Posted on 06/14/2002 10:22:22 AM PDT by SunStar
Let's all re-read the Congressional Joint Resolution of September 14, 2001.
I'm sick and tired of all the supposed conservative Constitutional "defenders" (and plenty of Leftists as well) who continue to argue that President Bush is not entitled to War Powers, that he is acting in an inappropriate matter, that he is making "arbitrary" rules and regulations up as he goes, and that our Constitution is in jeopardy because Congress did not "Declare War".
Case in point: This was posted by a Freeper yesterday:
Yes War powers are in effect - without a war vote. Constitutional power is NO LONGER in effect. There'll be a lot more crying in the future, perhaps even you and your fellow Bill of Rights shredders. Too late by then tho. Enjoy it - while you can.
This is an example of a supposed conservative, who thinks President Bush is a dictator! Excuse me, but I think we are at war! Congress did in fact declare war. One can attempt to make a semantic argument over the title of the resolution, but the resolution itself says it all. I suggest that everyone keep a copy of this document handy, since the bogus "Congress did not declare war" argument is being used by the Left on a daily basis. The argument is faulty, and those who use it should be called on it. Congress did fact authorized President Bush to do exactly what he is doing -- make war on the enemy, and work to stop future attacks.
-SunStar
September 14, 2001
This is the text of the joint resolution authorizing the use of force against terrorists, adopted by the Senate and the House of Representatives:
To authorize the use of United States armed forces against those responsible for the recent attacks launched against the United States.
Whereas, on Sept. 11, 2001, acts of despicable violence were committed against the United States and its citizens; and
Whereas, such acts render it both necessary and appropriate that the United States exercise its rights to self-defense and to protect United States citizens both at home and abroad, and
Whereas, in light of the threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States posed by these grave acts of violence, and
Whereas, such acts continue to pose an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States,
Whereas the president has authority under the Constitution to take action to deter and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States.
Resolved by the Senate and the House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,
Section 1. Short Title
This joint resolution may be cited as the "Authorization for Use of Military Force"
Section 2. Authorization for Use of United States Armed Forces
(a) That the president is authorized to use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on Sept. 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons, in order to prevent any future acts of international terrorism against the United States by such nations, organizations or persons.
(b) War Powers Resolution Requirements
Specific Statutory Authorization -- Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(b) of the War Powers Resolution.
Applicability of Other Requirements -- Nothing in this resolution supersedes any requirement of the War Powers Resolution.
From "The War Powers Act of 1973"
http://www.cs.indiana.edu/statecraft/warpow.html
The government whose "illegal" behavior with respect to recent terrorists attacks you so readily support is the same government who can't understand the clear prohibitions of the Second Amendment.
If and when the attacks you describe occur in my neighborhood, I am less able to protect my community because I have had to move my "ugly" rifles to Nevada from Kalifornia. This is because the Congress and the state of Kalifornia do not feel bound by the Constitution. There are dark days ahead and they are not just due to terrorists, but to people who don't believe in the supremacy of our Constitution.
Maybe it was because they had a specific country on which to declare war -- which is, BTW, a long-standing diplomatic nicety which does not readily apply to this particular case.
A nicely wrapped target with internationally-recignized borders is not available to us in this war; instead, we're fighting a widespread group of nutjobs who have already attacked us.
Ok, so why do you think the administration asked Congress not to declare war?
Technically speaking, Congress has not OFFICIALLY "declared war" since WWII. Korea, Vietnam, Persian Gulf, and the Terrorism campaign are all undeclared wars. The Civil War was an undeclared war, too. Here's what a resolution for a declared war looks like:
December 8, 1941
JOINT RESOLUTION Declaring that a state of war exists between the Imperial Government of Japan and the Government and the people of the United States and making provisions to prosecute the same.
Whereas the Imperial Government of Japan has committed unprovoked acts of war against the Government and the people of the United States of America: Therefore be it Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the state of war between the United States and the Imperial Government of Japan which has thus been thrust upon the United States is hereby formally declared; and the President is hereby authorized and directed to employ the entire naval and military forces of the United States and the resources of the Government to carry on war against the Imperial Government of Japan; and, to bring the conflict to a successful termination, all of the resources of the country are hereby pledged by the Congress of the United States.
Approved, U.S. House of Represenatives, 388-1
Approved, U.S. Senate, 82-0
Hereby authorized by President Franklin D. Roosevelt, December 8, 1941, 4:10 p.m. E.S.T.
The ONLY times in U.S. history that war has been officially "declared" are the following:
November 4, 1812: Joint Resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Kingdom of Great Britain since November 2, 1812.
May 11, 1846: Joint Resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Republic of Mexico since April 24, 1846.
April 25, 1898: Joint resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Republic of Spain since April 21, 1898
April 2, 1917: Joint resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Republic of Germany since April 2, 1917
December 8, 1941: Joint resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Empire of Japan since December 7, 1941
December 11, 1941: Joint resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Government of Germany since December 8, 1941
December 11, 1941: Joint resolution declaring a state of war has existed between the United States and the Government of Italy since December 8, 1941
Each of those were passed following a joint session of congress where the President asked them to declare war. I fully support President Bush's War on Terrorism, but if he wants to go by the books, he must ask congress to declare a state of war has existed between the U.S. and Iran, Iraq, and North Korea since September 11th.
In case you and the other tinfoil hatters don’t “get it,” a piece of paper is no protection in a war. It stops neither bombs nor bullets. A war is fought with men and war machines … that is the ultimate defense of the Republic and its Constitution, not some nutter picking nits about the title of a joint resolution of Congress.
As a practical matter, my consent to be governed by the Constitution and to protect YOU with it is essential to any success you should expect from our government. I withdraw my consent to be governed by a Congress which ignores its sworn duty. You should be very concerned that I have withdrawn my consent.
The last place I would look for my personal protection is you waving your copy of the Constitution. As to my concern about your withdrawal of consent; well as Rhett Butler said to Scarlet O’Hara in “Gone With the Wind:” “Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a damn.”
No. By failing to do their duty, the allowed Clinton to bomb aspirin factories instead of defending this nation. This "war" did not begin on September 11. Our enemies have been working very hard at provoking us into war, knowing that we are very powerful and would probably abuse that power during a declared war.
We should have declared war against any nation enabling those who have attacked us.
1941 US Congress
Declaration of War on Japan
JOINT RESOLUTION
Declaring that a state of war exists between the Imperial Government of Japan and the Government and the people of the United States and making provisions to prosecute the same.
Whereas the Imperial Government of Japan has committed unprovoked acts of war against the Government and the people of the United States of America: Therefore be itResolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the state of war between the United States and the Imperial Government of Japan which has thus been thrust upon the United States is hereby formally declared; and the President is hereby authorized and directed to employ the entire naval and military forces of the United States and the resources of the Government to carry on was against the Imperial Government of Japan; and, to bring the conflict to a successful termination, all of the resources of the country are hereby pledged by the Congress of the United States.
Approved, December 8, 1941, 4:10 p.m. E.S.T.
Declare war on them. Who says they need a physical country?
This resolution authorizes the President to use the Armed Forces to go after the bad guys. Who says it has to say "Declaration of War?"
On what basis would he make such a declaration?
And if it comes to going after, say, Iraq, who says he won't ask Congress when the time comes? The wording of this resolution is pretty specific, in that it's all tied to the 9/11 attacks.
Unless Saddam, et al. are found holding a smoking gun, I believe Bush would have to ask Congress to authorize an attack on anybody else.
Sometimes it seems as if the administration is purposely playing with one hand tied behind its back, substituting Big Government symbolism for meaningful actions with real teeth.
What our enemies are really hoping for is that we continue to be vague about our goals. They hope to convince their part of the world that our war is against Islam.
The refusal of the Taliban government to hand over OBL for criminal prosecution is an act of war. We should declare war against Afghanistan because of that refusal. Other nations can take comfort in the fact that we are not at war with them. They can also take notice that a declaration of war against them would have drastic consequences. If they harbor criminals or give aid to our declared enemies, then they risk those consequences.
The willingness of our enemies to give up their lives is vastly overstated. Thousands of prisoners were taken in Afghanistan.
Nineteen men with box-cutters caused the damage on September 11. They were significantly aided by those who would disarm the American people. If we decide to weaken ourselves, then the small minority who are willing to give up their lives will have greater impact. We must have the courage to be free.
First of all, it is VERY GENERAL. The president has been given the power to wage war against ANYONE HE decides was involved in 9/11. My question to you is how would you react if AlGore was the president? If GWB hasn't decided that that the war is over and another president takes office, does the war continue? Suppose the president decides that a domestic group, say the Militia of Montana or even the NRA was involved, can he use the military against them?
If a new Congress decides the 'War' is over, does the president have to withdraw our troops? From where? Who decides?
If you fail to see the inherent danger in this, us conservatives are in deep do-do.
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