Posted on 01/02/2007 6:42:23 PM PST by sionnsar
For those of you watching or listening, I hope you caught the symbolically terribly significant occurrence right before the sermon in the National Cathedral started, when Robert Certain read the gospel. According to the Prayer Book, the appointed gospel chosen was John 14:1-6 (page 480).
Here is the RSV version of this passage (NOT the translation read at the service):
1: “Let not your hearts be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me.
2: In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you?
3: And when I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also.
4: And you know the way where I am going.”
5: Thomas said to him, “Lord, we do not know where you are going; how can we know the way?”
6: Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.”
What, you ask, was the symbolically terribly significant occurrence? Mr. Certain left out the second half of verse 6, which is against both the way the text of Scripture is written and against the gospel text as laid out in the Book of Common Prayer. Verse 6 does not end half way through, and this seems to be another gesture of a church that cannot deal with Holy Scripture on its own terms.
It comes in the Presence and Ministry of the Holy Spirit... whose name is the Spirit of Truth.
The same agency of God Who has made the Name of the Lord famous in the earth -- by perfecting His excellent work in quite imperfect vessels... especially the weak ones...
"I've never seen a priest simply "forget" to finish a sentence."
Fr. Certain was simply following the script given to him by the cathedral.
http://www.cathedral.org/cathedral/pdfs/FordFuneral.pdf (see page 8)
Leaving off the last part of the verse is so Washington Cathedral.
And leaving off the last half is consistent with the position of the new Head Priestess.
"John 14:1-6a" <----Straight from the Cathedral bulletin ( 6a indicating only 1/2 of a verse 6 is read). Since Schori and a majority of TEC bishops deny that Christ alone is the way of salvation, this editing of scripture doesn't surprise me a bit.
I sincerely doubt it was from the Ford family...blame the Cathedral, or the TEC at large, before them.
Be patient. I'll get you a few quotes of the "new" creed as read in the RC church in Tilburg, Netherlands. The document is buried somewhere in a pile of paperwork. I received it more than a year ago.
You know nothing about him but immediately assume the worst about him. Okay. :)
It is so sad...and so predictable once they started down the path of "Reason" and not "Revelation"
Turns out that he read the gospel as scripted: omitting the troublesome end of sentence.
The favorite word of liberal ECUSA (TEC), PCUSA, and other 'mainline' denominations. You used it again in the post to which I am replying. "Inclusive". Liberal theologians always wield it as a weapon.
The Gospel is Exclusive, not Inclusive. Those who argue for inclusivity usually are well on their way to universalism.
I noticed this immediately and thought about the scripture that talks about those who are ashamed of Jesus he will also be ashamed of them. I thought this was horrible and sooooooooo obvious to anyone who reads the BIBLE.
Dont know any of these folks... and whatever linguisitcs they choose to wrangle around their sinful departures and compromise is their doing... not mine.... Don't try to saddle me with that again... thanks in advance.
It does give inclusivity a bad name though...
I think we differ because you are discussing the schisms in these denominations -- and the evergrowing tension between faith and secular culture -- and I am trying to point your thinking to the heart of God... as clearly revealed in the Scriptures....
Abraham's Covenant... GEN 22:15-18 Then the angel of the LORD called again to Abraham from heaven, “This is what the LORD says: Because you have obeyed me and have not withheld even your beloved son, I swear by my own self that I will bless you richly. I will multiply your descendants into countless millions, like the stars of the sky and the sand on the seashore. They will conquer their enemies, and through your descendants, all the nations of the earth will be blessed —all because you have obeyed me.”
Sounds rather like God has inclusive plans -- as the Gospel is pre-figured in this covenant...
THE NEW COVENANT IN JESUS CHRIST...
JOHN 3:16-17
“For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life. God did not send his Son into the world to condemn it, but to save it.
AND...
ROMANS 10:12-13 Jew and Gentile are the same in this respect. They all have the same Lord, who generously gives his riches to all who ask for them. For “Anyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Quoting Joel 2:32)
The Gospel is Exclusive, not Inclusive.
If you really believe this... you have sorely missed the point.
The Gospel is entirely INCLUSIVE...
...Yes -- there is a narrow doorway into the Kingdom... (Matthew 7:13-14) Through the New Covenant in Christ... in the shadow of the cross, and in plain view of the empty tomb. But the heart of God inside the doorway is inviting ALL to come in... and be saved. ( 1Tim 2:3 & 1 Pet 3:9)
You are indeed correct that many groups have gone recently astray -- and have used cute & cuddly words to justify their falling away from the Lord...
You will understand I am not one of them... and your continued efforts to identify my approach to preaching and evangelism with their apostasy is more than a little offensive.... Around here -- even Baptists can disagree like gentlemen.
You need to understand that here are many roads that lead to the narrow doorway... And we meet people on different legs of the journey every day -- some are hopelessly given over to the depravity of mind and perverse behaviors... and in their hostility, they will never choose to listen to God. (I tell them anyway!)
But short of that horrific condition -- Every one out there is still on their unique journey that their choices have mapped out-- AND potentially a "pre-believer" in Jesus Christ. You and I are part of the plan of prevenient grace; God has placed us on their paths to help them find the narrow doorway... who is Jesus. (John 10:9)
LUKE 10:25-37
Should we be like the priest -- and after seeing someone's misfortune and brokenness -- simply move to the other side of the road and pretend we didn't see....
Or should we pass by like the Levite... pretending not to notice... hurrying off to do the "will of God in the temple".
Or should we be the Good Samaritans... meet them right where they are... bloody... wounded... destitute... dying in their sins... and offer the cleansing and healing God has given us... and provide for their initial nurture and care as they receive the Gospel...
At the end of the day, the Good Samaritan needed a bath and clean clothes... but he has done the will of God in ministry.
Paul summmarized it this way... 1 COR 9:19-23
Though I am free and belong to no man, I make myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews.
To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law.
To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law.
To the weak I became weak, to win the weak.
I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some.
I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.
*****************
You need to understand the heart of the Lord --
For any and all who are not yet given over... I will meet them wherever they are... and tolerate almost anything to establish enough equity in the moment of truth to lead them to the doorway of of the Kingdom.
I will NOT compromise my convictions or participate in their sins... but a bit of compassionate flexibility given in Christ's love opens the door to their heart and they are ready to be led into the Kingdom-- Behold -- we have won the day!
(Jesus never used a canned speech or told the same parables again -- he was compassionate to the winebibbers and sinners and old "IRS" Zaccheus-- and told them the Gospel story in language THEY could understand & receive...)
(Some really are given over-- but I will engage them likewise at any point their heart/minds/life-needs might indicate they are receptive. We wouldn't want to miss an opportunity to honor the Son of God for the sake of a few threats or mere insults...)
If we stay in our little denominational bubbles... hiding behind our preferences and our own interpretations of our favorite doctrines.... we will miss the Lord's heart for outreach, Spirit-led compassion, and the good harvest that comes from these...
I s'pect we will agree to disagree... but my heart is now clear at the end of this discussion.
The blessings are still there... for all who would choose to believe...
I think we will be so surprised to see some people in Heaven -- and we will search in vain for others we were surely certain to find there...
Have a good day.
The National Cathedral is the seat of one of THE most liberal, anti-scriptural dioceses of the (majority VERY liberal) Episcopal Church.
I'd be willing to bet it was the National Cathedral folk, not Fr. Certain or the Ford family who cut off the reading at 6a....not unusual for theologically liberal revisionists.
(Oddly enough too, the National Cathedral in Georgetown is about a 20 minute drive to the Falls Church or Truro Church, two of the leading conservative evangelical churches in American Anglicanism, who have left The Episcopal Church for oversite under the newly formed Convocation of Anglicans in North America, under the Archbishop of Nigeria, Peter Akinola.)
Yes, I know. I live in the DC area and I am an Epicopalian.
And when I'm not on my laptop, I can even get the "s" to strike reliably. EpiScopalian. :)
Then perhaps you could find more productive threads upon which to debate than those dedicated to the discussion of the apostasy and heresy of the Episcopal and Presbyterian USA leadership.
I won't post a long discussion of my theology - just pick up a copy of the Westminster Confession and read it, and then ask for my exceptions.
Bishop Minns, the newly consecrated bishop of CANA (Convocation of Anglicans in North America)--a mission church denomination to provide a place to go for evangelical Episcopalians who are fleeing their apostate denomination.... rightly calls the gospel of Christ one of "radical inclusion" AND "profound transformation."
Does God call and include all kinds of people, including tax collectors, prostitutes, sinners-of-all-types, including homosexuals? Of course, but He loves enough not to leave them them bound in sin, and profoundly changes them, into His children.
Radical inclusion of all kinds of sinners into God's family, and profound transformation of these into a holy people of God.
Well said, indeed!
Yumpin' yiminy!!!.... an "exclusive" FR thread...
A D-E-D-I-C-A-T-E-D... thread..... at that.
And I posted on it...... OOOhhhh NNNoooooooo......!!!!!!
I stand connected...
To my earlier surmise about your little liturgy club...
Some of the problems and points-of-origin with your PB and the apostate bishops/rectors/pastors, etc. -- originates in a sophisticated spirit of pride --
Now maybe THERE'S a starting point for YOUR continued intercession... Like Daniel... & Nehemiah... who touched God's heart by confessing they were part of the problem...
I am quite familiar with the Westminster Confession... Thanks...
But I won't trouble you further - -
Heaven forbid one should violate your "exclusive" thread rules again.
Remember... red stoles on Sunday morning...
You will find me in the old storefront wearing jeans and motorcycle boots...
With a guitar, a Bible, a communion set, coffee and free snacks for all the "whosoever wills" who may come.
I'll show myself out... thanks.
(Yumpin yiminy....)
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