Posted on 06/19/2009 12:39:55 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
On the Errors of the Trinity Seven Books By Michael Serveto, alias Reves A Spaniard of Aragon MDXXXI
Due to the size of Servetus' book I will provide his arguments (as given by the translator) for each chapter (book). Below, you will find the links to Books VI and VII. Maybe? at some future date, I may add more. Book I
~RDH~
Argument
Any discussion of the Trinity should start with the man. That Jesus, surnamed Christ, was not a Hypostasis but a human being is taught both by the early Fathers and in Scriptures, taken in their literal sense, and is indicated by the miracles he wrought. He, and not the Word, is also the miraculously born Son of God in fleshly form, as the Scriptures teach - not a hypostasis, but an actual Son. He is God, sharing God's divinity in full; and the theory of a communicatio idiomatum is a confusing sophistical quibble. This does not imply two Gods, but only a double use of the term God, as is clear from the Hebrew use of the term. Christ being one with God the Father, equal in power, came down from heaven and assumed flesh as a man. In short, all the Scriptures speak of Christ as a man.
The doctrine of the Holy Spirit as a third separate being lands us in practical tritheism, even though the unity of God be insisted on. Careful interpretation of the usual proof-text shows that they teach not a unison of three beings in one, but a harmony between them. The Holy Spirit as a third person of the Godhead is unknown in Scripture. It is not a separate being, but an activity of God himself. The doctrine of the Trinity can be neither established by logic nor proved from Scriptures, and is in fact inconceivable. There are many reasons against it. The Scriptures and the Fathers teach one God the Father, and Jesus Christ his Son: but scholastic philosophy has introduced terms which are not understood, and do not accord with Scripture. Jesus taught that he himself was the Son of God. Numerous heresies have sprung from this philosophy, and fruitless questions have arisen out of it. Worst of all, the doctrine of the Trinity incurs the ridicule of the Mohammedans and the Jews. It arose out of Greek philosophy rather than from the belief that Jesus Christ is the Son of God; and he will be with the Church only if it keeps his teaching. Book II
Argument
CHRIST, the Son of man, who descended from heaven, was the Word by uttering which God created the world. He became flesh as God's firstborn, and was the Son of God. He was both human and divine. God's Spirit, moving all things, operates within us as the Holy Spirit, which is a person of the Godhead. It proceeds from the Son, not as a separate being but as a ministering spirit. It is holy, one of three persons in the Godhead, and sanctifies us by dwelling within us. Book III
Argument
The pre-existent Word, first uttered by God in creation, was afterwards incarnate in Jesus as the Son of God. Christ spirit manifested the power of God's Word in creation and in the world, and he derives our holy service; yet the Father did not suffer in Christ body. High praise is ascribed to Christ as the wisdom of God. The Word was not the Son, but a disposition of God, who is above all distinctions of time. Belief that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, is the essence of Christian faith, and the foundation of the Church. Book IV
Argument
God has manifest himself in three different dispositions. Of these, the Holy Spirit is his activity in the spirit of man, and is the minister of the Word. God is seen in the Person of Christ, represented in Scripture the imagery of angels; but the real image of God is Christ. The term Nature is appropriate only to God; the Word no longer exist; Person means a representation of another being; Christ incarnate, is the image of the Substance, but not of the Nature, of God. Book V
Argument
Examination of the Old Testament usage of the words for God - Elohim and Jehovah - shows that both refer to Christ, as centre of all, and the essence of all things.
Argument
The incomprehensible God is known through Christ, by faith, rather than by philosophical speculation. He manifests God to us, being the expression of his very being; and through him alone God can be known. The Scriptures reveal him to those who have faith; and thus we come to know the Holy Spirit as the divine impulse working in us.
Argument
The eternally begotten Son was a spoken word by which God made himself known. The Hebrew shows that the whole nature of God abode in Christ as Elohim, man being blended with God. The Word was a disposition of God, who begot the Son, a visible being. The Holy Spirit also is a real being as Christ was. The Word was an actual being, creating all things, manifesting God in bodily form.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iK0Miq2xNo&feature=related
Holy, Holy, Holy
Reginald Heber 1783-1826 John B. Dykes, 1823-1876
Holy, Holy, Holy! Lord God, Almighty!
Early in the morning our song shall rise to Thee;
Holy, Holy, Holy! Merciful and mighty!
God in Three Persons, blessed Trinity!
Holy, Holy, Holy! All the saints adore Thee,
Casting down their golden crowns around the glassy sea;
Cherubim and seraphim falling down before Thee,
Which wert and art and ever more shalt be.
Holy, Holy, Holy! Tho the darkness hide Thee,
Tho the eye of sinful man Thy glory may not see;
Only Thou art holy, there is none beside Thee;
Perfect in pow’r, in love and purity.
Holy, Holy, Holy! Lord, God Almighty!
All Thy works shall praise Thy name in earth and skiy and sea;
Holy, Holy, Holy! Merciful and mighty!
God in Three Persons, blessed Trinity!
Isaiah 6: 1-8
Revelation 4: 6-11
Reginald Heber was born in the area of Cheshire, England, of scholarly and well-to-do parents. At the age of seventeen, he entered Oxford University, where his scholarship and literary abilities received much attention. He was ordained to the ministry in the Anglican Church and throughout his ministry was noted as a prolific writer, making frequent contributions to magazines with his poetry, essays, and hymns.
In 1823, just three years before his death at the age of forty-three, Heber was sent to India to serve as the Bishop of Calcutta. The pressures of his work along with the humid climate of the area wore heavily upon his health. One morning after preaching to a large outdoor crowd, he suffered an apparent heat stroke and died very suddenly.
“Holy, Holy, Holy” was written specifically for use on Trinity Sunday, which occurs eight weeks after Easter. The emphasis of the hymn is to reaffirm the doctrine of the Triune Godhead. Though the word “trinity” is not found in the Scripture, the truth of three Persons, equal and eternal with each other, is clearly taught throughout God’s Word.
The tune for this text was written by Dr. John Bacchus Dykes. John Dykes was one of England’s leading church musicians of the nineteenth century. He wrote more than three hundred hymn tunes. Many of them are still in use today.
I love this song. My Spirit jumps with joy at the same time it weeps.
We sang this when I was little...
I’ve always loved it...
There is really no human words to explain the Trinity fully...
You either know in the Spirit that the Trinity is real...
or you dont
:)
I always feel the majesty of God when I hear this hymn, especially when it is done by a good choir.
Mahalia Jackson do ???
Looking for a choir...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz87I6xoHX8&feature=related
Don,
You refer to an article on Wikipedia to imply
that the Trinity came out of Hellenistic thought.
I took a look at your link. Do you realize it
was largely written/edited by an architect and
fiction writer?
Here’s your guy...
http://www.literaturfestival.com/bios1_3_6_405.html
enough said.
ampu
That’s nice too.
The Greek notions about God and "The One", not Obama, and modern christians' views about the Trinity are rather similiar. It does not prove that the Trinity came from the Greeks, but the possibility is certainly something worth looking into.
“The Greek notions about God and “The One”, not Obama, and modern christians’ views about the Trinity are rather similiar.
We agree on that!
Best,
Dave
PS - hope you have a great weekend.
Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:
Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of interest.
Obama Says A Baby Is A Punishment
Obama: “If they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”
The fact that John Calvin supported the Genevan City Council in their execution of Servetus (all according to 1000+ year old established laws in force all over Europe at the time) has nothing to do with the truth or falsehood of Servetus’ beliefs.
Of course modern Christians can logically believe that:
A) Servetus was definitely heretical (and was convicted twice by Roman Catholic courts for this—before being tried in Geneva).
B) The execution of heretics is not a good thing—and Geneva (and yes, Calvin) made a mistake. (Something many Protestants thought so at the time—even though both Reformed and Lutheran leaders all supported the execution before it happened—as Genevan leaders formally asked them).
I’ve read Servetus’ biography, in an excellent little book called “Hunted Heretic” by renowned scholar of the 16th Century, Roland Bainton. Servetus wrote his “Errors...” book early in life (as he was certainly a brilliant, if not a genius) before becoming a physician. He spent many years in hiding working as a doctor. One of his contributions consisted of discovering the link between the lungs and the circulation system—revolutionary for the time.
One personal characteristic that Bainton pretty fairly proves is that Servetus’ brilliance also manifested itself in long-term arrogance....to the point of hubris. He was known for example, in medical school, to correct and lecture his professors.
Had Servetus not tried to publicly argue, first with the the Roman Catholic Church, then publicly with John Calvin (with whom he had corresponded with in argument for years) he probably could have died in bed. So certain was he that he alone understood the errors of the Trinity—and that his genius alone could convince the most brilliant leaders of his age of his crystal clear arguments—this made him, as an individual, sign his own death warrant—as he was well aware of the (universal) religious intolerance of that age.
Again, the reality of Servetus’ heresy bears no relation to the wrongness of his execution... Nor does it make John Calvin into some horrible witch hunter. He was a man of his age—which compared to our own, had no religious tolerance, Roman Catholic, Protestant or Radical...
Foxe says...
It has long been the delight of both infidels and some professed Christians, when they wish to bring odium upon the opinions of Calvin, to refer to his agency in the death of Michael servetus. This action has been used on all occasions by those who have been unable to overthrow his opinions, as a conclusive argument against his whole system. “Calvin burnt Servetus! - Calvin burnt Servetus!” is good proof with a certain class of reasoners, that the Trinity is not true - that divine sovereignty is Antiscriptural, - and Christianity is a cheat. (John foxe, Foxe’s Book of Martyrs, P 202 )
How ignorant ! It is a job description. Messiah (Christ) Redeemer Yah'shua is the NAME by which you will be saved The Angel of death will pass over you if you Yah'shua said: Surnamed ?
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
==> YHvH is become my salvation.
Exod. 15:2; Ps. 118:14; Isa. 12:2
cover your sins with the blood of the Lamb. Mark 12:29 Yah'shua answered, "The foremost is,
'HEAR, O ISRAEL! YHvH OUR Elohim IS ONE YHvH
(Deuteronomy 6:4)
And the Noachide believers of every denomination say “Shalom and Amen!!”
A.A.C.
And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, Luke 4:1
It seems to me that it argues against it. Does that argue for or against the "Trinity" ?
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
This is what it is all really about...
Listen and watch and be blessed today...
Your research cat is smarter than many people who post on FR.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.