[Aussie Dasher]

No-one can support killing babies and retain membership of the Church!

Are you listening, Lard Ass?

[StJacques]

I just checked the veracity of this story and, evidently I missed it in 2004, but Catholic World News did report it so Kerry's excommunication is a fact.

As a Catholic I have always had trouble understanding how men like Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, et al could continue to call themselves Catholic while demonstrating the support they have for so many policies in contradiction of church doctrine, and as the article shows above there are many more than just abortion. I frequently find myself asking "What Catholic Church do you guys attend?" I guess the answer lies with my Aunt who says "there are Catholics and historical Catholics," the latter referring to people who once were Catholic and still claim to be, but are not in fact. Clearly many of those on that list in the article above fall into the category.

I support the Church's decision here, but I also must say that I fear what will happen in Europe, where church attendance is already down considerably. This could just about wipe the church out in many areas of France and Germany.

[StJacques]

You made a mistake to pull this thread off the "News/Activism" forum. This article discusses a potentially important change in American political life.

[Tuscaloosa Goldfinch]

ping!

[sarasmom]

Perhaps if the Catholic Church, and every single Protestant denomination stood up proudly for their core principles,(assuming they still have some) and kicked out their " self proclaimed heretical members of the "_____In Name Only" variety, they might gain more respect as serious religious institutions.
In the battle of good versus evil, it is a grave mistake to assume "members of a Christian Church" are naturally allied with the One True God, nowadays.

[markomalley]

***pingus maximus***

[jwalsh07]

The Church has never formally acknowledged John Kerry as having excommunicated himself by his long time support of unfettered abortion. He continues to receive the host in Catholic Churches in Boston and DC.

How he does that is beyond me and how the Bishops countenance it is well beyond me.

[redhead]

Bumping on general principle...

[NYer]

Catholic Ping List
Please freepmail me if you want on/off this list

[NYer]

Voter's Guide for Serious Catholics

THE FIVE NON-NEGOTIABLE ISSUES

These five current issues concern actions that are intrinsically evil and must never be promoted by the law. Intrinsically evil actions are those which fundamentally conflict with the moral law and can never be deliberately performed under any circumstances. It is a serious sin to deliberately endorse or promote any of these actions, and no candidate who really wants to advance the common good will support any action contrary to the non-negotiable principles involved in these issues.

1. Abortion

The Church teaches that, regarding a law permitting abortions, it is "never licit to obey it, or to take part in a propaganda campaign in favor of such a law, or to vote for it" (EV 73). Abortion is the intentional and direct killing of an innocent human being, and therefore it is a form of homicide.

The unborn child is always an innocent party, and no law may permit the taking of his life. Even when a child is conceived through rape or incest, the fault is not the child's, who should not suffer death for others' sins.

2. Euthanasia

Often disguised by the name "mercy killing," euthanasia also is a form of homicide. No person has a right to take his own life, and no one has the right to take the life of any innocent person.

In euthanasia, the ill or elderly are killed, by action or omission, out of a misplaced sense of compassion, but true compassion cannot include intentionally doing something intrinsically evil to another person (cf. EV 73).

3. Embryonic Stem Cell Research

Human embryos are human beings. "Respect for the dignity of the human being excludes all experimental manipulation or exploitation of the human embryo" (CRF 4b).

Recent scientific advances show that often medical treatments that researchers hope to develop from experimentation on embryonic stem cells can be developed by using adult stem cells instead. Adult stem cells can be obtained without doing harm to the adults from whom they come. Thus there is no valid medical argument in favor of using embryonic stem cells. And even if there were benefits to be had from such experiments, they would not justify destroying innocent embryonic humans.

4. Human Cloning

"Attempts . . . for obtaining a human being without any connection with sexuality through 'twin fission,' cloning, or parthenogenesis are to be considered contrary to the moral law, since they are in opposition to the dignity both of human procreation and of the conjugal union" (RHL I:6).

Human cloning also involves abortion because the "rejected" or "unsuccessful" embryonic clones are destroyed, yet each clone is a human being.

5. Homosexual "Marriage"

True marriage is the union of one man and one woman. Legal recognition of any other union as "marriage" undermines true marriage, and legal recognition of homosexual unions actually does homosexual persons a disfavor by encouraging them to persist in what is an objectively immoral arrangement.

"When legislation in favor of the recognition of homosexual unions is proposed for the first time in a legislative assembly, the Catholic lawmaker has a moral duty to express his opposition clearly and publicly and to vote against it. To vote in favor of a law so harmful to the common good is gravely immoral" (UHP 10).

ABBREVIATIONS

CCC Catechism of the Catholic Church

CPL Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith, Doctrinal Notes on Some Questions Regarding the Participation of Catholics in Political Life

CRF Pontifical Council for the Family, Charter of the Rights of the Family

EV John Paul II, Evangelium Vitae (The Gospel of Life)

RHL Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Instruction on Respect for Human Life in Its Origin and on the Dignity of Procreation

UHP Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Considerations regarding Proposals to Give Legal Recognition to Unions between Homosexual Persons

---

Voter's Guide for Serious Catholics

[AuH2ORepublican]

I would like to see a formal excommunication, with the name John Forbes Kerry explicitly mentioned.

Three of the Catholic Senators listed are actually pro-life on abortion and support traditional marriage: Sununu, Domenici and Voinovich (the writer actually misspelled the names of the latter two). Here are the votes for the three Senators according to National Right to Life:

http://www.capwiz.com/nrlc/bio/keyvotes/?id=376

http://www.capwiz.com/nrlc/bio/keyvotes/?id=396

http://www.capwiz.com/nrlc/bio/keyvotes/?id=457

Voinovich's voting record on life issues has been perfect, while the only deviations for Sununu and Domenici have been on peripheral issues not really involving abortion (the Medicare Modernization Act in the case of Sununu, and Campaign Finance Reform in the case of Domenici).

I can't think of any votes by these three Senators that would trigger excommunication, so the editorial writer has made a mistake and should publish a correction so as not to defame these three good Catholics..

[CholeraJoe]

Maybe the Church should bring back Burning at the Stake, huh? Worked for Jacques DeMolay and all them pesky witches.

[thegreatbeast]

The generations of fat-load cardinals & bishops saw themselves as part of the oligarchy and fell in love with all the photo-ops and free lunches. They forgot the Dogma and let evil take root everywhere, even in the clergy.