Tom McClintock - The conscience of a conservative?

MensNewsDaily.com ^ | September 19, 2003 | Bob Chandra

[DoughtyOne]

I would have been very disappointed to see Arnold do that. If I thought Tom had a prayer of winning, I would switch. If I didn't what choice would I have but to support Arnold? It's just one more thing I'd have to swallow rather than see Cruz get in. Tom's people have no such excuse.

They may not know that, but Tom does. He hasn't a prayer and it's crystal clear to him.

There are a number of issue where I disagree with Arnold. The part the other side simply cannot come to grips with, is that I will not let Cruz in if I can possibly stop him.

Lists of lies and falsehoods don't cut it when letting Cruz in is on the line. This is a simply reality that is either beyond them, or beyond their pay scale to admit.

[Wolfstar]

With all due respect, I have been opposed to this recall from the beginning, for some of the same reasons you mention. However, the time for McClintock to oppose it was BEFORE it became certified. The fact of the matter is that McClintock was wholeheartedly for the recall prior to certification. Yet he now seems to be going out of his way to ensure that Cruz Bustamante will win the replacement part of the question.

So what the heck has this whole recall exercise been about for movement conservatives like McClintock? It was they who began the effort and stuck with it even though it wasn't going anywhere initialy (it took off in June after Davis trippled the car tax). The original stated purpose of the recall was to get rid of Davis and put a Republican in the governor's office. Now the purpose among many of those same conservatives seems to be to defeat Arnold at any cost, even if it means Davis is not recalled or we get a Gov. Bustamante. Sorry, but I just don't get such confused thinking.

[Aquinasfan]

Exactly what is gained by Schwarzenegger being elected?

McClintock is the only candidate that matters.

[PhiKapMom]

Better stop and think before making a wild accusation about who is the Liberal. Ask yourself -- which candidate is on the same side as Cruz who is as liberal as they come?

The answer to that is the man you are supporting who cannot seem to get a sound of his mouth that would in some way attack Cruz or Davis. Instead the only sound that comes out is his attacks on Arnold.

Getting more obvious by the day that McC and his supporters would rather keep spinning -- "principled" and "conservative" cannot not be used to describe McC ever again! Selling out to Cruz and Indian Gambling Interest is something a "principled conservative" would not do.

You and the rest of the McC fan club can write all you want about Arnold being a liberal, etc., but facts speak for themselves. The credibility of the McC folks along with their hero, McC, with their spin like the Clintonites is zero right now with me! Arnold attacks Davis/Cruz and McC sides with Cruz against Arnold!

Doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out who is the "Real" Republican and who is the "RINO!" All of you folks were wrong about the title "RINO" -- that title doesn't go to Arnold and his supporters who stand up for the Republican Party of CA and want to win this Recall. The title RINO goes to McC who has now teamed up with the RAT Cruz against Arnold, the Republican in the race!

You all should be really proud of yourselves and your candidate! Next time you start attacking the rest of us better check out your candidate's credentials. Being a social conservative doesn't mean that he is the right person for the job. In fact, with what is going on I would have to see in black and white just what kind of a "social" conservative he is now!

[Aquinasfan]

It has become clear that Tom is intent on taking down the party with him this election.

Uh, no. Arnold is. Who was in this race first? Which candidate has the courage to stand by and do nothing as babies are being torn limb from limb in their mothers' wombs? I welcome Arnold to join the baby-killers in the Democrat party.

[Poohbah]

Who was in this race first?

Daryl Issa. So why did Tom come in and spit in Issa's soup?

[PhiKapMom]

This is a simply reality that is either beyond them, or beyond their pay scale to admit.

Believe you have that nailed.

There is no way I could ever have seen Arnold throwing in with Cruz on anything -- he is too upfront for that! I used that for an example of how Arnold supporters would have been totally upset it if had happened.

The lack of McC supporters being upset is bizarre and makes you wonder exactly what agenda is in play here.

[Maelstrom]

You're doing yourself a favor because you cannot persaude a conservative to vote for a liberal.

You go ahead and think you're able to choose betwen Kennedy and Kerry. It's the choice you have in Cruz and Arnold.

[Poohbah]

The lack of McC supporters being upset is bizarre and makes you wonder exactly what agenda is in play here.

Some are Democrat disruptors.

Others have dreams of Bustamante provoking their long-hoped-and-dreamed-of race war, so they can wear camouflage and pretend to be Rambo.

[PhiKapMom]

You cannot even get who was in the race first right! There was already one conservative but McC couldn't stand the thought of Issa or even Simon winning, so he here came!

You all have to quit spinning because we are not buying!

[A CA Guy]

Read through these posts and answer your own question.

[Maelstrom]

"Better stop and think before making a wild accusation about who is the Liberal. Ask yourself -- which candidate is on the same side as Cruz who is as liberal as they come?"

Depending on the issue, Cruz and Arnold agree about far more consequential policies than Cruz and McClintock.

Them's the facts.

I'll tell you what a principled conservative would not do...he wouldn't give money to Kennedy's campaign. He wouldn't appoint Buffet as an economic advisor, nor Robert Kennedy, Jr. for ecological concerns.

Yes...there is one liberal Republican in the race. Which has been the conservatives' point all along.

So why again are we supposed to vote for him?

[DoughtyOne]

To: DoughtyOne

It has become clear that Tom is intent on taking down the party with him this election.

Uh, no. Arnold is. Who was in this race first? Which candidate has the courage to stand by and do nothing as babies are being torn limb from limb in their mothers'
wombs? I welcome Arnold to join the baby-killers in the Democrat party.

105 posted on 09/19/2003 11:21 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
 

That comment was made with the realization that Tom cannot win and Cruz Bustamante cannot be allowed to.

You and I value Tom's platform equally.  That still doesn't change the fact that Tom pulls between 8-18% and Arnold pulls 22%-45%.  I am not defending Arnold on all counts, but you must realize he is better than Bustamante.  He simply is.  Is he flawed?  Yes!  He is flawed.  Where Arnold bothers me on five to ten issues, Bustamante bothers me on every issue.

The republicans are pulling around 54% of the vote.  Split it and see if you come up with something higher than 30%

Neither you and I want want to see one more abortion.  Arnold does not agree with partial birth abortion, but he can't stop it.  Cruz for sure won't stop it.

Sorry.  This is one we'll probably have to agree to disagree on.

[veronica]

Purging the GOP of self-interested-only Jim Jeffords/McClintock types is a much better idea.

[Sabertooth]

Please show us where Arnold has supported this [amnesty to Illegal Aliens], or admit that you are a despicable piece of filth.

OK...

"Proposition 187 has been resolved by the courts. It is time to move on. More than 2.3 million undocumented immigrants currently live in California. They cannot continue to live underground. I will work with federal officials to address this problem."
Schwarzenegger campaign website - joinarnold.com


Said Proposition 187, the 1994 measure that denied many services to illegal immigrants, was "history" because it has been largely voided by the courts. He supported the proposition at the time voters approved it. "Now we have to move forward with the whole thingand to look at it, what we're going to do with all the people that are undocumented immigrants here in this state. What should we do? Should we have them to stay here, which I think is the right way to do, but how do you then include them in our society, how do you make it official, how do you make it legal?" he said. He added he would try to team up with other states with large immigrant populations and lobby the federal government to address the issue.
Associated Press - August 27th, 2003


Schwarzenegger, who legally immigrated to this country from Austria in 1968, opposed issuing driver's licenses to undocumented immigrants. But he didn't rule out public services or amnesty for those who come into the country illegally.

He said he would work with other states to pressure the federal government, which controls immigration, to "come up with a solution once and for all." He also said allowing undocumented immigrants to stay in the United States is "the right thing to do."
Sacramento Bee - August 28th, 2003


Schwarzenegger criticized Davis for signing a bill granting driver's licenses to undocumented immigrants, saying, "We're leaving ourselves wide open to terrorism." And he repeated his support for a guest-worker visa program -- "then they can (get) driver's licenses hooked together with insurance."
Sacramento Bee - September 9th, 2003


Schwarzenegger said he opposed the bill because it would "bring danger to our state" because it doesn't require background checks of illegal immigrants.

He did, however, say he supported proposed federal legislation that would help those in the United States illegally become legal residents more quickly.
Sacramento Bee - September 17th, 2003

That's five times since August that Schwarzenegger has spoken in favor of legalizing Illegal Aliens.

Legalizing Illegals = Amnesty for those Illegals.

He's a little out in front of his handlers, though. If you click on the link to the AP story of August 27th, you find that although Schwarzenegger has "indicated support for allowing undocumented immigrants already in the country to remain here, but a spokesman said later he was not specifically proposing an amnesty program."

The operative weasel words are "not specifically proposing." Doesn't matter, he still supports the legalization of Illegal Aliens, and therefore, Amnesty.

Was there anything you wanted to admit, or did you just want to apologize to Area51 for your attempted ad hominem?

[DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet]

Bump for a later read.

[DoughtyOne]

Yes the agenda thing does come to mind doesn't it.

[Maelstrom]

OH...and as for your labelling of McClintock as some sort of "super conservative"...that is the claim of Arnold supporters, not conservatives.

Conservatives vew him as an acceptable compromise everyone should be able to agree upon, not some fire-breathing super-conservative.

Issa, McClintock, Simon...any of them were acceptible. Simon a bit less so than the other two. Conservatives aren't Arnold worshippers. We require reasons to vote for a candidate. "He can win" justifies a support for Clinton if only he were a Republican.

[A CA Guy]

Wow, you have THAT much trouble telling the difference between a militant Democrat Cruz and Arnold?

Why are you self-limited on this issue.