A "slam-dunk" beatification for the last of the Fatima visionaries

National Catholic Reporter ^ | 2/18/2005 | John L. Allen

[thor76]

Kindly look at the fingers of her in the casket, and then compare those to the alleged photo of her having the conversation with Mal Gibson. Those are not the same hands.

[Salvation]

Bump that thought!

[Salvation]

Welcome to FR Religion Forum.

[vox_freedom]

You stated my view,

Thanks.

[Salvation]

Sister Lucia, last remaining witness of Fatima apparitions, dies at 97

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Sister Lucia, last remaining witness of Fatima apparitions, dies at 97

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Lucy and the Pirates

Cardinal Bertone Making Contradictions about Fatima, Once Again

A "slam-dunk" beatification for the last of the Fatima visionaries

[sinkspur]

Kindly look at the fingers of her in the casket, and then compare those to the alleged photo of her having the conversation with Mal Gibson. Those are not the same hands.

For heaven's sake!! So, now there's a "body double" for Sister Lucia?

You have mastered the art.

[thor76]

'For heaven's sake!! So, now there's a "body double" for Sister Lucia?"

The two pictures are there for you to see.

And in the first one, Mel Gibson is engaged in conversation with a nonagenerian who has been blind and deaf for some time.....and appears younger, heavier, vivacious, and is wearing regular glasses.

[sinkspur]

And in the first one, Mel Gibson is engaged in conversation with a nonagenerian who has been blind and deaf for some time.....and appears younger, heavier, vivacious, and is wearing regular glasses.

And the other one is a corpse, after a three month illness.

But, you integrists will see a conspiracy where there is none.

[sinkspur]

Carolyn, you and I are not on a friendly, first name basis. You do not have permission to use my name on the public threads. This is the first and only time I will use yours. Stop using mine.

Whoa, Debbie! If you don't like your name used in posts, then change it.

What pettiness!!!

[fatima]

So who is in the casket?

[Canticle_of_Deborah]

If you want to be on a first name basis then tell me yours. This has been a one way privilege for you so far.

Otherwise, you and your Novus Ordo buddies will use my screen name in accordance with forum rules.

[Gerard.P]

I'm sorry. Why are you here?

I'm here for the LUV.

I am sure that like all great nations the US will fade away. I am positive we all make mistakes in the world, but, they are mistakes made, and discussed, and we are free to criticize them. People screw up. They do all the time. No Earthly government can be perfect like our Kingdom in Heaven. I think that is the actual Catholic position.

"Mistakes" Sodom and Gomorrha made mistakes too. God's pencils have erasers on them that I personally don't want to bring down on me.

Having said that, I think I can say you have lost your mind, if you think Freedom is possible without Self-government.

Self-Government is an illusion. You are just as much under the thumb of the government in the form of the IRS, or the Courts than you would be in any Communist or Dictatorial or Monarchic system.

Are you a conservative or did you lose your way to DU? Seriously, we all agree way back, that a man is responsible for his actions, and any license he takes is at his own peril.

LOL! You are thinking only in terms of Conservative and Liberal as defined by the two party system which are in essence both sides of Liberalism. G.K. Chesterton: "the job of Progressives is to continue to make mistakes. The job of Conservatives is to prevent those mistakes from being corrected."

What are you claiming here, we need a big brother to watch over our actions, to ensure our freedom is not "license"?

Not a Big Brother. We need a Holy Father and one who knows what his job is.

No, we need our freedom, and the consequences of our actions form the hand that presses us to live above our fallen nature, and live out God's Holy Law. We know the consequences of Mass murder. We fight against it, and are free to do so; remember in many European nations you are not free to protest abortion, but you can strike for more pay and less work.

I'm sure many of them present themselves as "Democracies". America is just sliding more and more towards that slavery called Democracy where God is thorougly rejected in the name of "tolerance" Any country that denies Christ is intrinsically doing the work of the Devil. Period.

My tag has words I like a lot. We have the freedom, to do as we ought to do, not just act like savages.

It's a weakened version of one of JPII's friends phrases. Fr. Malachi Martin used to say, "Wrong never has a right!"

[Canticle_of_Deborah]

sinkspur, you DO NOT have permission to use my personal information on public threads.

RM, is that correct according to the forum rules?

[nonsumdignus]

Sorry. I've already told you to call me "sinky." That's my first name.

If you choose not to use it, so be it.

But, for me, I'll use "Debbie" when appropriate.

The poster asks you respectfully to not use a particular name (and according to forum rules, and you, a "Catholic deacon", dismiss her request in a manner akin to a child. Where is the charity? Where is the good example for all those non-Catholics to see?

[sinkspur]

All right, all right.

Sheesh! Sensitivities, sensitivities. If you're gonna run to momma, howsa about we just avoid each other?

[sinkspur]

Another church lady dutifully heard from. Thanks for the concern, nsd.

[Markjwyatt]

Results of the appearance of the Virgin of Guadalupe:

From http://www.queenofpeace.ca/The%20Story.htm.

"In the next ten years[after the apparition- Mark], nine million natives converted to Catholicism. The missionaries, once discouraged in their efforts, were swamped with hundreds of baptisms every day. Our Lady more than compensated for the large numbers leaving the Catholic Church in Europe during the Reformation. She came to a conquered and defeated people as a Mother and gently guided them to the Truth."

Results of Bishops of Portugal consecrating their country:

From http://www.catholicintl.com/epologetics/articles/mary/fatima-controversy13.htm

"on May 13, 1931 which served as a heaven-sent sign of what a valid consecration would do. As noted earlier in this essay, on that date, in the presence of 300,000 Catholics who came to Fatima, the bishops of Portugal consecrated their nation to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. They desired to protect Portugal from the threat of communism that was sweeping Europe, having already entered into Spain, their closest neighbor. Nothing short of the miraculous was experienced by the Portugese people as a result of this consecration. Within ten years, the number of religious vocations quadrupled. Catholic radio, a Catholic press, Catholic pilgrimages and spiritual retreats dotted the landscape as never before. The country was totally transformed, to say the least. Antonia Salazar ascended to power in 1933 and inaugurated a Catholic social movement unprecedented in recent history, wherein government and Catholic ideals were integrated at the highest levels, along with a total restoring of family values. Divorce was outlawed. By 1960, over 90% of all Portugal's marriages were canonical. Salazar's efforts were so extraordinary that he received the personal congratulations from Pius XII. Miraculously, Portugal was spared the effects both of the Spanish Civil War and any involvement in World War II. On February 6, 1939, Sister Lucia wrote to her bishop in Portugal, Monsignor da Silva stating: "...in this horrible war [World War II], Portugal would be spared because of the national consecration to the Immaculate Heart of Mary made by the bishops" At about the same time, Sister Lucia wrote to Pius XII and told him that, had the other nations done likewise, they would have enjoyed the same blessings as Portugal."

Results of Fatima requested consecration of Russia- change from aetheistic communism to aetheistic captialism. Whata jip!

[NYer]

You do not have permission to use my name on the public threads. This is the first and only time I will use yours.

Huh? Your name is not Canticle of Deborah? What name are we supposed to use?

As to the absurd notion that the Sr. Lucia in the coffin is not the same one in the photograph with Mel Gibson, take another look. The camera angle is straight on which creates an optical distortion.

Please post a reputable news source for your allegation that Sr. Lucia was deaf and blind for the past 3 years.

[NYer]

If you look at the link I have already posted you will find the source of the facts.

Agence France Presse reported .....

"Named Lucia de Jesus dos Santos when she was born on March 22, 1907, in recent years she suffered from blindness and deafness. "

One of my coworkers suffers from 'deafness'. She refuses to wear a hearing aid so she asks people to repeat what they say. Deafness is not the same as deaf; blindness is not the same as blind.