Posted on 10/08/2007 7:49:32 AM PDT by colorcountry
Not only is Mormonism a Christian faith, it is the truest form of Christianity, said speaker after speaker on the first day of the 177th Semiannual LDS General Conference. LDS authorities were responding to the allegation that Mormonism isn't part of Christianity. Made by different mainline Protestant and Catholic churches and repeated constantly during coverage of Mitt Romney's presidential campaign, the claim is based on Mormonism's beliefs about God, its rejection of ancient ideas about the Trinity still widely accepted, and the LDS Church's extra-biblical scriptures. "It is not our purpose to demean any person's belief nor the doctrine of any religion," said Apostle Jeffrey R. Holland in the afternoon session. "But if one says we are not Christians because we do not hold a fourth- or fifth-century view of the Godhead, then what of those first [Christians], many of whom were eye-witnesses of the living Christ, who did not hold such a view either?"
{snip}
The day's sermons included many familiar themes, including the importance of faith, the need for pure thoughts and actions, avoiding pornography reaching out to neighbors and eliminating spiritual procrastination. Hinckley talked about the destructive nature of anger in marriages, on the road, and in life, urging Mormons to "control your tempers, to put a smile upon your faces, which will erase anger; speak with words of love and peace, appreciation and respect."
THEY see a difference. I see no difference at all.
I suppose they were trying to be as inoffensive as possible, what with Romney running for the highest office in the land, and all.
They probably spent hours in the PR department trying to figure out how to say “We’re right and you’re wrong.” without actually saying it.
I doubt if it worked.
Everyone?? Only Arians refer to themselves as Christian. The rest of us call them heretics. Similarly, anyone who calls himself a Christian yet denies the substance of the Athanasian Creed is truly a heretic.
Notice here that this Mormon leader CLEARLY differentiates between Christianity and Mormonism. He DOES NOT say "some Christians" or "non-Mormon Christians," he says "THE Christians" -- when I refer to a group as "THE whatevers" it is clear that I do not count myself among that group.
If either of us denied the name "Christian" to heretics, then I wouldn't be a Christian in your eyes, and you definitely wouldn't be one in mine! At least the way we Catholics use it, heretics are still Christians. *Apostates* are no longer Christian.
But like I said to BibChr, that's a minor point hardly even worth debating. You're absolutely right that anyone who denies the Athanasian Creed is a heretic.
I've got an idea. They could do a commercial with a jingle: "We're more 'Christian' than you are; we're more 'Christian' than you; we're more 'Christian' than you are...strummin' on the old banjo."
Where did you come up with that crap?
I disagree. The definitions don’t seem to fit with your idea.
A heretic is one who denies orthodox doctrine.
An apostate is a person who at one time held to orthodoxy and later denied it (the notion of falling away).
Thus, a person born and raised a Mormon is a heretic since they deny the truth regarding the nature of the Godhood and the person of Jesus Christ. A person who converts to Mormonism from an orthodox Christian denomination is both a heretic and an apostate.
But like I said to BibChr, that's a minor point hardly even worth debating. You're absolutely right that anyone who denies the Athanasian Creed is a heretic.
And they may also be an apostate.
Just there...seems to be working fine.
I sometimes call myself a Mormon Christian because I also believe in the Book of Mormon.
Nope. Disciples of Jesus don’t deny what He teaches. You do.
Find another name.
Your definition of heresy is right, but the dictionary definition of apostasy is "a total desertion of or departure from one's religion, principles, party, cause, etc.".
Total desertion. Not just the denial of one particular aspect of orthodoxy. Like Julian the Apostate: was Christian, became a pagan. Arius was never an apostate.
But again, it's just a quibble. :)
Wanna explain, then, why most Mormon "Christians" then won't even pray directly to Jesus even those the supposed "Nephite" disciples did (3 Nephi 19:18, 24-26)? Wanna explain why some Mormon "Christians" say they worship and many others don't even though those supposed "Nephite" disciples did (3 Nephi 11:17)? Wanna explain why some Mormon "Christians" are quick to point out that Heavenly Father is the only God for them, yet the supposed "Nephite" disciples called Jesus Christ "their Lord & God" (3 Nephi 19:18)?
Is Jesus Christ your Lord and God? Do you worship Jesus Christ? Do you only praying indirectly --praying "in Jesus' name" but never addressing Him directly?
And finally, what's a "Christian" who won't pray to Jesus; won't worship Him; and refuses to recognize Him as their Lord and God? (And if Mormons say Jesus is their "God"--doesn't that automatically make them polytheists--folks who worship more than one God?)
Just got back ... it’s working fine now!
You left off the part that says you’re “more Christian.”
Is that because you didn’t want to start an argument by offending us?
Thanks for visiting!
So how many of the ecumenical councils does the Baptists and Presbyterians accept? If they do accept any - do they accept all of the precepts or just some of them?
This is so we can identify each other and where we stand on the nature of the faith.
Who gets to decide what is total and what is not? I could try to call my Baptist brother a heretic for his views on baptism, and I might get away with it in some circles, but not generally. Similarly, if my Baptist brother was a Presbyterian at one time, he is now an apostate, but only in the narrowest of circles.
That is why I used the Athanasian Creed as the touchstone. Folks who deny that are either heretic or apostate depending on their former circumstances.
I am not aware of ever having denied the teachings of Jesus Christ, although I live them imperfectly.
Find another name.
I will not. At my baptism, I made a covenant with God to take upon myself the name of Jesus Christ, to remember him always, and to keep his commandments. Denying one's testimony of Jesus Christ is a serious sin.
I am not aware of ever having denied the teachings of Jesus Christ, although I live them imperfectly.
Find another name.
I will not. At my baptism, I made a covenant with God to take upon myself the name of Jesus Christ, to remember him always, and to keep his commandments. Denying one's testimony of Jesus Christ is a serious sin.
No, I really don't.
The questions you raise have been answered before. If you were not convinced then, why should anyone expect a different result now?
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