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POLL: CLARK LEADS DEMOCRATIC CONTENDERS. (RED BARRACKS EMPORER ALERT!!)
Drudge Report ^ | Sat Sep 20 2003 16:13:43 ET | Drudge Report

Posted on 09/20/2003 2:24:08 PM PDT by .cnI redruM

Retired Gen. Wesley Clark, who announced his presidential candidacy this week, leads all Democratic contenders who are currently in the race with 14 percent of the vote among registered Democrats and Democratic leaners, according to the latest Newsweek Poll. He's followed by former Vermont Governor Howard Dean and Connecticut Senator Joe Lieberman, who both get 12 percent of the vote. Clark's impressive debut is undercut, however, by the sizable percentage of all those polled (45%) who say they've never heard of him before now, the poll shows.

President Bush's job approval rating continued to drop in the Newsweek Poll, to 51 percent. And by a margin of 50 percent to 44 percent, registered voters say they would not like to see Bush re-elected to another term.

For the first time in the Newsweek Poll, Bush's approval for his handling of the situation in Iraq has dropped below 50 percent to 46 percent, a drop of 5 percentage points from the Newsweek Poll of September 11-12, 2003. Forty-seven percent of all those polled disapprove of how he's handling the situation in Iraq, an increase of 5 percentage points from the earlier poll. Bush's approval slide continues in ratings for his handling of other issues. On the economy: approval dropped to 38 percent (from 41%) but disapproval jumped six points to 57 percent. Bush also scores in the low 40s on the environment (43%) and taxes (42%). The only area where Bush continues strong support is his handling of policies to prevent and minimize terrorism at home: 66 percent, the poll shows.

(Excerpt) Read more at drudgereport.com ...


TOPICS: Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2004; barracksemporer; butcherofkosovo; poll
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Yep, Weasley Clark could really win.....

This MUST be stopped.

1 posted on 09/20/2003 2:24:08 PM PDT by .cnI redruM
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To: .cnI redruM
I really don't think so. If he perceived as a major threat, Bush & Co would have already started leaking some dirt on the guy. He was just the one in the news this week, and is clearly better than the rest of the yahoos currently in the race.
2 posted on 09/20/2003 2:27:40 PM PDT by ilgipper
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To: .cnI redruM
Though I have little faith in the Media, I do know they act like sharks when there is blod in the water. If Mr Clark has no one to turn to to tell him what he thinks in the debate, the other candidates quickly followed by the press will chew him up and like an overinflated Bill & Hill beach ball he will explode.
3 posted on 09/20/2003 2:31:40 PM PDT by TAP ONLINE (Url is at top. Interesting article.)
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To: .cnI redruM
No one in this world,
so far as I know_and I have searched the records for years,
and employed agents to help me_
has ever lost money
by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses
of the plain people.

H.L. MENCKEN, in Chicago Tribune (and frequently misquoted)

4 posted on 09/20/2003 2:34:36 PM PDT by Allan
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To: .cnI redruM
"Let's make one thing real clear, I would never have voted for this war," Clark said before a speech at the University of Iowa. "I've gotten a very consistent record on this. There was no imminent threat. This was not a case of pre-emptive war. I would have voted for the right kind of leverage to get a diplomatic solution, an international solution to the challenge of Saddam Hussein."

Now if this horses ass had come out in favor of the war, then maybe the GOP would have something to worry about.

He's just another liberal moron.

5 posted on 09/20/2003 2:44:15 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: .cnI redruM
After months of having his face plastered on CNN, the best Clark can do is a statistical tie with Dean and LIEberman?

Sheesh, some race to the top!!!

6 posted on 09/20/2003 2:46:28 PM PDT by OldFriend (DEMS INHABIT A PARALLEL UNIVERSE)
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To: OldFriend
Well, I think the Deanies won't take to Clark well at all. And Clark has a personality that the more people see, the less they will like. Clark is the darling of the Press Corps, nothing else.
7 posted on 09/20/2003 2:49:24 PM PDT by HitmanLV (I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.)
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To: OldFriend


 

 

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War in The Balkans -

Truth may prove most useful propaganda tool


[British] The Independent, 15 April 1999


By Rupert Cornwell

Excerpts:

Even in war, the first casualty - just occasionally - need not be the truth. Sometimes, indeed, there is no alternative to the truth. That was the lesson of Nato's bombing of the Serb train on Monday in which 10 [actually 27] civilians died.

Assuming allied planes were mistakenly responsible for yesterday's far deadlier attack on a refugee convoy in southern Kosovo, the lesson will be even more bitter.

In this war, as in every war, propaganda is a vital weapon. It is vital for the Western democracies, where strategies ultimately depend on public opinion - but it is also vital for Belgrade. By fast public relations footwork, Nato has neutralised the train disaster. If confirmed, the slaughter of refugees - 70 ethnic Albanians, according to the Serbs - will be far harder to cope with.

Convince the public the cause is just, liken the enemy to Hitler, sanitise every nastiness perpetrated by your side, and claim you are firmly on the way to victory - these are the rules of the game. Both sides have been faithfully playing them. Until the train on the bridge at Leskovac.

The affair could have been a PR disaster, proof of how the allies in their frustration at their failure to land a knockout blow to the Milosevic military machine were sinking to terror bombing of helpless civilians. Prevarication, or pretending the train was a legitimate military target, would have made matters even worse.

Instead, we witnessed a rare and deliberate show of honesty. It was an "unfortunate accident. We are all very sorry for it," Nato's supreme commander, General Wesley Clark, said as the press was shown a full cockpit video of the incident. The pilot, it transpired, had fired not one bomb, but two; the second after he knew he had hit a train. Quite why that second attack happened is unclear. But we basically know what happened, and few more questions need to be asked. If allied planes hit the refugee convoy near Djakovica [Kosovo], we must brace for a far more harrowing mea culpa from Nato - and, conceivably, a sea change in public attitudes to the air war...

Nato, of course, propagates its... brand of wishful thinking. Early on, we were told of Kosovo Albanian leaders who had been murdered. It transpired they had not and Nato, admittedly, retracted the claim. On Sunday, its spokesmen were claiming to detect fissures in the Yugoslav army's high command over President Milosevic's policy in Kosovo. The next day, despite every sign that the war is solidifying support for Milosevic, the Secretary of State for Defence, George Robertson, was virtually predicting a coup.

But these are small errors, set against the giant shadow cast over everything the allies say by the miscalculation with which the war started. A few days, they said, just a handful of cruise missiles, before the dictator came to his senses.

"We always knew this would be a long haul," Nato now insists. If so, then everything it implied, if not said aloud, before 24 March was nonsense. But did not World War One begin with the blithe conviction the boys would be home for Christmas?

So far, Western public opinion doubts about the air war strategy have been submerged by the flood of [fabricated] horror stories of pillage, rape and murder committed by the Serbs. But these stories, too, could in turn be submerged by the horror of what apparently happened near the Kosovo town of Djakovica.

For the Serbs, the carnage was a propaganda coup [?]: a "crime against humanity" according to the Foreign Ministry in Belgrade - exactly the language used by Nato leaders to describe Mr Milosevic's tactics.

The attack strikes at the heart of the weakness of Nato's presentation of the war - not lies over daily events, but the fog of confusion and contradictions surrounding the war's ends. Suddenly Kosovo is acquiring the reek of Vietnam.

"We will win the war," say Blair, Clinton et al, day after successive day of bombing targets that never seem to be destroyed the first time around. Ah, but the bombing is working, they insist, only to order another 300 aircraft to finish the job - and risk more disasters similar to yesterday's. Defying, if not the truth, at least elementary common sense, they cling to the Rambouillet formula that Kosovo remains part of Yugoslavia even after the war...
(End quote)


War in The Balkans -

The civilians pay in blood


[British] The Independent, 15 April 1999


By Robert Fisk

Excerpts:

Blood is beginning to spatter Nato's campaign in Yugoslavia. Just under two weeks ago, it was the blood of 26 Serb civilians in the town of Aleksinac. Then on Monday, it was the blood of 27 Serb passengers - the latest figure for fatalities - on a railway train bombed by a Nato jet.

Yesterday, up to 60 Kosovo Albanian refugees were reported torn to pieces by Nato bombs in Kosovo. That phrase "collateral damage" is beginning to sound ever more obscene.

Needless to say, the Serb government is happy [???] to publicise these atrocities - just as Nato is ready and willing [and happy!?] to report every atrocity committed by Serb forces in Kosovo. But Nato's new ground rules are playing into Serbian hands.

For it is becoming clearer that somewhere - in Washington, perhaps, or Brussels or the Aviano air base in Italy - someone has decided that Serb civilians must suffer for their country's [fabricated] sins. Or that their lives can now be regarded as forfeit if they live near a barracks or an airfield or happen to be on a passenger train.

The Serb authorities - who denied the stories told by thousands of Albanian refugees of "ethnic cleansing" at the hands of Serb forces - were quite specific in their description of the slaughter of as many as 75 Albanian refugees, first near the village of Medjan, at 1.30pm, then at Bistrazin at 3pm. The Kosovo Albanians were travelling in cars and tractors, "escorted" by at least three Serb policemen. The policemen were also killed.

Did Nato believe these were Serbs driving down the roads of southern Kosovo? Or did they see military traffic and decide - as they did when they bombed a barracks 50 metres from a Belgrade hospital on Tuesday - that the risk of harming civilians was worth taking? That now seems to be Nato's policy in its bombardment of Yugoslavia.

Wesley Clark, the general who thought he could fight a war without ground troops, gave a deeply unsettling performance this week when he tried to explain the train massacre.

The pilot saw the train enter his bomb frame only at the last second, he said. But then - incredibly, knowing the train was there - he returned to fire two more missiles at the railway bridge.
(End quote)


Milosevic Responsible For All Casualties - Blair


Press Association, 14 April 1999


[British] Prime Minister Tony Blair has insisted that Yugoslav President Slobodan Milosevic bears full responsibility for any casualties in the Kosovo conflict.

He said nothing emerging from the Serbian propaganda machine could be taken at face value, but even if refugees had been accidentally killed by Nato's air campaign, responsibility rested with the Serb leadership.

Mr Blair was speaking at the end of an emergency meeting of EU leaders in Brussels which, he said, had produced unanimous agreement that military attacks must carry on until all Nato's five demands are met.

The Prime Minister said the EU member states - all but four of which are also Nato members - were determined to beat Milosevic. "We are determined to defeat his policy of ethnic cleansing and determined that it should be seen to be defeated - and Milosevic along with it."

News of the air raid which reportedly killed dozens of Kosovo-Albanian refugees came in as the EU leaders were meeting to reaffirm Western unity over the military strategy.

Mr Blair commented: "We cannot take at face value any claim made by the Serb authorities, and anything they do they use for propaganda purposes.

"We go to extraordinary lengths to limit any civilian damage or casualties at all. Secondly, I would say to you that the responsibility for anything that happens to people in this conflict rests with Milosevic. He is the person who has brought this Nato action upon himself. He is the person responsible for causing this conflict by the appalling and evil policy of ethnic cleansing."

The Prime Minister emphasised: "We take every single measure we can to try to avoid civilian casualties. Unfortunately in a situation like this sometimes it happens, though as I say I wouldn't believe or take at face value anything the Serb authorities say."

Mr Blair said all EU leaders were agreed there can be no compromise on Nato's five principles, including the total withdrawal from Kosovo of all Serb forces and the unconditional return to their homeland of the refugees, under the protection of an international security force led by Nato.

"We are united behind those principles and we shall see them through," said Mr Blair.
(End quote)


Should the deaths of 10 civilian train passengers lead to a rethinking of the Nato bombing strategy?


Guardian, 14 April 1999


Opinions:

Alice Mahon, Labour MP for Halifax and chairman of the Committee for Peace in the Balkans

Yes, I certainly think it should. It is not just this 10 who have died. There have been over 300 civilian deaths, many of them women and children. These are not the targets that Nato is supposed to be after.

The world's first "humanitarian" war has turned into a huge humanitarian disaster. What is humanitarian about the bombing of civilians on passenger trains, or car workers trying to protect their jobs by sitting-in, or by dropping cluster bombs and munitions containing radioactive depleted uranium which will ensure that thousands of the country's children Serbs and Albanians alike will suffer from disease and malnutrition long after the war is over?

I don't think that Nato can call this a successful campaign when the Kosovans have lost their country and the Serb population carries terrified children and elderly people into cellars night after night.

It is clear that Nato is intent on bombing roads, water facilities, electricity stations and factories, and a massive destruction of infrastructure. It becomes clear that a European country is being bombed into the stone age in front of our eyes.

Our only hope rests on getting some sanity into international affairs, getting the UN and the Russians involved, getting the tragic refugees home, and to stop bombing an innocent population, many of whom were marching in their thousands against Milosevic and are now behind him.

Talking, negotiation, compromise will end this madness. Not bombing.


John Pilger, war correspondent and film-maker

George Robertson claims he and Tony Blair approve every target. So who approved the bombing of a civilian railway bridge? Who approved the bombing of the Zastava car factory when Nato knew there were 10,000 protesters inside? Who approved the bombing of the centre of Pristina in Kosovo and the entirely civilian town of Novi Sad and the mining town of Aleksinac?

The children of the woman lying beneath the rubble would like to know, Secretary of State. And the parents of the Kosovan babies who will be born deformed or with leukaemia, will want to know why 'our' pilots are using depleted uranium missiles when you claim to be bombing in order to save them.

These people are expendable. They are 'collateral damage' which is a craven term invented by the Americans to disguise the slaughter in Vietnam.

What Robertson and Blair and Cook are not telling the British public is that the same US military that 'degraded' two million Vietnamese, mostly people they, too, claimed to be protecting, are about to do something similar to Serbia and Kosovo unless civilised voices are heard loud and clear and that this is the shape of wars to come.

The attack on Serbia has nothing to do with humanitarian help and everything to do with Nato demonstrating its power by disciplining an uppity tyrant who didn't obey orders. Inexcusably, that truth has been the first casualty.
(End of quoting Opinion section of [British] Guardian).


Back to:

[ NATO's attack on Yugoslavia ]


The truth belongs to us all.

Feel free to download, copy and redistribute.

Last revised: May 18, 1999

 

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8 posted on 09/20/2003 2:50:55 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: HitmanNY
Wesley Clark, the general who thought he could fight a war without ground troops, gave a deeply unsettling performance this week when he tried to explain the train massacre.

"The pilot saw the train enter his bomb frame only at the last second, he said. But then - incredibly, knowing the train was there - he returned to fire two more missiles at the railway bridge". (End quote)

9 posted on 09/20/2003 2:52:20 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: Rome2000
There you go, Crap on The Barracks Emporer. Nicely done.
10 posted on 09/20/2003 2:52:21 PM PDT by .cnI redruM (There are two certainties. Death and Texas.)
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To: HitmanNY
Seems that the Deanies have jumped ship to embrace the warrior.

Amazing display of utter ignorance.

11 posted on 09/20/2003 2:53:00 PM PDT by OldFriend (DEMS INHABIT A PARALLEL UNIVERSE)
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To: OldFriend
Wait and see - that's a hard one to swallow, I think.
12 posted on 09/20/2003 2:58:00 PM PDT by HitmanLV (I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.)
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To: .cnI redruM
"I suppose it was inevitable, after all the rubbish churned out by Nato's spokesmen during the bombardment of Yugoslavia, that General Wesley Clark -- now apparently in disgrace after urging British paratroops to go to war with the Russians at Pristina airport -- would make one desperate last effort to prove that Nato was "on target".

At the alliance headquarters in Brussels yesterday evening, of course, there was no talk about the hundreds of civilians who died under Nato's bombs, no elucidation of Clark's heated argument with General Sir Michael Jackson -- at which Jackson is reported to have told Clark that he wouldn't "start World War Three for you". Clark declined to talk about this frightening night-time discussion; and the journalists at Nato headquarters, as they had done so many times in the war, allowed him to get away with it.

No, what the good general wanted to tell us was that Nato really had hit more than 100 Serb tanks. Never mind that dozens of journalists who watched the Serb retreat through Kosovo never saw a damaged tank, let alone a destroyed one. Never mind that we could only account for three destroyed armoured vehicles and five lorries (plus a jeep which I saw upended in the ruins of Djakovica police station. No, Nato had the precise figures for us -- more than 93 tanks and 153 armoured personnel carriers were destroyed by Nato.

http://www.agitprop.org.au

13 posted on 09/20/2003 2:59:35 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: Rome2000
DOn't stop there, you're really doing rather nicely....

Take another laxative and crap on him again...LOL!
14 posted on 09/20/2003 3:01:29 PM PDT by .cnI redruM (There are two certainties. Death and Texas.)
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To: HitmanNY
"Russia has sent a request to the International Court of Justice to review the legality of the NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia. Moscow is stating that the NATO actions are illegal since the UN Security Council hasn't authorized it."

http://www.vojvodina.com/arhiva/0413.htm
15 posted on 09/20/2003 3:01:45 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: Rome2000; MeeknMing; Ragtime Cowgirl
Clark did say what you posted

BIG BUTT :

The day before General Waco Clark said he would have voted to go to war with and invade Iraq!

All on videos and audio tapes!

Hey Carl Limbacher (WABS's "Carl from Oyster Bay") this is Jungle Jim from Connecticut -

Carl, out these in short .wav file fornmat and post them in a NewsMax article asp please!

Thanks!

( FR means instant communications )
16 posted on 09/20/2003 3:11:50 PM PDT by autoresponder (CLICK ON ANY PHOTOS OR ANIMATIONS ABOVE FOR IMAGE MATCHED AUDIO .wav FILES)
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To: autoresponder
No Excuse for NATO's Bombing of Civilians

By Mark Weisbrot, AlterNet
April 26, 2000

"This is a coward's war," said a French reporter covering the bombing in Yugoslavia, using a phrase that has been gaining currency in Europe.


It's true. There are no good guys in this conflict. It's really a disgrace to our military, too – dropping bombs from three miles high and showing the whole world that civilian life on the ground is so cheap that NATO is willing to blow hundreds of innocent people to shreds, in order to maintain a "zero risk" policy for its own forces.


Perhaps that is why the American Legion, a conservative organization of 2.9 million veterans, has called for an immediate withdrawal of U.S. forces from the Balkans.


The "collateral damage" is piling up, in the form of mangled and twisted bodies buried under wreckage exploded by NATO's bombs. Last week these bombs struck a hospital, killing four and wounding at least a dozen, including two women struck by flying glass as they were giving birth.


It was the second time in less than two weeks that NATO hit a hospital. The previous bombing of a hospital and outdoor market killed 15 people and wounded 70. Cluster bombs, which spit out thousands of pieces of shrapnel in all directions, were dropped on a residential neighborhood in Nis, Serbia's third largest city.


Even if one believes that our government is motivated by humanitarian concerns – which takes some imagination – there is no excuse for bombing civilians. It is no defense to say that we did not drop these bombs for the specific purpose of murdering civilians. In American law, you are held criminally responsible for the likely consequences of your actions.


It is really only the support of the media that has allowed these atrocities to go on for so long without provoking overwhelming revulsion among Americans. Despite some excellent reporting by individual journalists such as the New York Times' Steven Erlanger, most of the news that reaches most of the public – on TV – is little more than government propaganda.


This deterioration in the media's standards of objectivity once the F-16s have taken off is a serious problem. It gives our leaders an added incentive to bomb first and negotiate later. A recent study by Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting found that only five percent of the sources on ABC's Nightline, for example, were critics of the bombing – and no Americans other than Serbian-Americans were among them. This is clearly not representative of public opinion, which is very divided, nor even of our elected officials: a resolution to support the air strikes was voted down by the U.S. House of Representatives on April 29.


Most Americans are avoiding this war as much as they can, as one ignores the stench from a sewer, hoping it will go away with a shift in the winds. But many Europeans are reaching their limit. The Italian government has now joined the Greek government in calling for a halt to the bombing. In Greece, there have been massive and regular demonstrations of as many as a million people – in a country of ten million – against the war.


Chancellor Gerhard Schroder of Germany has drawn the line at ground troops, stating firmly that Germany will not participate. He is responding to widespread disgust with the war inside his own party, as well as his coalition partner, the Greens. The Greens' conference two weeks ago called for a halt in the bombing, and much of the party was ready to topple the government over the issue. Europe's largest labor union, the German I.G. Metall, has also taken a stand against the war.


Should we expect a higher standard of respect for human life from the Clinton administration than from the Milosevic administration? Most people would say yes, but it has not been forthcoming. Although Yugoslav military and paramilitary forces have probably killed more civilians than NATO has since the bombing began, the order of magnitude is similar. No honest international tribunal could prosecute Milosevic for crimes committed in this war without also indicting the leaders of NATO.


President Clinton claims that NATO's terms for ending the war "are simply what is required for the Kosovars to go home and live in peace." Is that so? Is it required that the bombing continue until Yugoslav troops are withdrawn, or could NATO stop the bombing in order to negotiate? Does a peacekeeping force have to be controlled by NATO, or could it be more neutral?


It is doubtful that the Kosovars, who are paying the price in homelessness and hunger for "NATO's credibility," would want to hold out for the unconditional surrender that the Clinton administration is demanding.


« Home « Top Stories
17 posted on 09/20/2003 3:17:07 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Vote McNader and Bustamante wins)
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To: Rome2000
Scuze me. I gotta grab my binoculars and go across the street and read that.

Can you work the scroll button for me while I'm over there ? :O)


18 posted on 09/20/2003 4:34:04 PM PDT by MeekOneGOP (Check out the Texas Chicken D 'RATS!: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/keyword/Redistricting)
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To: .cnI redruM
(RED BARRACKS EMPORER

EMPEROR
19 posted on 09/20/2003 4:40:12 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: lodwick; BigWaveBetty; Utah Girl
Come take a look at this.
20 posted on 09/20/2003 4:44:19 PM PDT by Iowa Granny ('Tis better to follow in the footsteps of Martha than those of Ruth)
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