Bigotry against Mormons apparently acceptable in Utah LDS (OPEN)

Salt Lake Tribune ^ | March 20, 2009

[greyfoxx39]

Here is the response of a Utahn commenting on a Salt Lake Tribune online blog concerning HBO's attempt in its series "Big Love" to increase its revenues by publicly insulting the religious sensitivity of a minority religion: "Anything that gets the LDS "church's magical Mormon underwear in a twist is all right with me!!"

I write for a regional newspaper in Iowa. During the last election campaign, I suggested that Mitt Romney lost the Iowa caucus to Mike Huckabee primarily due to anti-Mormon bigotry. A reader argued that my opinion had no credence because I was a lay leader in the LDS Church.

The writer was either suggesting that I knew exactly what I was talking about and was therefore credible, or that I shouldn't be believed because I was a Mormon, which implies that the writer was a bigot.

-SNIP-

It is obvious to an outsider that Utah, or at least Salt Lake City, has within itself a deeply held culture of bigotry. A bigotry so ingrained in the cultural norm that the readers posting comments to the newspaper's blogs, apparently believing they are freethinking and ironic, are saying things online that would never be allowed into print if written about other groups.

[AmericanArchConservative]

Smells - like sewage, floating in denial.

Perspective...all a matter of whether one values the mutterings and opinions of a deluded self-proclaimed [false] prophet, or an array of facts.

I’ll let the words of the false prophet float on downstream unimpeded with the rest of his detritus and effluent.

A.A.C.

[Elsie]

You are scaring me elsie.

Luke 12:4-5
4. "I tell you, my friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that can do no more.
5. But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.

[Elsie]

 

I like fairy tales told by protesters. Don’t you?

 

 

 

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/17#17

  17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
  18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.
  19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”
  20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother,

“I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.”

 

 

 

[Old Mountain man]

Well, protester, I see you still are not producing anything original.

[Old Mountain man]

Yes, I suppose many of the protesters here smell like sewage.

I like facts and haven’t seen any produced lately, merely legends and fairy tales.

[greyfoxx39]

 

THE THREE LITTLE NEPHITES - A Mormon Fairy Tale

Once upon a time there were three Nephites who went out preaching among a wicked people. The people were angry and cast them into three prisons. Now the first Nephite rent his prison in twain too hard. The two halves of the prison flew so far that they smashed people’s houses. The second Nephite rent his prison in twain too soft, so that it was barely cracked and he really had to squeeze to get himself out. The third Nephite rent his prison in twain just right, so the halves were separated, but not so much that they broke anything.

But the people were still angry, and they cast the three Nephites into three pits, and covered them with earth. Now the first Nephite smote the earth too hard, and it rose up and delivered him, but also made a mountain that buried a city. The second Nephite smote the earth too soft, and he had to struggle and fight to get out of the pit. The third Nephite smote the earth just right so that he was delivered but no cities were buried.

But the people were still angry, and they cast the three Nephites into three furnaces. Now the first Nephite cooled his furnace too much, and he got frostbitten toes while escaping. But the second Nephite did not cool his furance enough, and his hair got a little singed. The third Nephite cooled his furnace just right, so he was able to escape in comfort.

Finally, the people cast the three Nephites into three dens of wild beasts. Now the first Nephite played with the wild beasts too roughly, and he accidentally killed them all. But the second Nephite played with the wild beasts too gently, and he got a bite on the neck for his trouble. But the third Nephite played with the wild beasts just right, enough to impress the people, but not so much that the beasts were injured.

And the first two Nephites began to feel that the third Nephite was being a show-it-all. And the contention was so sharp between them, that they departed asunder one from the other two. And the first and second Nephites no longer tarried with the third. And thus was born the latter-day preference for sending missionaries in pairs instead of threes.

[Utah Binger]

Foxy Lady Stirring The Pot

[greyfoxx39]

Well, that was a year or so ago...;)

[nesnah]

Hehe...hehehe...hehehehe...

Like the one you believe in?

[reaganaut]

Luke 12:4-5
4. “I tell you, my friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that can do no more.
5. But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.

---

Amen. We should fear God alone.

[Elsie]

Well, protester, I see you still are not producing anything original.

So true.

The 'original' stuff of Joseph Smith is just fine and dandy to implicate him - and his followers.

[Elsie]

I like facts and haven’t seen any produced lately, merely legends and fairy tales.

Yup; we just keep refering to MORMON publications; don't we!

Hee hee hee...

[Elsie]

 

 

 

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Deconstructing Linus: Portrait of a True Believing Pumpkinist as a Young Man

What does the Great Pumpkin offer Linus? Why does Linus spend every Halloween in the pumpkin patch, waiting for the Great Pumpkin to appear? Is it about the toys?

"Each year on Halloween night, the Great Pumpkin rises out of the pumpkin patch that he thinks is the most sincere and flies through the air with his pack of toys for all the good little children in the world."

No. This is about sincerity, a subjective standard by any definition.

I wonder if Linus blames himself every year for not picking the most sincere pumpkin patch for his vigil?

I wonder if other Great Pumpkinists castigate Linus by asserting if he were more in tune with the Spirit of the Great Pumpkin, if he were more prayerful, if he read the Holy Writ of the Great Pumpkin with a greater sincerity, that he could indeed rise to the challenge and, via the Spirit, be lead to choose the most sincere pumpkin patch?

I wonder how many years Linus will feel guilty for this failure and blame himself for receiving no answer no matter how sincere he believes himself to be?

I wonder if Linus ever gets frustrated because there is no objective way to measure sincerity? And if he realizes there is no objective standard for such a thing, I wonder if it ever creeps into his mind that his annual mission is nothing more than mindless busywork?

I wonder, does Linus ever has doubts?

For the time being, however, Linus will put aside his doubts and, perhaps as a means of proving his sincerity, begins to proselyte among his friends for converts. Most shrug him off. But Sally, who has a crush on him, believes Linus and agrees to spend Halloween in Linus’ Pumpkin Patch.

Linus then explains that by using positive language and positive thinking, they may be able to attract the Great Pumpkin to their Patch. He also cautions Sally that negative language and negative thinking will cause the Great Pumpkin to pass them by.

There is no room for doubt when one is a Great Pumpkinist. One should never say if the Great Pumpkin comes but always when the Great Pumpkin comes. "One little slip like that, can cause the Great Pumpkin to pass you by!" It’s hard to imagine a benevolent icon such as the Great Pumpkin punishing TBPs (True Believing Pumkinists) for such a minor infraction, but there you have it.

Sally: The Birth of an Ex-Pumpkinist

Because Sally loves her “sweet baboo” Linus, she sets aside her own Halloween plans of trick-or-treating and a Halloween party in order to spend the evening in the Pumpkin Patch. She converts to Great Pumpkinism because she loves Linus. She respects his opinion. And she wants to make him happy and be supportive. And besides, if it’s really true, WOW! Wouldn’t that be fantastic?

But in the end, the only Being that shows up in the Pumpkin Patch is Snoopy. Linus, believing Snoopy to be the Great Pumpkin, swoons into an ecstatic faint, happy in the knowledge that he has finally deciphered the Great Pumpkin’s standard for sincerity. But, alas, it is a misplaced hope, and when Linus regains consciousness, there is not only no Great Pumpkin there to reward him, there is one upset little girl.

"I was robbed! I spent the whole night waiting for the Great Pumpkin when I could have been out for tricks or treats! Halloween is over and I missed it! You blockhead! You kept me up all night waiting for the Great Pumpkin and all that came was a beagle!"

"I didn't get a chance to go out for tricks or treats! And it was all your fault! I'll sue! What a fool I was. And I could have had candy apples and gum! And cookies and money and all sorts of things! But no, I had to listen to you! You blockhead. What a fool I was. Trick or treats come only once a year. And I missed it by sitting in a pumpkin patch with a blockhead. You owe me restitution!"

Luckily for Sally, she only missed one Halloween. And though she is demanding restitution, because her participation was voluntary, she will never receive said restitution. She’ll simply have to accept the experience as one of life’s absurdities and move on.

However, one can hope that this experience has made Sally a more skeptical person, so that the next time she is presented with such fantastic claims, she’ll perhaps be inclined to do her research before committing any time, money or emotion.

After all, fantastic claims should be supported by fantastic evidence, right?

The question now becomes, has this experience made Linus a skeptic? After yet again not having his Pumpkin Patch recognized as sincere and after having endangered his friendship with Sally, will he continue to believe?

In spite of a complete and utter lack of evidence pointing to the existence of the Great Pumpkin, and a complete and utter lack of the Great Pumpkin’s Promise ever having been fulfilled, Linus is a True Believing Pumpkinist to the core. To even admit the possibility that he may be wrong would be to negate all those years of hard work and sincere belief. Linus simply cannot turn his back on his belief.

So if Linus doesn't become an ex-Pumpkinist, what is his strategy? Well, he’s going to keep on trying, isn't he?

"What do you mean, 'stupid'? Just wait until next year. I'll find a pumpkin patch, and I'll sit in that pumpkin patch and it'll be a sincere pumpkin patch, and the Great Pumpkin will come! Just you wait and see! I'll sit in that pumpkin patch, and I'll see the Great Pumpkin. Just wait until next year!"

[Elsie]

I’m not easy!

Being green!

[Elsie]

 

Amen. We should fear God alone.

 

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They succeeded in killing Joseph, but he had finished his work.

He was a servant of God, and gave us the Book of Mormon.

He said the Bible was right in the main, but, through the translators and others, many precious portions were suppressed, and several other portions were wrongly translated; and now his testimony is in force, for he has sealed it with his blood.

As I have frequently told them, no man in this dispensation will enter the courts of heaven, without the approbation of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Jun.

Who has made this so?

Have I?

Have this people?

Have the world?

No; but the Lord Jehovah has decreed it.

If I ever pass into the heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of the Prophet Joseph.

If you ever pass through the gates into the Holy City, you will do so upon his certificate that you are worthy to pass.

Can you pass without his inspection?

No; neither can any person in this dispensation, which is the dispensation of the fulness of times.

In this generation, and in all the generations that are to come, everyone will have to undergo the scrutiny of this Prophet.

They say that they killed Joseph, and they will yet come with their hats under their arms and bend to him; but what good will it do them, unless they repent?

They can come in a certain way and find favor, but will they?

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"If I ever pass into heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of Prophet Joseph"
--Brigham Young
--JOURNAL OF DISCOURSES, vol. 8, p. 224

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[AuntB]

“The ‘original’ stuff of Joseph Smith is just fine and dandy to implicate him - and his followers.”

How are we so blessed that your GOD gave you the duty to do that?

I give up.

When a forum has gone from trying to accomplish conservative values to degrading some of the best patriots we have, it’s time for me to go.

[reaganaut]

If I ever pass into the heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of the Prophet Joseph.
If you ever pass through the gates into the Holy City, you will do so upon his certificate that you are worthy to pass.

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I doubt JS is guarding the gates of Heaven, the gates of Hell probably.

[Tennessee Nana]

:)

[reaganaut]

...some of the best patriots we have....

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And who would that be?

[reaganaut]

*chuckle*