Posted on 04/08/2008 12:11:04 PM PDT by Beloved Levinite
The Pope Kissing the Koran
Below is a photo (see link below) of the Pope at the end of an audience with Patriarch Raphael I of Iraq, where the Pope "bowed" to the Muslim holy book, The Koran, presented to him by the delegation, and kissed it. Did the Pope, who in fact is the supposed "infallible" voice of the Roman Catholic Church not remember what The Koran has to say about Jesus and the nature of God? Did he not know how The Koran demotes Jesus the Messiah to "only a messenger of Allah" status?
"O people of the Scripture! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning Allah save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and His word which he conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit [sic.] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers and say not 'Three' - Cease! (it is better for you! - Allah is only one God. Far is it removed from His transcendent majesty that He should have a son...The Messiah will never scorn to be a slave unto Allah."
Of Jesus Christ, The Koran also states:
"And when the son of Mary is quoted as an example, behold! The folk laugh out, and say: Are our gods better, or is he? They raise not the objection save for argument. Nay! but they are a contentious folk. He is nothing but a slave on whom we bestowed favor, and we made him a pattern for the Children of Israel. And had we willed it we would have set among you angels to be viceroys in the earth".
Regarding Christ's death upon the Cross, The Koran says:
"That they rejected Faith; That they uttered against Mary a grave false charge; That they said (in boast): We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, The Messenger of Allah. But they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjunction to follow, for of a surety they killed him not. ... And on the Day of Judgment He (Jesus) will be a witness against them (Christians)." (Koran, 4:156-159)
The Koran even has Jesus Himself saying:
"Jesus son of Mary said: O Children of Israel! Lo! I am the messenger of Allah unto you, confirming that which was (revealed) before me in the Torah, and bringing good tidings of a messenger who cometh after me, whose name is the Praised One." The Pope was picked as "the Man of the Century" by various religious leaders. SOURCE: Fides (Rome) news Interview with Patriarch of Babylon!
Written by: Darrell G. Young Copyright©2002
Link to photo: http://focusonjerusalem.com/popekissingkoran.html
Sounds an awful lot like a retread.
The Sharif Bible, a translation of the Bible in modern Arabic.
Pope kisses book.
As our valuable Aussie Protestant mate, DieHard the Hunter, has righly pointed out, and as everybody actually knows, the Catholic Church has never been so foolish as to propose that the Pope is intellectually or morally faultless, flawless, or foolproof, let alone impeccable, personally ---- but only that he will never be able to bind the Catholic Church to falsity in matters of faith and morals.
That means the Pope could be stupid or sinful (some of them, esp. during the Renaissance, were notoriously so) but cannot make an erroneous doctrine binding on the whole church. Thus "infallibility" is more a divine protection for the Church than a personal quality of the Pope, since it constitutes a divine promise that no matter how screwed-up a Bishop of Rome may be, he will not be able to make a dogma out of it to mislead the whole Church. (Keywords "gates" "hell.")
So whatever it was that John Paul was doing in the famous 9-year-old picture that has been around the world 10,000 times on the Internet, it was at worst an act of cringe-making personal error and not an erroneous definition of dogma.
Yeesh.
I would want to add that Pope John Paul was Polish after all, and therefore a kisser.
Any time anybody gave him anything, he kissed it as a sign of thanks. He kissed sombreros. CD's. Guitars. Sweatshirts. Soccer balls. Sandwiches. Photographs. Baseball caps. Pineapples. Personal correspondance (letters). Cheeks. Foreheads. Hands. Walls (in Jerusalem.)
He's famous for even getting on his knees and kissing the ground for godsake, and literally for God's sake because he was the kind of guy who easily and spontaneously expressed gratitude for gifts all the time.
It's pretty clear he was kissing the book "as gift" ("as soccer ball") and not as a liturgical gesture canonizing Islamic scripture.
I might render a different opinion if it had been Rowan Williams, GOL (for Groaning Out Loud), but, not unfairly, I'm going to give our Lolek the benefit of the doubt because this is the same guy who commissioned Cardinal Josef ("the Enforcer") Ratzinger to write "Dominus Iesus," which clarified that nobody is saved by anybody except by Jesus Christ Our Lord.
And if it turns out, as wideawake says, that it was an Arabic-language edition of the Bible--
Well, Holy Moses, people.
Got any other a.k.a.'s? ;^)
And DieHard, you are certainly a valuable man to have around!
Assuming you're a Christian, you're seriously mistaken. In fact, Christians believe that the human authors of scripture were inspired, which is a higher gift than infallibility. (Inspiration is the ability to say exactly what God wants said; infallibility the merely negative protection against saying what God does not want said.)
As for John Paul IIs kissing of the Koran, it was poor judgment. Since he made an error, he couldnt be infallible.
Infallibility only protects teaching (and only protects that when it meets certain specific conditions), not "judgement" or "setting a bad example". See Die Hard the Hunter's post for details.
> And DieHard, you are certainly a valuable man to have around!
Thanks for that!
Yours is a most excellent post.
Some will read and learn, and that is all we can ask.
>>Some will read and learn<<
Some will ignore and live to play “Wack-A-Catholic” another day!
And assuming it was the Koran, I think it helpful to understand the context of this incident. It is from a news story that quotes the Patriarch of the Chaldean Church that we learn that it was the Koran. I think it interesting that the purpose of the delegation that went to Rome was to communicate the devastating effects the embargo on Iraq was having on the Iraqi people and reinvite the pope to come to Iraq.
I can imagine the pope feeling quite saddened by the tales of suffering that the people were enduring. And I think the pope probably felt a great regret that he couldn't go to Iraq. The opportunity to emphasize the commonalities of religions that were both rooted in Abraham, could have been a PR bonanza. As would have been the tacit approval of the religious toleration that people of faith enjoyed in that Muslim nation. Bringing attention to that fact would have been enormously beneficial.
I think the kiss was given as a spontaneous substitute to the ground the pope knew he would never kiss. It was a saddened, helpless, regretful pope, and a useless kiss was the most he could offer to the long suffering Iraqi people.
Ok, here we go, more info!
“... On May 14th I was received by the Pope, together with a delegation composed of the Shiite imam of Khadum mosque and the Sunni President of the council of administration of the Iraqi Islamic Bank. There was also a representative of the Iraqi ministry of religion.....At the end of the audience the Pope bowed to the Muslim holy book the Koran presented to him by the delegation and he kissed it as a sign of respect.” - Raphael I Bidawid, Patriarch of Babylon of the Chaldeans in an interview with the FIDES News Service
So Raphael I is not the man in the picture, but it is from his interview with a news service that we learn the story behind the picture. Note that the above quote wasn’t used by the original poster.
I will give Islam credit for one thing, though, they have more respect for Mary than the Protestants do. Which is amazing, considering all the prejudice against women in places like Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan under the Taliban.
Great post.
Which does seem to be the way it's tending. A painful thing to look at, but there it is.
No, of course I’m not saying the Pope was Muslim, nor insinuating it! I was concerned that he was showing respect for the Koran, as it is blatently anti-christian. Some Catholics here agree that it was probably a bad error in judgement on his...and let’s leave it there.
re: moving on - fine, but this thread has over 1,200+ views, so there is still interest & it has taken on a life of it’s own. But this will be my last post on the subject.
God Bless.
No, that was my original username & I changed it cause Freeps on the Levin thread thought I was be a female (Freeda) & I got tired of correcting people & I posted about the change, so I never tried to hide it. So, I hope I’ve satisfied your “Gotcha” moment.
:o) I don’t mean it as a gotcha really: and I’m glad you’re here, Mr. Beloved!
Well, thanks, Mrs. Don-o. I’m a Prot, but I love you too!
;) bL
“Just because an Arab handed him a book doesn’t mean the Arab is a Muslim or that the book is a Koran.
In fact, the Arab pictured is a Christian by the name of Raphael - and you might want to try looking up a picture of the Sharif translation of the Bible into Arabic.
I have one - and people instinctively assume it is a Koran because it is green and has Arabic script on the cover. “
-thanks for this. i got fooled by the picture.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.