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The Parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector
The Bible - Luke 18 ^ | about 1970 years ago | Jesus Christ

Posted on 08/28/2003 12:24:49 PM PDT by Chancellor Palpatine

The Parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector

9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable: 10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood up and prayed about[1] himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men--robbers, evildoers, adulterers--or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.' 13 "But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.' 14 "I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Alabama; US: Mississippi; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: 10commandments; catholiclist; coralridge; dobson; kennedy; paulandjancrouch; roymoore; tbn
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Please be specific, there is a lot of posts here.
141 posted on 08/29/2003 7:41:11 AM PDT by Protagoras (Putting government in charge of morality is like putting pedophiles in charge of children.)
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To: AppyPappy
If it were true, you would have sourced it when I called you on it.

Meanwhile, in America, when asked on CNN whether principles of religious equality would lead him to support an Islamic monument similar to the two-ton commandments, Moore replied, "This nation was founded upon the laws of God, not upon the Koran." In the Christian press, Moore went even further: "This country wasn't founded upon Allah; it was founded upon the Holy Bible, and the question is whether we [Christians] are going to take a stand."
http://www.tompaine.com/feature2.cfm/ID/8728

Asked on CNN whether he would support an Islamic monument to the Koran in the rotunda of the federal building, Moore replied, "This nation was founded upon the laws of God, not upon the Koran. That's clear in the Declaration [of Independence], so it wouldn't fit history and it wouldn't fit law."
http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/08/22/ten.commandments/index.html

I'm sure your apology will be immediately forthcoming.

142 posted on 08/29/2003 7:42:11 AM PDT by jimt
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To: Protagoras
Start with my initial in the body of the article. Tell me if you agree.
143 posted on 08/29/2003 7:44:39 AM PDT by Chancellor Palpatine ("decades of proudly voting RINO in order to crush the dreams of the little man")
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To: Protagoras
I meant my #1
144 posted on 08/29/2003 7:45:55 AM PDT by Chancellor Palpatine ("decades of proudly voting RINO in order to crush the dreams of the little man")
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To: Servant of the Nine
Ping to post #1
145 posted on 08/29/2003 7:49:45 AM PDT by Chancellor Palpatine ("decades of proudly voting RINO in order to crush the dreams of the little man")
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To: jimt
Here's what YOU said: no other religious statements may be made there, only his.

What you posted says nothing about your statement. You said he would not allow ANY statement. Your source says he would not SUPPORT another monument. Two completely different things.

146 posted on 08/29/2003 7:51:34 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If You're Not A Part Of The Solution, There's Good Money To Be Made In Prolonging The Problem.)
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
I agree with much of it. But the point is, I am opposed to any government involvement in religion. I believe it is beyond the proper role of government in a free society.

Which doesn't mean I am opposed to religious people being in government or even to practicing it. People can pray wherever they want as far as I'm concerned, including government employees. I'm a Christian and proud to say so but I don't believe that people of any faith should use government (which, after all, is just force) to spread their idea of religion.

147 posted on 08/29/2003 7:56:02 AM PDT by Protagoras (Putting government in charge of morality is like putting pedophiles in charge of children.)
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To: AppyPappy
Here's what YOU said: no other religious statements may be made there, only his.

What you posted says nothing about your statement. You said he would not allow ANY statement. Your source says he would not SUPPORT another monument. Two completely different things.

You resort to sophistry when you get caught with your pants down, don't you?

148 posted on 08/29/2003 8:03:18 AM PDT by jimt
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To: jimt
You are the one that used hyperbole to the point of mischaracterization. He said nothing of the sort.
149 posted on 08/29/2003 8:05:51 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If You're Not A Part Of The Solution, There's Good Money To Be Made In Prolonging The Problem.)
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To: AppyPappy
You are the one that used hyperbole to the point of mischaracterization. He said nothing of the sort.

Freedom is Slavery, and Ignorance is Strength. Uh-huh.

150 posted on 08/29/2003 9:20:14 AM PDT by jimt
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To: saradippity
"And while we are about moving offensive things,I think we ought to float the Statue of Liberty right back to France."

Of course! If it offends you, lets get rid of it! The primary right given in the constitution is the right not to be offended! (Unless of course, the offense is caused by things that offend God.)

151 posted on 08/29/2003 9:44:00 AM PDT by MEGoody
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To: jimt
"It's about making sure a government official does not use his position and facilities to promote a religious view."

Then I expect I shall have your full support in having all statues/memorials to Greek and Roman gods/goddesses removed from any governmental facility. As I understand it, there is one right in the same building "Moore's" 10 commandment monument was in. We can start there.

152 posted on 08/29/2003 9:46:08 AM PDT by MEGoody
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To: jimt
"It's not a single display excluding others"

Ah, so it's okay as long as other 'faiths' are presented. I understand there is a statue of the Greek goddess of justice in the very same building that "Moore's" 10 commandment monument stood. Seems to me that criteria has been met.

"They are placed there as art, and are anyway nearly universally considered as myths."

Nevertheless, it is promotion of a religion, which you say is wrong. They must be removed.

153 posted on 08/29/2003 9:49:48 AM PDT by MEGoody
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To: MEGoody
Nevertheless, it is promotion of a religion, which you say is wrong. They must be removed.

There has to be some consideration of intent.

Are there any Supreme Court justices or employees who worship such Greek / Roman "gods" and put the statue there as a religious statement?

Is someone claiming their judicial powers derive from such Greek / Roman "god"?

Is anyone claiming Greek / Roman gods gave us laws that are the "highest law of the land"?

I think not.

154 posted on 08/29/2003 10:44:54 AM PDT by jimt
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To: MEGoody
Right!! After all who was Emma Lazarus to invite people to a party she wasn't hostessing herself?
155 posted on 08/29/2003 11:07:13 AM PDT by saradippity
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To: jimt
"There has to be some consideration of intent."

Really? So we are to presume someone's intent? I don't see how that is possible. Even if they make a claim as to their intent, we can only have faith that they are being truthful.

"Are there any Supreme Court justices or employees who worship such Greek / Roman "gods" and put the statue there as a religious statement?"

I haven't done a poll. So the issue is, if they worship the God which everyone seems to be reminded of when they look at the monument/statue, that is when it becomes wrong? So if Moore was a Buddhist, this monument would be okay?

"Is anyone claiming Greek / Roman gods gave us laws that are the "highest law of the land"?

Many claim that our system of justice came from the Romans and the Greeks, and I know there are statues to both the Roman and Greek god/goddess of justice in a few courthouses around this land. I view that as the same thing.

156 posted on 08/29/2003 11:14:09 AM PDT by MEGoody
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To: MEGoody
So we are to presume someone's intent? I don't see how that is possible. Even if they make a claim as to their intent, we can only have faith that they are being truthful.

I don't believe there's any presumption required. Judge Moore has publicly stated his intent. I will take him at his word until he's proven a liar.

So if Moore was a Buddhist, this monument would be okay?

Moore's religion is immaterial. If he uses his government office and government facilities to favor a particular religion, he's wrong. Buddhist, Zoroastrian, Catholic - it doesn't matter.

Many claim that our system of justice came from the Romans and the Greeks, and I know there are statues to both the Roman and Greek god/goddess of justice in a few courthouses around this land. I view that as the same thing.

I haven't heard folks make that claim (I've heard England), and I haven't heard anyone claim that laws given by their (Roman / Greek) gods were the law of our land.

157 posted on 08/29/2003 12:11:36 PM PDT by jimt
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Since when are Slippery Slopes "dead wrong" ?

When's the last time you took a close look at the country around you?

158 posted on 08/29/2003 1:39:07 PM PDT by trebb
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Now Ima half ta call ya on that whopper, son.Provide one shred of evidence that Roy Moore was trying to create a state religion. Be careful now as I have the complete text of his monument dedication speech.
159 posted on 08/29/2003 2:00:43 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
"He can express his beliefs as much as he wants outside that building and away from his official function.

And that is JUST what he did when he interviewed with CRM.

160 posted on 08/29/2003 2:04:24 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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