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Putin Has Tainted Russian Greatness
New York Times ^ | June 20, 2024, 5:02 a.m. ET | SERGE SCHMEMANN

Posted on 06/20/2024 6:56:33 AM PDT by Cronos

Many years ago, in the 1980s, I went to Brighton Beach, then in its heyday as a district of newly arrived Soviet Jews. It was a grand event, rich in humor and tinged with nostalgia. I asked a middle-aged partygoer for his thoughts on his lost homeland, and his reply has stayed with me: “I hate Russia, for forcing me to leave her.”

It was an apt summary of what waves of émigrés from Russia and the Soviet Union since the early 20th century have felt: a sorrowful sense of loss for a motherland — what Russians call “toska po rodine” — coupled with resentment at the autocratic powers that forced them out. My grandparents were among the “White” Russians who fled the Revolution and moved to Paris in the 1920s. A second wave of emigrants left in World War II. The third, Soviet Jews, started leaving in the 1970s. Vladimir Putin has now created another wave of people fleeing Russia, and many of them may still believe, as my forebears did, that they will one day return to the homeland.

Most probably will not.

It’s hard to say precisely where Russian exiles stand, politically or in their sense of attachment to Russia. The waves of emigrants differ widely one from another, and in the United States, they have not behaved like immigrants from Italy, China or Poland who formed hyphenated-American communities and organizations that have persisted over generations. Russians immigrants to America have, by comparison, melded quickly into the general population.

...That is the tragic irony of Mr. Putin’s war. His attempt to “restore Russian greatness” through violence and hatred has tainted Russia’s real greatness for years to come, just as his attempt to quash Ukrainian nationhood has steeled its foundations.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Russia
KEYWORDS: newyorkslimes; nohehasnt; sergeschmemann; theslimes; zeeperporn
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To: JonPreston

Are you able to access US sites behind your firewall in St. Petarsburg?


21 posted on 06/20/2024 7:41:08 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: Cronos

“The Muscowite invasion was unprovoked as you correctly point out.”

...but you’re still SLIPPING by not pointing that out at the start and you can already see the results of that screw-up on THIS THREAD.


22 posted on 06/20/2024 7:43:01 AM PDT by BobL
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To: Cronos

“UKR and RUS overlap by around 60% to 80% mutual comprehension”

My limited understanding is they are about as close as Italian and Spanish.

I’m trying to learn Russian, but I am not having much success.


23 posted on 06/20/2024 7:43:44 AM PDT by Brian Griffin
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To: Cronos

Communists tainted Russian Greatness.


24 posted on 06/20/2024 7:45:44 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not about where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind and Attitude.)
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To: wildcard_redneck
wildcard "the front keeps moving west"

Really?

The front actually moved east

Or perhaps you want to stick to 2024, as you may have short term memory, right?

There are movements around Avdiivka and Bakhmut, but those are barely movements even compared to WWI

25 posted on 06/20/2024 7:47:18 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: JonPreston
When I want fair, objective reporting I always read the NY Times.

I have to laugh at some of the sources zeepers embrace. The NYT, the WaPo, British tabloids, Wiki…

If they believe everything they read, they just might be Democrats.

26 posted on 06/20/2024 7:47:49 AM PDT by Allegra (Toss a zeeper in the Dnieper)
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To: Cronos
No one on tFR takes the NY Times seriously

When you get tired of calling people Russians and actually look at the collapsing state of NATO and the EU, your mental fog should begin to lift.

27 posted on 06/20/2024 7:48:04 AM PDT by JonPreston ( ✌ ☮️ )
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To: Brian Griffin
My limited understanding is they are about as close as Italian and Spanish.

Actually closer - the "Russian" language is the East Slavic dialect from Muscowy v/s "Ukrainian" being the East Slavic dialect from the Hetmanate

They only split around 1300 AD. That's in contrast to Italian (Turin dialect) v/s Spanish (Castilian) that separated 700 AD

28 posted on 06/20/2024 7:49:40 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: BobL

post #1 is from the article itself.

But you, Bobl, pointed out that this was an unprovoked Muscowite invasion of Ukraine — you are correct on that.


29 posted on 06/20/2024 7:50:32 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: BobL
you can already see the results of that screw-up

Yes, Putin did screw-up and gave in to hubris by invading and killing white Eastern Orthodox Christians.

30 posted on 06/20/2024 7:51:10 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: JonPreston
Are you able to access US sites behind your firewall in St. Petarsburg?
31 posted on 06/20/2024 7:51:45 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: Cronos

“The rest of your post is also heavily false”

Except for the last sentence, which oversimplifies excessively (read the WIKI article linked to in my following post for a better description), I believe my post is correct.

Please post quote any sentence from my post followed by what you believe to be correct and I will investigate further.


32 posted on 06/20/2024 7:52:07 AM PDT by Brian Griffin
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33 posted on 06/20/2024 7:54:56 AM PDT by Who is John Galt? ("...mit Pulver und Blei, Die Gedanken sind frei!")
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To: Allegra
they just might be Democrats

Their worldview aligns perfectly with Democrats, but it's my theory that most have no real allegiance to a Party. They subscribe to a global view complete with hierarchy of international institutions that supersedes sovereign nations and the will of citizens. We're in for quite a fight.

34 posted on 06/20/2024 7:55:17 AM PDT by JonPreston ( ✌ ☮️ )
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To: Cronos

I live in America while you live in Poland.


35 posted on 06/20/2024 7:56:05 AM PDT by JonPreston ( ✌ ☮️ )
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To: JonPreston

Yes, definitely globalists, more aligned with Klaus Schwab and the WEF-type evil.


36 posted on 06/20/2024 7:58:23 AM PDT by Allegra (Toss a zeeper in the Dnieper)
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To: Cronos

“those are barely movements even compared to WWI”

A Russian offense tends to obliterate everything in its path.

All the Russians typically have to show for an offensive is rubble, dead bodies and burnt-out tanks.

Russia now prefers to simply blast away Ukrainian front lines by the kilometer.


37 posted on 06/20/2024 8:03:36 AM PDT by Brian Griffin
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To: Cronos

Russia’s position: The current sanctions against Russia are illegal under international law (not passed by the UN Security Council). Russia will be paid reparations for the implementation of those illegal sanctions. Putin will get what he wants through a peace agreement or through a war. He has stated his requirements and will continue to take the land that Russia claims until an agreeable peace agreement is signed that gives him the land he claims. Putin looks upon this as the only way to ensure Russian survival.

The only way Putin stops by being defeated on the battlefield and removed from those areas by force.


38 posted on 06/20/2024 8:04:39 AM PDT by SaxxonWoods (Are you ready for Black Lives MAGA? It's coming.)
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To: Brian Griffin
Sure, let me point out the errors in your post: 1. "There are about 25 million Russians living outside of the Russian Federation in what were former parts of the Soviet Union." Not really - it is 25 million "ethnic Russians" in total. in the lands that were the former USSR that is 16 million "Today the largest ethnic Russian diasporas outside of Russia exist in former Soviet states such as Ukraine (about 9 million), Kazakhstan (3,644,529 or 20.61% in 2016),[58] Belarus (about 1.5 million), Uzbekistan (about 650,000)[59] Kyrgyzstan (about 600,000)[60] and Latvia (471,276 or 34.7% in 2020).[17]

The USSR collapsed 30+ years ago and many have assimilated into the lands they are in - many in Ukraine

2 These ethnic Russians often hold down prime jobs. - not in any significant way this century - it was heavy in the 1990s, but has decreased steadily


39 posted on 06/20/2024 8:05:09 AM PDT by Cronos (I identify as an ambulance, my pronounces are wee/woo)
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To: Cronos

When Putin was elected in Russia, how many times?, he reversed the trend where the West was buying up Russia like they succeeded in doing in Ukraine. Ukraine has sold it’s economically viable resources to Arm itself and enrich the globalists.

Let’s try this article on Obama or Biden with the same talking points.

Clinton, Bill in Bosina/Serbia....

Clinton, Hillary killed Kaddafi in Lybia....

Iraq, Afghanistan and dozen interventions by the US yet Russia is the boogie man, and the US is being the Great Satan under Obama/Biden.


40 posted on 06/20/2024 8:12:36 AM PDT by Jumper
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