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Why I Can No Longer Be A United Methodist
United Methodist Nexus ^ | August 2006 | Marge Engelman

Posted on 08/17/2006 6:31:09 AM PDT by hiho hiho

I am a retired university administrator and faculty member, a lifelong Methodist (now United Methodist), a clergy wife, a mother and a grandmother. At this age I had imagined that I would be happily treasuring traditional Christian views, following the well-worn path to the church, and participating in all the usual “keep-’em-busy-and-involved” church activities.

Here I am at 78 raising more questions about the Christian faith than ever before. I am offended by the continued use of sexist language and bored by the endless rehearsal of our ancient doctrines. I can no longer think like a first century Christian, the time when much of the Bible was written, or like a fourth century Christian, the time when the creeds were formed. Striving to find meaning in the creeds without translating almost every word is frustrating. The words stick in my throat when I try to sing the dated hymns depicting heaven as up and hell as down, God as Father, and Christian soldiers marching onward. I find it difficult to worship what my mind rejects.

Going to The United Methodist Church to worship does not meet my spiritual needs. For a while I went to coffee hour to see valued friends. Now and then I would attend the Sunday Forum seeking a new idea, but then I would play hooky and skip out before worship, hoping no one would miss me. Now I have “given up” and seek meaning in other ways and places.

An Interfaith Dialogue group meeting in a Catholic Retreat Center has increased my awareness that there are many spiritual paths. When I gather with Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans, Bahai’s, Agnostics, and Christians to share spiritual thoughts and experiences, I am enriched.

The exclusivity of traditional Christianity, “ours is the only way,” saddens me now. Seldom in recent years did I hear reference to other faiths, maybe a nod now and then to ecumenicity. As I contemplate the world scene, traumatized with religious conflict, it seems there is good reason to be about the business of opening all the doors and windows to the fresh air of learning about, valuing and working with other faiths.

Again and again my hopes have been dashed related to openness and support for gays and lesbians. The United Methodist churches that I know best tiptoe around the gay, lesbian and transgendered issues. If a church does decide after much study and discussion that they want to be a welcoming congregation, they then seldom reach out in meaningful and caring ways to the gays and lesbians in their communities.

And now in addition to United Methodists denying ordination to self-avowed practicing homosexuals, the UM Judicial Council has said that gays and lesbians have no automatic right to church membership and upheld the power of local pastors to turn them away. That is deeply troubling to me.

I was an active trustee of one of United Methodist’s finest seminaries for 25 years. I am ashamed to say that the board of that Seminary has never been able to agree on a policy related to gays and lesbians. I have shed many tears of frustration and anger as some of us tried to bring about change.

When I was in undergraduate school and became president of a national sorority, I was stunned to realize that I was required to ask new pledges if they were of Negro, Oriental, or Jewish extraction. If they were, we could not pledge them. Shortly after graduating, I resigned from the sorority to protest that discrimination.

When trying to decide if I wanted to remain an active United Methodist, I recalled that disturbing sorority experience and asked myself if I wanted to be a member of a Church that discriminated against homosexuals.

Where are the voices of United Methodists in standing up against the Iraq war? Where are the Bishop Oxnams of our day? Yes, there are some brave souls, but in general there has been no United Methodist outcry against a preemptive, illegal war that has killed thousands and threatens the very fiber of our souls. Many clergy are concerned, but if they speak out they may offend some members, and what United Methodist church can afford to lose members in this day and age of declining membership?

I have changed from that ever-smiling, supportive clergy wife, who questioned little and swallowed a lot. Now I am reimagining my faith as I age. Of course, this new path has brought guilt and self-doubt and periods of deep searching. But there are joys as well. It is a joy to find spiritual strength in new places: within me as I meditate, in the community of the Interfaith Dialogue, listening as I walk in the mornings, meeting and learning from international students, writing a book and sensing a guiding presence as I write.

Maintaining some of my Christian perspectives, I am finding hope and nourishment in the Unitarian Universalist tradition. (Yes, you can be a Christian Unitarian.) In the words of one of their hymns, I am “Free from the bonds that bind the mind to narrow thought and lifeless creed.” I am happy to be a part of a community that places a very high priority on activism related to social justice issues. It is good to listen to the loving thoughts of a gay minister.

I do remain grateful for my Methodist heritage, but just as Jesus called in question the legalisms of Judaism, I want to move on to a faith that is inclusive, has no barriers or boundaries, and is relevant for the present day.


TOPICS: Ecumenism; General Discusssion; Mainline Protestant; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: agnostic; buddhists; methodist; muslim; religiousleft; umc; unitarians; universalism; wiccans
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1 posted on 08/17/2006 6:31:11 AM PDT by hiho hiho
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To: hiho hiho
"I am finding hope and nourishment in the Unitarian Universalist tradition."

Oi vey.

2 posted on 08/17/2006 6:32:15 AM PDT by Sam's Army (RIP Little Lion 10-16-90 / 08-07-06)
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To: hiho hiho

"Here I am at 78 raising more questions about the Christian faith than ever before."

Probably 50 years too late. If your faith can't stand up to hard questions you should change. My guess is, your "new" faith is much less able to answer your actual faith questions, but I'm sure you'll be kept busy.


3 posted on 08/17/2006 6:41:55 AM PDT by mad puppy ( The Southern border is THE issue)
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To: hiho hiho
Going to The United Methodist Church to worship does not meet my spiritual needs.

Then she needs to go find her a hippie church and stop whining.

Oh, wait, I see she did.
4 posted on 08/17/2006 6:43:52 AM PDT by Xenalyte ("Snakes on a Plane" will win best movie next year.)
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To: mad puppy

She never mentions prayer.


5 posted on 08/17/2006 6:44:30 AM PDT by golfisnr1 (look at a map)
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To: hiho hiho

Extremely good riddance.


6 posted on 08/17/2006 6:44:31 AM PDT by old-ager
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To: Sam's Army
I believe Frank Burns and Hotlips immortalized the best of the Unitarian Universalist moral teaching:

It's nice to be nice to the nice.

If she finds this nourishing, she's spiritually anorexic or bulimic.

7 posted on 08/17/2006 6:44:59 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Reality is not optional.)
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To: old-ager

Extremely good riddance -- ditto. Honestly. There are MANY churches around that should satisfy this whiner.


8 posted on 08/17/2006 6:50:39 AM PDT by bboop (Stealth Tutor)
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To: Mad Dawg
It's nice to be nice to the nice.

You're close to the actual quote...

"Its nice to be nice to the nice when they are nice."
- Frank Burns

9 posted on 08/17/2006 6:54:25 AM PDT by Bosco (Remember how you felt on September 11?)
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To: hiho hiho

A simple truth about religion - if you don't believe that your particular faith is the 'only way', the 'right way', and/or the 'true path' then you don't really believe - do you?

There is a difference between
1. acknowledging that man has freedom of religious choice and that he may believe and worship as he sees fit, and
2. endorsement of all religions as equally valid.

A fundamental truth of religious study is that we can't all be right...


10 posted on 08/17/2006 6:55:19 AM PDT by BlueNgold (Feed the Tree .....)
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To: hiho hiho; P-Marlowe; blue-duncan; Revelation 911; Gamecock; Buggman; Dr. Eckleburg; AppyPappy

As a methodist pastor, it is sad that this woman does not seem to have faith in Christ, but rather was busy translating doctrines and creeds. She says something about maintaining some of her Christian perspective.

I hope it isn't odd for me to say that her liberal reaction and rejection of us is an indication that the classic, historic Christian perspective is slowly winning back our church.


11 posted on 08/17/2006 6:55:54 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and proud of it! Supporting our troops means praying for them to WIN!)
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To: hiho hiho
Here is the author's list of grievances against the UMC:

- use of sexist language
- endless rehearsal of ancient doctrines
- the dated hymns
- the exclusivity of traditional Christianity
- denial of ordination to self-avowed practicing homosexuals
- no outcry against a preemptive, illegal war

Frankly, I don't see what she's complaining about - I would think the UMC and her would be a perfect fit.

12 posted on 08/17/2006 6:57:33 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Colossians 2:6)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: hiho hiho

LOL...when the UMC is too conservative for you, you know you have lost the faith.


14 posted on 08/17/2006 7:02:26 AM PDT by kittymyrib
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To: Bosco

Are you SURE? Wow. The boss-lady and I have been saying it my way since the night that show aired.


15 posted on 08/17/2006 7:02:30 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Reality is not optional.)
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To: hiho hiho

(Yes, you can be a Christian Unitarian.)

aaa, no you can't.


16 posted on 08/17/2006 7:03:52 AM PDT by svcw
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To: hiho hiho
The exclusivity of traditional Christianity, “ours is the only way,” saddens me now. Seldom in recent years did I hear reference to other faiths, maybe a nod now and then to ecumenicity. As I contemplate the world scene, traumatized with religious conflict, it seems there is good reason to be about the business of opening all the doors and windows to the fresh air of learning about, valuing and working with other faiths.

I am not a methodist, and have had some issues with some Methodist teachings, but some of that can be expected between denominations. Thing is, Jesus is the one that stated there is no other way to heaven, thus it is Jesus that said "ours (Christianity) is the only way". yes, there are many (incorrect) spiritual paths, but only one way to heaven.

This woman's argument isn't with the Methodist Church, but with Jesus himself.

17 posted on 08/17/2006 7:03:59 AM PDT by The Bard (http://www.reflectupon.com/)
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To: hiho hiho
The exclusivity of traditional Christianity, “ours is the only way,” saddens me now.

Nice to see Marge helping out that Jesus guy with his dogmatic statements.
(end sarcasm)
18 posted on 08/17/2006 7:06:13 AM PDT by VOA
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To: Apple Blossom

One liberal leaves the churh. Only a few thousand more to go. ping


19 posted on 08/17/2006 7:06:38 AM PDT by bmwcyle (Only stupid people would vote for McCain, Warner, Hagle, Snowe, Graham, or any RINO)
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To: The Bard

You are so right. You win the absolute correct award today.


20 posted on 08/17/2006 7:07:32 AM PDT by bmwcyle (Only stupid people would vote for McCain, Warner, Hagle, Snowe, Graham, or any RINO)
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