A painting by Hieronymous Bosch, c.1510, portraying Paradise on the left and Hell on the right.
Posted on 01/09/2008 8:03:01 AM PST by NYer
Hell, oh you mean East New York?
Since East New York took the place of the South Bronx when it comes to Hell.
I vote for Camden NJ.
Trying to be Holy is challenge enough.
Logic and facts aside, my informal survey of lapsed christians: Reasons include- abuse by church members covered up or the victim was blamed. Second- Hell and eternal torment are so difficult to understand in the context of a loving God that people give up, assuming they are going to be among the majority of humanity doomed to be playthings for a spoiled and sadistic angel.
So I do not agree with the changes, I just understand the motivation.
212. In what does hell consist?
Hell consists in the eternal damnation of those who die in mortal sin through their own free choice. The principal suffering of hell is eternal separation from God in whom alone we can have the life and happiness for which we were created and for which we long. Christ proclaimed this reality with the words, “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire” (Matthew 25:41).
213. How can one reconcile the existence of hell with the infinite goodness of God?
God, while desiring “all to come to repentance” (2 Peter 3:9), nevertheless has created the human person to be free and responsible; and he respects our decisions. Therefore, it is the human person who freely excludes himself from communion with God if at the moment of death he persists in mortal sin and refuses the merciful love of God.
| "I'm in Hell. Connecticut is the fifth ring of Hell!" - Gus, from the film The Ref |
A Question Of Hell (One Minister Questions Its Existence)
Pell-Mell to Hell -- Cardinal Pell
Playing with fire ["Hell makes a comeback"]
Pope Benedict, Dr. Johnson, and Hell
According to this Pope "Hell really exists"
Pope says hell and damnation are real and eternal
Pope says hell and damnation are real and eternal
The fires of Hell are real and eternal, Pope warns
Balthasar, Hell, and Heresy: An Exchange (is it compatable with the Catholic faith?)
Angels - in Heaven, on Earth and in Hell
Angels - in Heaven, on Earth and in Hell
Scholars: Heaven, hell, meaningless to most Americans
Which circle of Hell do You belong in?
"To Hell with Hell!": The Spiritual Dumbing Down of the Generations
I believe that B-16 actually hints at hell in his new Encyclical on Hope in his introduction...
“SPE SALVI facti sumus”—in hope we were saved, says Saint Paul to the Romans, and likewise to us (Rom 8:24).
According to the Christian faith, “redemption”—salvation—is not simply a given.
Redemption is offered to us in the sense that we have been given hope, trustworthy hope, by virtue of which we can face our present: the present, even if it is arduous, can be lived and accepted if it leads towards a goal, if we can be sure of this goal, and if this goal is great enough to justify the effort of the journey.
And if we put in the right actions moving toward that goal. For example:
I could have a goal of reaching heaven, but I could currently be addicted to pornography, alcohol, gambling, etc. You name it.
Through addiction, haven’t we lost our hope? And are therefore moving into the realm of hell?
What if we repent of these sins and reform our lives, moving away from these addictions? Do we then have hope? Can we expect then to move more toward heaven than hell?
Fascinating to contemplate, isn’t it?
Thank you for posting that to this thread.
For this we have purgatory - for no one is without sin except God.
I fully and firmly believe in the actual, literal, place of hell and that plenty of people end up there. I’ve read some Catholic literature on the subject (Josefa Menedez’ diary, Fr. von Cochem’s discourse on the 4 last things, and St. Alphonsus’ book on preparing for death).
I’ve always ascribed to Hell to being something of the reprobate’s own making. That even if they were offerred a chance to leave, they would refuse, choosing pain and torment over giving up whatever evil they are attached to. The stuff I’ve read, however, seems to point that for souls in hell, they really WANT to get out, see all the bad stuff they’ve done, and would repent, except they could not.
The only way you can say there is no hell is either you are not a Christian, or you haven’t read the Bible at all. Christ talked quite a bit about it.
The author didn’t search his NASB bible very well. After reading this article the first place I looked in my NASB was Matt 5:22 - and there it was “fiery hell”. Hard to take anything else he says seriously.
God, while desiring “all to come to repentance” (2 Peter 3:9), nevertheless has created the human person to be free and responsible; and he respects our decisions. Therefore, it is the human person who freely excludes himself from communion with God if at the moment of death he persists in mortal sin and refuses the merciful love of God.
I've always wondered about the "moment" of death, especially with regards to that very same passage from Peter's Epistle that is quoted in your Catechism:
But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:8-9)
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