XM-8: New U.S. Service Rifle?

Modern Firearms and Ammunition website ^ | unknown | Unknown

[Long Cut]

Caliber: 5.56x45 mm NATO
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: no data
Barrel length: no data
Weight: 2.67 kg empty
Rate of fire: no data
Magazine capacity: 30 rounds (STANAG)

The development of the XM8 Lightweight Assault Rifle was initiated by US Army in the 2002, when contract was issued to the Alliant Techsystems Co of USA to study possibilities of development of kinetic energy part of the XM29 OICW weapon into separate lightweight assault rifle, which could, in the case of success, replace the aging M16A2 rifles and M4A1 carbines in US military service. According to the present plans, the XM8 should enter full production circa 2005, if not earlier, several years before the XM-29 OICW. The XM8 (M8 after its official adoption) should become a standard next generation US forces assault rifle. It will fire all standard 5.56mm NATO ammunition, and, to further decrease the load on the future infantrymen, a new type of 5.56mm ammunition is now being developed. This new ammunition will have composite cases, with brass bases and polymer walls, which will reduce weight of the complete ammunition, while maintaining compatibility with all 5.56mm NATO weapons. Along with 20% weight reduction in the XM8 (compared to the current issue M4A1 carbine), this will be a welcome move for any infantryman, already overloaded by protective, communications and other battle equipment.

The XM8 will be quite similar to the "KE" (kinetic energy) part of the XM-29 OICW system, being different mostly in having a telescoped plastic buttstock of adjustable length, and a detachable carrying handle with the Picatinny rail.

Technical description. The XM8 is a derivative of the Heckler-Koch G36 assault rifle, and thus it is almost similar to that rifle in design and functioning. The key differences are the NATO-standard magazine housing that will accept M16-type magazines, the set of Picatinny rails on the forend, telescoped buttstock of adjustable length and a different scope, mounted on the Picatinny rail, built into the detachable carrying handle.

[dljordan]

That flash suppressor won't do. It'll act as a brush collector.

[Squantos]

Won't pay that price.....need doesn't equal silly IMO. Sad Scams.......too bad some manufacturer won't reintroduce the same product. IT WORKED !

Smith Inc is closest clone of the little gem.

Thanks for the info MileHi !!.........Stay Safe !

[MileHi]

Yea, you'd have to want one pretty bad.

[Cap'n Crunch]

Five and a quarter.... thanks for the head's up, but it's out of my league.... sob... whimper....sniffle...WWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH.

I'm better now.

[archy]

Something in me just cannot love a bullpup. Call me old fashioned, they look like the designer was drunk.

Okay! You're old fashioned!

But you're right in part too- they're a better replacement for the submachinegun or carbine than a real rifle, and the possibilities of the design have never been realized in any model I've yet handled or used. Ambidextrous downward ejectiuon is needed, along with a sighting arrangement that allows use from either the right or left shoulder without adjustment.

To date I've used and carried the French FA-MAS F1 [and the F2 version looks like a real improvement with just a minimum of refinement] and the British L96A1/ SA80- and again, the latest A2 versions by Heckler and Koch seem to be even better upgrades. They're not quite there yet, but they're getting closer.

I'm looking forward to playing with some of the Russian bullpup Kalishnikov designs, particularly the Russian OC-14 *Groza* and the bullpupped SVU version of the venerable SVD sniper's rifle, and to a more extensive wringout of the Israeli TAVOR than the short intro I've so far received.

The South African Vektor CR21 is another I hope I get a chance to work with soon. But I've got something of my own in the works, too. And the magazine doesn't interfere with a good prone position in the least- no more than a Bren gun's does....

-archy-/-

[Travis McGee]

Sorry, but they is all fugly.

[Long Cut]

News flash: Soldier of Fortune this month reports that the 6.8mm cartridge has been approved for use by Spec-Ops types, and is currently used in a rebarreled M-4 carbine mod. Reportedly, the round is VERY popular with the snakeaters, as those shot with it tend to stay that way.

The article was the first of a two-part series on the round, and mentioned that the bullet itself was based on the .270 Winchester, while the case was derived from the Remington .30. no data on powder or primers, sorry, that was classified still.

All in all, a positive development, as such "special-purpose" rounds have a way of becoming standard issue after a while. Must be why the XM-8, at last word, is designed to be easily convertible to this 6.8mm. We might begin this century with an all-new rifle AND cartridge in place, only a few years late.

[archy]

News flash: Soldier of Fortune this month reports that the 6.8mm cartridge has been approved for use by Spec-Ops types, and is currently used in a rebarreled M-4 carbine mod. Reportedly, the round is VERY popular with the snakeaters, as those shot with it tend to stay that way. The article was the first of a two-part series on the round, and mentioned that the bullet itself was based on the .270 Winchester, while the case was derived from the Remington .30. no data on powder or primers, sorry, that was classified still.

The bullet is a .276. See the circa-1950 British EM-2, or the American post-WWI .276 Pedersen, from circa 1925, the same period that gave us the M1911A1 modifications to Browning's M1911 pistol and the 1927 boattailed 172-grain national match bullet loading for the .30-06 cartridge. Thank you, General Hatcher....

All in all, a positive development, as such "special-purpose" rounds have a way of becoming standard issue after a while. Must be why the XM-8, at last word, is designed to be easily convertible to this 6.8mm. We might begin this century with an all-new rifle AND cartridge in place, only a few years late.

Like the 7x57mm bolt-action Mauser we COULD have adopted folowing the Spanish-American War, so successful that it remained in Spanish service until the 1970s, and still labours on in some backwater policia and Guardia Civil weapons racks. And then we might not have bothered with the M1 Garand....

We might begin this century with an all-new rifle and the cartridge we could have adopted in 1903, or at least a shortened version thereof...or in 1930...or 1950.

[Long Cut]

The more things change...

I read once (actually, in many books and articles) that the US Army's cartridge and weapon choices this century has always been heavily influenced, perhaps too much so, by long-range competetive marksmen rather than by actual grunts. Considering the .30-06/.308 dynasty, this seems plausible enough.

I've always agreed with you that we should have commenced development of an intermediate-sized cartridge and rifle following WWII (perhaps even preceeding it). I recall reading that an Army colonel, Renee R. Studler (what a name!) was the man who stood directly in the path of such efforts, to the point of forcing NATO to accept the .308 cartridge AND the Army to reneg on its promise to adopt the FN-FAL rifle. You probably know more than I about that story.

From what little I can glean at this time, it seems that the 6.8mm was designed by the grunts who'll actually USE it, and not in some lab or by some advanced hobbyist on a controlled, clean, and safe range. Better late, then, than never.

Wasn't it Churchill who once said words to the effect that, "Sooner or later, the Americans do the right thing.".

[Squantos]

6.8MM SPC is a mirror ballistic wise to the .270 JDJ which has been around for decades. Glad someone pulled their heads out of the ass and asked the wildcat reloaders and hunters what works !

I have a thompson contender barrel from SSK in that caliber and it works very well. My Order will be in ASAP for an upper for my AR lower.......:o)

Stay Safe LC !

[Long Cut]

Well, we can hope that those who still believe that an infantryman should be able to engage targets at 500-1000 yards with his rifle (artillery and air support do that, along with the .50s) will not be given as much influence as they have in the past.

I like accurate rifles; I just think that having one capable of 1000 yard accuracy is a little much for the average troop. Not every driver needs a 'Vette, either.

[Long Cut]

"Glad someone pulled their heads out of the ass and asked the wildcat reloaders and hunters what works !"

Actually, it was the SF operators who, on their own time, began developing the 6.8mm SPC round. Some on the team even spent their own money on the project. I'm sure they talked to some reloaders and hunters, though. They only approached Remington and Winchester when they were already quite far along the way.

"Stay Safe LC !"

I sure will! I'm finally back from deployment, and our whole squadron made it back safe and sound, no casualties OR dead airplanes. That's after six months in five different sites all over the globe, in addition to ENDURING FREEDOM.

[Squantos]

Actually, it was the SF operators who, on their own time, began developing the 6.8mm SPC round

I'm gonna respectfully disagree with that....Glad ya got back OK ! Thanks for taking your turn in the barrel. If only more patriots were.

STAY SAFE !

[archy]

I've always agreed with you that we should have commenced development of an intermediate-sized cartridge and rifle following WWII (perhaps even preceeding it). I recall reading that an Army colonel, Renee R. Studler (what a name!) was the man who stood directly in the path of such efforts, to the point of forcing NATO to accept the .308 cartridge AND the Army to reneg on its promise to adopt the FN-FAL rifle. You probably know more than I about that story.

OH! yes...He was also one of those who tried his hardest to kill Armalite/Stoner's AR-15, as well. See Blake Stevens and Ed Ezell's The Black Rifle: M16 Retrospective for more on Studler and the M16 fight.

[archy]

Actually, it was the SF operators who, on their own time, began developing the 6.8mm SPC round.

I'm gonna respectfully disagree with that....Glad ya got back OK ! Thanks for taking your turn in the barrel. If only more patriots were. Well, partway true. The snakeater community has always tinkered and kludged around trying to get more effective performance from their tools, to include small arms and ammo. That's certainly included the .280 EM-2 I mean 6.8mm cartridge developments but is hardly limited to *just* that particularl cartridge, nor can it be said to be *just* their baby.

And, as with the choice of field cutlery and assorted stabbers, there's a lot of difference in individual preference involved, including among SF, about all sorts of things. including the 6.8 caliber possibility. But most all agree that the M16A2/M855 5,56mm ball ammo combination could offer a little more terminal effect...and that the M4/M855 needs to deliver a LOT more....

[xm177e2]

This looks like the rifle which will bridge the gap between the OICW and the M16 series

The OICW is not designed to replace the M16 (it's much, much too heavy and expensive with the grenade launcher); a couple of guys in a team would be given OICWs and the rest would use M16s or XM8s. The XM8 is very similar to the bottom half of the OICW (both are based on HK's G36 assault rifle).

[archy]

I have a thompson contender barrel from SSK in that caliber and it works very well. My Order will be in ASAP for an upper for my AR lower.......:o)

Is your AR upper going to be in .270 JDJ, or 6,8? How much barrel/ configuration? And what weight bullet and rifling twist are you looking at? Inquiring minds are downright fascinated; I've got a similar 276/140 grain wildcat project of my own going on....

[archy]

Well, we can hope that those who still believe that an infantryman should be able to engage targets at 500-1000 yards with his rifle (artillery and air support do that, along with the .50s) will not be given as much influence as they have in the past.

Maybe, though if the CAS and now-downsizing artillery aren't around, I do want them to have an answer for hostile fire from an SVD or PK. Or one of our own XM107s, M24s or M25s being used against us.

I like accurate rifles; I just think that having one capable of 1000 yard accuracy is a little much for the average troop. Not every driver needs a 'Vette, either.

Average troop, yes, top troop per platoon is something else, or top six per company is something else again. Every driver likely doesn't need either a 'Vette or a Bradley, but a well-qualified driver should be able to turn in a good performance in either.

[wtc911]

"Very Pretty Colonel, but can they fight?"

[wtc911]

Martin Russ' BREAKOUT, the story of the Inchon "retreat' specifically references the complaint about the M1 carbine's lack of stopping power in that particular environment.