve.'" 11 Then the devil left him and, behold, angels came and ministered to him.
Hebrews 12:10 Our fathers disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, that we may share in his holiness. 11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it. 12 Therefore, strengthen your feeble arms and weak knees
Matthew 3: 1 Now in those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea, saying, 2 “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” 3 For this is the one referred to by Isaiah the prophet when he said, “THE VOICE OF ONE CRYING IN THE WILDERNESS, ‘MAKE READY THE WAY OF THE LORD, MAKE HIS PATHS STRAIGHT!’” 4 Now John himself had a garment of camel’s hair and a leather belt around his waist; and his food was locusts and wild honey. 1 Peter 2:12 Therefore, since Christ suffered in his body, arm yourselves also with the same attitude, because he who has suffered in his body is done with sin.
Matthew 11:21 “Woe to you, Korazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the Day of Judgment than for you. 23 And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted up to the skies? No, you will go down to the depths. If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day. 24 But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.”
Acts 14:22 Strengthening the disciples and encouraging them to remain true to the faith. “We must go through many hardships to enter the kingdom of God,” they said. 23 Paul and Barnabas appointed elders for them in each church and, with prayer and fasting, committed them to the Lord, in whom they had put their trust
Colossians 1:24 Now I rejoice in what was suffered for you, and I fill up in my flesh what is still lacking in regard to Christ’s afflictions, for the sake of his body, which is the church.
Romans 5:3 Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4 Perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5 And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.
Acts 13:1 In the church at Antioch there were prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Simeon called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen (who had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch) and Saul. 2 While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.” 3 So after they had fasted and prayed, they placed their hands on them and sent them off. 4 The two of them, sent on their way by the Holy Spirit, went down to Seleucia and sailed from there to Cyprus.
Daniel 9:3 So I turned to the Lord God and pleaded with him in prayer and petition, in fasting, and in sackcloth and ashes. 4 I prayed to Yahweh my God and confessed: “O Lord, the great and awesome God, who keeps his covenant of love with all who love him and obey his commands, 5 We have sinned and done wrong. We have been wicked and have rebelled; we have turned away from your commands and laws.
Daniel 10:2 At that time I, Daniel, mourned for three weeks. 3 I ate no choice food; no meat or wine touched my lips; and I used no lotions at all until the three weeks were over.
Psalms 35: 11 Malicious witnesses come forward, accuse me of things I do not know. 12 They repay me evil for good and I am all alone. 13 3 Yet I, when they were ill, put on sackcloth, afflicted myself with fasting, sobbed my prayers upon my bosom.
The purpose of fasting and mortification is not masochism. It is the focusing of one's soul upon humility. Sackcloth and ashes; the mortification practiced by the first Christians, is to focus one upon Christ, and to remove one's ego as the primary focus of one's life.
He’s following the lead of Rush Limbaugh.
I used to teach next door to the Cathedral and know it well - At least they took down the picture Weakland had painted of himself up with the Saints and Prophets.
He announced, shortly after arriving in New York, that he intends to defy Canon 915...
Ahh, once again all that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to....
It seems to me that the Pope could’ve beaten himself all he wanted to. But I wouldn’t do it.
I don't think I was incoherent. Maybe to you, since you seem to be looking for a fight and defending JPII more than you are paying attention to what I'm saying. That I write incoherently would be news to the people who employ me as an editor and have provided me with real money for my work over the last forty years.
I hope they also took out the lying plaque that said that the great Rembert had carried out the remodeling according to the directives of Vatican II—which issued NO directives about remodeling churches.
So what was he training for "purgatory "where he could pay for more of his sin?
Purgatory is not about payment.
PURGatory is about being PURGED of your sin.. so yea it is payment for the "veinal" sins in your life
" Q. What is Purgatory?
A. Purgatory is the state in which those suffer for a time who die guilty of venial sins, or without having satisfied for the punishment due to their sins. "
Purgatory is one way to steal the glory from Christ and His finished work.. It makes the cross of Christ of no effect... Just as self flagellation does !
To wit.
I see neither there nor anywhere else any evidence that he acted “for the sake of apparent piety and holiness”.
How do you figure?
That was exactly the point - even MacArthur's analysis leaves John Paul II uncondemned.
Excuse me, but why are we discussing him in public then? How did it leak out? Wake up sheeple! You have a bunch of self-righteous, self-aggrandizing, self-justifying power mongers controlling your lives. There is freedom in Christ, without the chains of Rome. Their stuff is toxic, self-made religion Paul warns against. Repent Rome, if you can.
I repeat your AMEN to this, Dr. E.
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