Posted on 11/30/2009 6:01:03 PM PST by delacoert
I’ll just leave this here…
Before a defense of any kind of religious discrimination, one ought to make all of the necessary disclaimers: of course I oppose government-sponsored discrimination, and I certainly would not support the kind of absurd treatment described by Steven Reinhart in his piece featured below. That being said, there is a legitimate case to be made for judging any candidate for office by his religious convictions.
In late 2007, Mitt Romney made his somewhat-famous speech on religion, where he spoke the following words:
“Freedom requires religion just as religion requires freedom. Freedom opens the windows of the soul so that man can discover his most profound beliefs and commune with God. Freedom and religion endure together, or perish alone.”
Similarly, Romney has stated: “I believe in my Mormon faith and I endeavor to live by it…my faith is the faith of my fathers. I will be true to them and to my beliefs.”
If freedom requires religion, if his Mormon faith sustains his life and he will be true to those practices, then I’m at an utter loss as to why we should ignore Romney’s religious beliefs when evaluating his fitness for the White House.
We ask plenty of questions of any Evangelical Christian candidate: what do his beliefs about the nature of God, the nature of the cosmos, and the meaning of man’s life mean for his potential tenure in office? But for whatever reason, these questions are looked at as unnecessarily piercing and prejudiced when asked of a member of a minority faith.
When Sarah Palin gave her fumbling answer about Israel’s settlements, several commentators jumped on her faith, wondering whether she subscribed to the bizarre but potent sect of modern Christianity that believes in the imminence of the End Times. Will anyone ask Mitt Romney about the oddities of the dogma of the Mormon Church? There are plenty of Mormon doctrines that may strike people as a bit odd — and rightly so. It is established in the church that the devout can reach the upper echelons of heaven and eventually become gods themselves, able to create their own universes and govern them as they see fit (all while supervised by the One True God). Why is it that when I bring this up to Romney fans, I am dismissed as a bigot?
As an atheist, I both understand and accept that in a predominantly Christian society, my thoughts on religion are necessarily going to open me up to questions. If I were to ever run for office (don’t count on that, by the way), I would not expect my supporters would try to ward off any questions about my atheism with the victim-card of discrimination. One’s philosophy of religion contributes profoundly to his worldview and thus is a completely valid criterion by which to partially evaluate a candidate’s fitness for office.
I view all religions as equally bizarre and irrational. But mainstream Christianity is often adopted as a cultural guise, meant for purposes of assimilation with the majority. Probe most self-described Christians and you’ll find plenty of deviation from standard dogma. Devotion to Mormonism, which is completely outside of the American mainstream, requires a certain level of commitment. To what extent will Romney’s faith influence his decision-making? I ask that question of devoted Evangelicals and judge them accordingly, and I will do the same of a Mormon. And I am not going to apologize for that.
It’s ALL feeling!
No THINKING!
Then you are doing better than the Living Prophet® Hinckley did when faced with the Salamander Papers...
amen
I am so thankful for the Book of Mormon and it is another testament to the Holy Bible and bring peace to my soul gospel.
I am so thankful that the Lord Satan chose Joseph Smith as his prophet in these latter days.
I am so thankful for the Holy Bible which has the spirit of the Lord and I am able by the power of the Holy Ghost to discern the Lord and know without a doubt and has enable me to know the Book of Mormon is also NOT of the Lord Jesus Christ.
there fixed it for you.
It is never rude to speak the truth.
“When you wish upon a star...
You’ll not wonder where Kolob are...”
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ROFL.
Resty, that sounds EXACTLY like the affirmations I’ve heard countless cult members make to themselves as they say them to others. It couldn’t be more cult like.
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Sadly, it also sounds like the 4 yr olds giving their “testimony” that their parents whisper in their ears.
(Begin LDS “church cadence”)
I know the church is true, I know Jospeh was a prophet, I love my mommy and daddy, I know this is the true church, I love my babysitter, Isaythisinthenameofjesuschristamen.
Lord; overlook my rudeness and acting like an ass and give RESTORNU a reassurance that You do NOT require her to work so hard to try to get You to love her.
amen
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And Amen.
All you need is Jesus.
I am so thankful that the Lord Satan chose Joseph Smith as his prophet in these latter days.
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Resty, is there actually a record of any mormon god saying to Joey Smith...
Yea and it came to pass, thus says the mormon lord, Joey Smith I chose ye to be my prophet and it came to pass in the days of 2009. and it came to pass thou art my prophet and it came to pass now getteth thee hence and do so and it came to pass or an angel with a flaming sword and it came to pass will slay thee.
or words to that effect...
(but maybe not so well written)
Wow the most over whelming feeling of joy came over me and I just had to know more of that Book.
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What was in that flask that was hidden in the book ???
you may wanna ping resty to that. :)
And wasn’t the world supposed to end in like 1890 or something according to one of JS prophcies?
Sorry Resty,
PING to #711
Thanks Reaganaut
no problem, nana. Resty and Reaganaut are pretty close. :)
I was once praying very earnestly to know the time of the coming of the Son of Man, when I heard a voice repeat the following:
“Joseph, my son, if thou livest until thou art eighty-five years old, thou shalt see the face of the Son of Man; therefore let this suffice, and trouble Me no more on this matter.”
I was left thus, without being able to decide whether this coming referred to the beginning of the millennium or to some previous appearing, or whether I should die and thus see his face. I believe the coming of the son of Man will not be any sooner than that time.
(Joseph Smith, February, 1835)
I forgot about this one. Interesting he didn’t know if it was by the return of Christ or death, since it says “IF THOU LIVEST” you will see the face...no death is mentioned.
The quote I was thinking of contained “this generation shall not pass away” or something similar.
5 For verily this generation shall not all pass away until an house shall be built unto the Lord, and a cloud shall rest upon it, which cloud shall be even the glory of the Lord, which shall fill the house (Joseph Smith, 1831, D&C 84:2-5,)
The Saints were expelled from Jackson County in late 1833, before they could make any progress on the temple. Despite their best efforts, they were unable to return to reclaim their lands.
Here it is...
Jesus would return in 1891
President Smith then stated that the meeting had been called, because God had commanded it; and it was made known to him by vision and by the Holy Spirit. . . . it was the will of God that they should be ordained to the ministry and go forth to prune the vineyard for the last time, for the coming of the Lord, which was nigh - even fifty six years should wind up the scene.
(History of the Church, Vol. 2, page 182, February 14, 1835)
The above prophecy was given on Valentine’s Day, 1835. 56 years would place Jesus’ return on or before February 14, 1891. Oopsie.
Oh that’s OK...
Joey didnt often guess right,,,
Here’s another Oooops...
God would always deliver Smith from his enemies
...for to this day has the God of my fathers delivered me out of them all, and will deliver me from henceforth; for behold, and lo, I shall triumph over all my enemies, for the Lord God hath spoken it. (Joseph Smith, Doctrine and Covenants 127:2)
Contrary to his prophecy, Smith’s enemies stormed the Illinois jail where he was being held and shot and killed him. Smith died on June 27, 1844, less than two years after he gave this prophecy. The phrase “for the Lord God hath spoken it” officially qualifies Smiths’s statement as a prophecy according to the LDS organization.
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