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Patriarch of Venice deemphasizes ordination of married men to the priesthood
Vivificat! - A Catholic Blog of Commentary and Opinion ^ | 8 October 2005 | Teófilo

Posted on 10/08/2005 6:14:50 PM PDT by Teófilo

News Analysis.

Folks, another thing I'm watching very closely is the Synod of Bishops, currently being held in Rome, with the attendance of 250 from around the globe. The theme of the Synod is the Holy Eucharist, but apparently, some of the debates are taking an interesting bend.

It seems that the issue of mandatory priestly celibacy for diocesan priests in the Latin Rite received some attention. Cardinal Angelo Scola, patriarch of Venice, wrote a "report before the discussion, entitled, On Eucharistic Amazement, among other deep things, had this to say:

Viri probati

To overcome the lack of priests, some, guided by the principle of salus animarum suprema lex, advance the request for the ordination of married faithful, of proven faith and virtue, the so called viri probati. The request is often accompanied by the positive recognition of the validity of age-old discipline of presbyteral celibacy. However, this law should not, they affirm, impede that the Church be equipped with an adequate number of ordained ministers, when the scarcity of candidates to celibate priesthood is assuming extremely grave proportions. It is superfluous to reiterate, in this context, the profound theological motives which have lead the Latin Church to unite the conferring of Ministerial Priesthood to the Charism of celibacy. Rather, the question imposes itself: is this choice and this praxis pastorally valid, even in extreme cases such as those mentioned above? It seems reasonable to answer positively. Being intimately tied to the Eucharist, ordained priesthood participates in its nature of a gift and cannot be the object of a right. If it is a gift, ordained priesthood asks to be constantly requested for. It has become very difficult to ascertain the ideal number of priests in the Church, from the moment in which this is not a business" which should be equipped with a determined quota of team managers.

In practical terms, the urgency, which cannot be postponed, of the salus animarum urges us to reiterate with strength, especially in this See the responsibility each particular Church has with regard to the Universal Church, and for that reason also to the other particular Churches. Therefore, the proposals made in this Synodal Assembly to identify the criteria for an adequate distribution of clergy in the world, will be very useful. In this area the path to be walked seems as yet very long. Perhaps it is a good idea to remember that all during history, Providence has sustained the prophetic and educational value of celibacy, asking also for a special availability for the ministry of priesthood to the realities of consecrated life, maintaining the respect for their charism and history. One can quote here the praxis of the ordination of monks in the Oriental Church and within the Benedictine Tradition.

The Patriarch's comments should be taken as "cold shower" for those who advocate making celibacy optional for diocesan priests of the Latin Rite. The Patriarch hints that discussion on "distribution of priests" in the world should is of more importance than discussing the highly hypothetical notion of ordaining "viri probati."

One thing grates me a little bit, is where he says: Providence has sustained the prophetic and educational value of celibacy, asking also for a special availability for the ministry of priesthood to the realities of consecrated life, maintaining the respect for their charism and history. One can quote here the praxis of the ordination of monks in the Oriental Church and within the Benedictine Tradition. I fail to understand why the Patriarch quotes the value of celibacy in the praxis of monks in the Oriental Church, but fails to mention how the charism of chastity is lived out in the married priests of the Oriental Church. I think this omission is illogical, considering that the Eastern Churches maintain a dual discipline of both celibate and married clergy, which is exactly the point he wishes to temper down.

It seems to me that the issue is not that monastic or other regular clergy should remain celibate; everyone agrees they should. The issue is, should diocesan priests be celibate? The Patriarch simply sidestepped this issue.

I don't presume to lecture bishops of whatever rank, but speaking strictly from an analysis of the text, I think this paragraph was the weakest in an otherwise excellent meditation. I humbly submit this was not a serious effort to deal with the issue in light of the entire Tradition of the Church, and not solely that of the Latin Church.


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Read also: Is it time to ordain married men to the Catholic priesthood? in Vivificat!
1 posted on 10/08/2005 6:14:52 PM PDT by Teófilo
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To: Teófilo; Kolokotronis; bornacatholic; NYer

There has been a lot of comment about this on other threads already, but for those who are interested in the topic, I thought you might want to hear an account from an insider.

The following intervention in Cardinal Scola's summation has not been widely reported (because of the new restrictions) and certainly the response of the majority of the bishops has not been reported.

I will give you the text of the e-mail I received with sensitive names omitted:


"Our Melkite-Greek Catholic Patriarch Gregory III has advocated the cause of a married priesthood at the Synod. The Melkites are a theologically conservative Church. Therefore, His Beatitude is taking a conservative position when he argues that married men should be ordained priests. It is the Eastern Christian tradition. Since the Council of Trullo, in the first millenium, the East has taken the view that celibates should be monastics, and the norm for parishes should be married priests.

I couldn't say that it was unanimous, but certainly the majority of the bishops gave His Beatitude an ovation following his intervention."


2 posted on 10/09/2005 9:26:10 AM PDT by Tantumergo
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To: Tantumergo; Teófilo; NYer; bornacatholic
"Since the Council of Trullo, in the first millenium, the East has taken the view that celibates should be monastics, and the norm for parishes should be married priests."

Indeed this is the position and it goes even further to say that monastics should beliving completely outside the World in monasteries. In practice, especially here in the States, there are monastics who serve in parishes, but that is relatively rare and resorted to usually when there is a specific need for a priest and when there is no monastery nearby. In the East, monastics are not parish priests, and parish priests are virtually always married, or widowed, men. This is not to say that monastics and monasteries do not interact in some manner with the world around them. In fact, except on the Holy Mountain, monasteries, both for men and for women, seem to have an almost symbiotic relationship with the people and villages around them, but its not in the nature of the relationship between the parish priest and the parishioners. In fact, anything approaching regular attendence at Divine Litrgy in a monastery chapel or church is positively discouraged.
3 posted on 10/09/2005 10:05:13 AM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Kolokotronis; bornacatholic; Tantumergo; Teófilo; RKBA Democrat
The question of married priests, from what I have read, surfaces at each synod. It is discussed and then dropped. The media, however, view this as a hot topic button and use it to sensationalize their reporting. Take for example, the coverage give to Cardinal Sfeir's remarks on this topic. Here are the headlines from various papers:

Catholic priests look East in vain marriage hope - Gulf Times

Eastern Cardinal sees problems with married priests - USA TOday

Eastern rite Cardinal says married priests would create problems - Tucson Citizen

So what did the Cardinal say on this topic?

Cardinal Nasrallah Butros Sfeir warned the Synod of Bishops in Rome on Friday that allowing Roman Catholic priests to marry might resolve the priest shortage but would create new and "equally serious" problems. Married priests have to divert their attention away from their parishes to their wives and children, Sfeir explained, adding that a priest with a family is more difficult to move to a different parish.

Sfeir called celibacy "the precious jewel in the treasure of the Catholic Church" and asked for prayers so the Church can find an "adequate solution" to the priest shortage.

At the end of this synod, this topic will shrivel and die on the vine, just as it has in previous synods.

4 posted on 10/09/2005 11:20:01 AM PDT by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: NYer; Kolokotronis

You may worship in a Maronite Church, NYer, but you certainly haven't caught on to the Eastern phronema yet, have you?

Don't underestimate the influence of Gregory III. He is a Patriarch and, as such, carries much more clout than any Cardinal. He is determined to follow in the footsteps of his predecessor Maximos and he has the support of many Latin bishops.

This Pope may yet turn out to be the Pope of surprises that Martini predicted after his election. If I were you I would get on my knees!


5 posted on 10/09/2005 3:04:24 PM PDT by Tantumergo
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To: Tantumergo; Kolokotronis
The Melkites' influence far exceeds their numbers. But, for me, I have always appreciated the explanation for continence/celibacy given by Pope Siricius (from memory)...

In the Old Testament Times, Priests sacrificed once yearly. During that time of Temple Service they were bound to the rule of continence, i.e., they had to live apart from their wives and forego the marital act.

New Testaments Priests offer the Sacrifice daily, ergo, perpetual continence/celibacy.

It is my opinion all the inertia is in the direction of maintaining the Ancient Discipline of Continence/Celibacy which is of Apostolic Origins (SeeThe Apostolic Origins of Priestly Celibacy by Christian Cochini).

Is it possible a Melkite Patriarch is more influential than a know-it-all layman?

6 posted on 10/09/2005 3:44:16 PM PDT by bornacatholic
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To: Tantumergo; NYer

"Don't underestimate the influence of Gregory III. He is a Patriarch and, as such, carries much more clout than any Cardinal. He is determined to follow in the footsteps of his predecessor Maximos and he has the support of many Latin bishops."

Don't underestimate him indeed. Of all the Patriarchs and other heads of the Eastern Rite Churches, this is the fellow who has the closest ties with +Constantinople, +Antioch and +Alexandria. Melkite children attend Orthodox schools, they share "RCIA" teachers and classes with the Orthodox and this past Great Lent, the Melkites in at least parts of Lebanon celebrated Pascha not only on the Orthodox date, but in Orthodox Churches (and, as I understand it, vice versa). He has been outspoken in his comments at this Synod on the state of the Latin Church, and not in a favorable tone. He is the worthy successor of Maximos IV who, at Vatican II questioned why the Melkite Church should consider post-schism councils of the Latin Church truly Ecumenical and Gregory II who left Vatican I before it was over, not signing is assent to the declaration of Papal Infallibility. Rome later demanded that he sign, which he did, with the following addendum: "...all rights, privileges and prerogatives of the Patriarchs of the Eastern Churches being respected".

Times are changing in the Eastern Rite Churches. The days of fawning obedience to Rome and the Pope are near over. Recognition of this by the Synod and the Pope by listening to the East, taking to heart and implementing some of the adjustments called for by Eastern Rite hierarchs, especially in regards to the Eucharist, would be an intelligent and spiritually favorable course to follow. Reject them out of hand, expecting the Eastern Rite Christians to stand by while the liturgical and Eucharistic abuses which unfortunately abound in parts of the Latin Church continue and, well, I guess I wouldn't be surprised if we live to see Eastern Rite Catholics commemorating Orthodox hierarchs at Divine Liturgy


7 posted on 10/09/2005 3:45:18 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: bornacatholic

"Is it possible a Melkite Patriarch is more influential than a know-it-all layman?"

Let me try this one....

Yup!


8 posted on 10/09/2005 4:01:05 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Tantumergo; Kolokotronis; RKBA Democrat; bornacatholic; redhead; sandyeggo
If I were you I would get on my knees!

Kneeling is a 'western' tradition. Standing, as done in the East, is the ultimate form of worship! (just ask my non-baptized, German father who attended one Maronite liturgy and swore he would never return :-).

That said, our bi-ritual (Maronite & Latin Rite) pastor insists that we kneel for the Consecration. Occasionally we will have visitors from Lebanon; they stand for the Consecration, out of respect. In the Latin Church, we stand for the reading of the Gospel ... out of respect. Please do not belittle standing vs kneeling; they each have great meaning, depending on which church one is attending.

You may worship in a Maronite Church, NYer, but you certainly haven't caught on to the Eastern phronema yet, have you?

First off ... let's clarify this term. According to my research, "phronema" means the completely self-sacrificial trust and faith in religious and ethical truths which derive not from human experience and wisdom, but from the voice of God through revelation, which is self-evident and does not undergo censure or doubt. This super-subjective origin of phronema is expressed in the New Testament with the well-known term 'mind of Christ', which is almost synonymous with phronema.

Before I continue, are we all agreed on this definition? How ironic that the ultra trads accused me of practicing the faith in a Novus Ordo liturgy when I should have been attending a TLM or SSPX service. Now I am handed similar accusations from catholics, some practicing in Eastern Churches and Orthodox, accusing the Maronite Church of lacking 'phronema'.

Of one thing I am certain, I prayed with a sincere heart to our Lord to deliver me from the weekly agony of attending mass in a RC parish where small liturgical abuses prevailed. I made my appeal in simplistic terms, asking our Lord to guide me to a holy man, reverent liturgy and welcoming community. I never discounted the possibility that this could be found in the RC Church and compiled a list of parishes within the local community. It was 'Sandyeggo' who recommended that I also include any Eastern Rite churches; so I recompiled the list to include the only two here in Albany - one Maronite and one Ukrainian.

Each week I attended Mass at a different RC parish. It was pretty much the same as the one I had attended the previous week at a different parish. Each week I submitted the same prayer to our Lord. Eventually, the first Eastern Catholic Church surfaced. It just happened to be the Maronite Church. I arrived one hour early (equipped with the wrong mass times) and spent one hour in prayer before our Lord present in the Tabernacle. That Sunday will forever stand out in my mind. On that day, an extraordinary grace was granted to this truly humble servant of God. It was never requested and totally unexpected. The following week, the Ukrainian Church was next on my list but it just happened to be my birthday and, reflecting back on that 'grace', I chose to return to the Maronite Church. Once again, I was overwhelmed by this beautiful and totally unexpected grace, which was repeated. When the following Sunday rolled around, I took out the list of local community parishes, reflected on the awesome grace extended to me and, like the total idiot that I am, understood that God, in His great mercy, had used these two visits to answer my prayer. Sometimes it takes a sledgehammer to grasp and recognize what it is that God is saying.

And so, on that 3rd Sunday following my first visit to the Maronite Church, I returned. Even then, I was still grappling with this message. That Sunday, there was no extraordinary grace extended but there was yet one more phenomenon. It was the final one, alerting me to the fact that "this" is where God wanted me.

So, if 'phronema' means what is described above, then the Maronite Church has given me the "self-sacrificial trust and faith in religious and ethical truths which derive not from human experience and wisdom, but from the voice of God."

At this juncture in my life and, following these extraordinary experiences, I have entrusted myself to Him and seek nothing more than to give back to a small community in great need. May His name be forever blessed and worshiped!

9 posted on 10/09/2005 4:58:15 PM PDT by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: NYer; Tantumergo
" Before I continue, are we all agreed on this definition?"

+Stylianos' definition is the one you choose? Interesting. Among the Orthodox he is often referred to as the "pagan poet" and when it was suggested that he be sent to America as Archbishop, the Church here rose up and even the Greek government warned off the EP from that very, very bad idea. I suspect that Tantumergo, and I know I, are using it in a more prosaic manner, namely to describe the worldview or the mindset of Eastern Christians as they view the world and live out The Faith as they have been taught by The Faith. You've heard me tell of my wife commenting that the people in my ancestral village "walk Orthodox". That's an observation of phronema. It develops by living The Faith throughout a lifetime among people who are doing the same thing and having a particular concept of Christianity become the defining raison d'etre of your existence. At a minimum, with Eastern Christianity (and maybe with Roman Catholicism too for all I know) it takes years to acquire if one comes to The Faith as an adult.

I doubt that Tantumergo is making any value judgments about an Eastern as opposed to a Roman phronema. I certainly wouldn't. But I can say that they are different and that the West and the East look at and react to or live out the same Mysteries of The Faith in very different, at times seemingly opposite, ways.

No one would ever, to my knowledge, assert that the Maronite Church has no phronema. Indeed it does, a very particular Maronite phronema quite unlike that of the other particular churches which make up The Church.

In general usage, which is to say not necessarily that which +Stylianos has come up with, you did not receive "phronema" from the Maronite Church on those Sunday's over a year ago. Someday you may develop a Maronite phronema, but that will only happen if you shed your Roman one. The two cannot exist together. To attempt to do that is a form of pride. What you did receive on those Sundays though, NYer, was a great gift from the Holy Spirit, a gift which if you are prayerful and diligent, will bring you to a new...and different... way of looking at The Faith which can lead to a new and different and, for you, better way of living your life.
10 posted on 10/09/2005 5:49:47 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Tantumergo

"Our Melkite-Greek Catholic Patriarch Gregory III has advocated the cause of a married priesthood at the Synod. The Melkites are a theologically conservative Church. Therefore, His Beatitude is taking a conservative position when he argues that married men should be ordained priests. It is the Eastern Christian tradition."

I love the Melkites. You can count on them to be the ones who push the envelope. In a theologically conservative way, of course.


11 posted on 10/10/2005 5:34:11 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.)
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To: NYer

"At the end of this synod, this topic will shrivel and die on the vine, just as it has in previous synods."

I don't think so. I think it might die as a topic in the western church, because a married priesthood simply hasn't been the tradition of the western church. But I would not be surprised if at the end of the synod we see a sudden end to rules in some of the eastern churches that still disallow married priests in the U.S. and Canada.


12 posted on 10/10/2005 5:40:22 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.)
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To: NYer

"How ironic that the ultra trads accused me of practicing the faith in a Novus Ordo liturgy when I should have been attending a TLM or SSPX service. Now I am handed similar accusations from catholics, some practicing in Eastern Churches and Orthodox, accusing the Maronite Church of lacking 'phronema'. "

I had to chuckle at this. Eastern Catholicism does seem to be a bit of a no-man's land, taking shots from both sides at times.

The paradox, though, is that once you remove yourself from the latest theological debates, it is a very peaceful place.


13 posted on 10/10/2005 5:57:27 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.)
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To: Kolokotronis

"That's an observation of phronema. It develops by living The Faith throughout a lifetime among people who are doing the same thing and having a particular concept of Christianity become the defining raison d'etre of your existence. At a minimum, with Eastern Christianity (and maybe with Roman Catholicism too for all I know) it takes years to acquire if one comes to The Faith as an adult."

Interesting you mention that. I stole a few moments last night to continue reading a book entitled "Mountain of Silence" by Kyriacos Markides. As I was reflecting on it, it was obvious to me that I'm green when it comes to eastern Christian spirituality.


14 posted on 10/10/2005 6:06:13 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.)
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To: RKBA Democrat
I would not be surprised if at the end of the synod we see a sudden end to rules in some of the eastern churches that still disallow married priests in the U.S. and Canada.

Doubtful. Aren't they required to comply with the regulations of the predominant Latin Church in this country? Not sure what the proper term is but someone pointed this out to me yesterday after Divine Liturgy.

Then too, given the examples submitted by Patriarch Sfeir, why would any Eparchy take on the financial burden of married priests and their children. As Sfeir noted, "celibacy is the jewel of the Catholic Church" ... and he is right.

15 posted on 10/10/2005 6:13:30 AM PDT by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: RKBA Democrat

"Interesting you mention that. I stole a few moments last night to continue reading a book entitled "Mountain of Silence" by Kyriacos Markides."

Isn't that an excellent book? Aside from Prof. Makrides' personal story, which is fascinating, the exposition of how a spiritual father works with his spiritual child and the well of spirituality he opens for that spiritual child are quite marvelous. I have recommended that book to many friends, as well as "The Spiritual Meadow" by John Moschos, with the caution that they suspend their disbelief and read these with just Christian eyes, not 21st century Christian eyes. These books speak about an existence which, while "in" the world, is not "of" the world.


16 posted on 10/10/2005 6:14:04 AM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: RKBA Democrat
once you remove yourself from the latest theological debates, it is a very peaceful place.

which is what I plan to do.

17 posted on 10/10/2005 6:15:05 AM PDT by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: NYer; RKBA Democrat

"Aren't they required to comply with the regulations of the predominant Latin Church in this country?"

I understand that that is the position, as a matter of discpline, of the Maronite Church. It is not the position of other Eastern Rite Churches in communion with Rome. In fact, at the end of the 19th century and beginning of the 20th, when the Irish hierarchs of the Latin Church here in America tried to impose priestly celibacy on Ruthenian priests, it lead to massive schism and the departure of tens of thousands of Ruthenian Greek Catholics into Orthodoxy. The descendants of these people are now in the OCA and the GOA.

"Then too, given the examples submitted by Patriarch Sfeir, why would any Eparchy take on the financial burden of married priests and their children. As Sfeir noted, "celibacy is the jewel of the Catholic Church" ... and he is right."

This seems to me the most base and crass reason one could come up with to bar married men from the priesthood! What Roman Catholics don't seem to understand (there's that phronema thing again), given your system, is that it is not the Eparchy or diocese which takes on that burden, but rather in the Eastern Churches the local parish...you and me in the pews. It is a heavy burden, no doubt about it. Everyone, from the kids to the nonagenarians, has to work the suppers and festivals (which can be a year in the planning) and dig deep to pay not only the usual two collections, but also to meet an annual pledge. Hard work, but it builds a vibrant, deeply interconnected community and leads us all to trust that God will provide through our efforts. Our own little parish now budgets over $90,000.00 per year for the priest.

+Sfeir is on the money if he is saying that a married parish priesthood is not the panacea some think it is. As I have noted before, it brings its own set of problems. And there can be no argument with his comment that celibacy is the crown jewel of The Faith. But to reduce the question to dollars and cents is unfortunate in the extreme since that should have absolutely nothing to do with it and to me seems merely a cop out.


18 posted on 10/10/2005 7:18:09 AM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Kolokotronis; RKBA Democrat; Convert from ECUSA
It is a heavy burden, no doubt about it. Everyone, from the kids to the nonagenarians, has to work the suppers and festivals (which can be a year in the planning) and dig deep to pay not only the usual two collections, but also to meet an annual pledge. Hard work, but it builds a vibrant, deeply interconnected community and leads us all to trust that God will provide through our efforts.

We do that in our parish as well. In fact, I have scheduled 3 days vacation in order to pitch in and help with the food preparation for our annual 'Hafli', later this month. Father reviews the budget with ALL the parishioners twice each year; unfortunately, even in the Eastern Churches, some people believe they don't need to go to church and that places an additional strain on those of us who pitch in to keep the parish up and running. And ... we are not supporting a wife and kids ... just one celibate priest. God bless this holy man who has to rent a room in the rectory of another parish. He has built up our parish's finances with the intention of moving us to a safer neighborhood and larger church.

But to reduce the question to dollars and cents is unfortunate in the extreme since that should have absolutely nothing to do with it and to me seems merely a cop out.

I didn't interpret his comments in that way. He gave a straightforward assessment from his experience. If ordaining married men to the priesthood resolves the priestly shortage, it also accrues other issues. A married priest's first priority is to his first vow - marriage. The priest is responsible to support his wife and children and provide for them. A bishop also has more difficulty in relocating a married priest than an unmarried one. Those are facts, not a cop out.

With regard to celibacy: “Celibacy is the most precious jewel in the treasure of the Catholic Church. But how do you conserve it in an atmosphere full of eroticism: newspapers, Internet, advertising posters, shows, all shameless and always wounding the virtue of chastity,” he said.

19 posted on 10/10/2005 8:50:53 AM PDT by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: RKBA Democrat
But I would not be surprised if at the end of the synod we see a sudden end to rules in some of the eastern churches that still disallow married priests in the U.S. and Canada.

Those rules should never have been enacted, represent a breach of trust between Rome and the East, and violate the Vatican II decree on the eastern churches. They ought to die a richly-deserved death.

Just my opinion. :-)

20 posted on 10/10/2005 9:16:15 AM PDT by Campion (Truth is not determined by a majority vote -- Pope Benedict XVI)
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