Posted on 04/23/2022 7:51:04 AM PDT by marcusmaximus
Putin has launched a major salvage operation to the wreck of the downed Black Sea Fleet flagship to secure military secrets including coding devices, unexploded missiles, and possibly even attempt to bring the bodies of dead sailors back home, naval experts have claimed.
An eight-ship salvage flotilla including Kommuna, the world's oldest active warship, and submarine has been sent to the site of the sunken Moskva 80 miles off the coast of Odessa from Sevastopol, the large naval base in Russia-annexed Crimea, according to a report by Forbes.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
The Ukrainians should sink this old ship. It necessarily has to come into range.
I don’t need to, as I believe almost nothing I read from either side.
***You’re so full of bullshiite. You only criticize one side.
Both leaders and countries suck.
***One country invaded the other. The other country adhered to the agreement signed by them, the invading country, and the USA. Pretty simple 40,000 feet stuff. If we don’t get nuclear nonproliferation right, the world is doomed.
I support neither.
***You are a liar.
I support ending this ASAP.
***Then support giving the Ukes back their nukes. If they had never given up their nukes in adherence to that agreement, they never woulda been invaded twice, none of those other countries woulda sold arms for invading Ukraine.
Sending more weapons will only result in extending the war.
***It will keep this war CONVENTIONAL rather than pushing the Ukes into a suitcase nuclear engagement. Bein’ on the side of not sending more weapons is taking a side, contrary to what you just said.
More deaths, and greater economic fallout that effects the world.
***If it’s okay for a country with nukes and big military to bully its neighbors just to take their oil & gas reserves then we should just invade mehico straightway, using your reasoning.
Flotilla reports back to Putin there gone.
I criticize one side, because all of the articles are one sided. What are you babbling about non proliferation? Who’s creating and spreading nuclear weapons? I’m a liar? I’m impressed that you can read minds. The nukes were never the Ukraine’s, they were just stationed there.
Are you concerned about the African conflicts currently happening? Should we go to war there as well?
How about the border conflicts in South America?
China and their treatment of Uighurs?
Is there anywhere you don’t want to go to war?
What branch did you serve in?
Constellis, formerly BlackWater, is hiring mercenaries.
Why don’t you sign up?
Far from clear. It could be the opposite.
Very difficult to know, at this point.
OK, Wise Guy, Look at this:
Russia’s 110-Year-Old Salvage Ship Deploying To Moskva Wreck
This article, from "The Drive" subsection "The Warzone", by Emma Helfrich, is a much better article that opens with unsensationalized Facts and Background on what is actually the subject: the operation to recover the Moskva and contents, if possible.
After an excellent orientation, the author then speculates on some of the disagreement about the cause of Moskva's loss, and the numbers and explanations, but She SPECIFIES that some facts are disputed and that her speculations are Her view as a reporter.
I admit that’s possible, but I would think very unlikely.
It doesn’t really matter what I think, as we’re going to find out.
No way for us to authenticate it.
Most likely, it is well done propaganda.
I criticize one side, because all of the articles are one sided.
***Horse manure. Go ahead and post your favorite TASS articles.
What are you babbling about non proliferation?
***The Budapest Accession to the United Nations Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty that the presidents of USA, Russia, and Ukraine signed. The Ukes HONORED it; the Rukes VIOLATED it twice by invading; and the USA is listening to wanker wussie appeasers who want to ABROGATE it.
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/4044080/posts
Who’s creating and spreading nuclear weapons?
***Every country on the planet which has the capability and now no longer trusts the USA to its commitment towards nuke nonproliferation, due to your ilk.
I’m a liar?
***Yes.
I’m impressed that you can read minds.
***I simply read your own post on one thread and pointed out that it contradicts with your own position. Plus, your previous posts on this subject are very putinista.
The nukes were never the Ukraine’s, they were just stationed there.
***See? That’s a very Putinist position to take. The weapons grade nuke material was abandoned by the soviets. Hence the need for the denuking agreement.
Are you concerned about the African conflicts currently happening?
***Red herring. Did those African nations sign a nuclear nonproliferation agreement assuring borders in exchange for giving up nukes? Nope. Call me when that happens.
Should we go to war there as well?
***If they’re killing Americans, yes. My emBASEee strategee. from my home page
I have been advocating for several years a policy I call ‘embaseees’. Embassy + AirBase —> EmBASEeees. We go into a terrorist country, clear out their taliban equivalent, then withdraw to very large Embassies, perhaps 3 of them. Have them big enough to encompass a military airbase where we can use it for decades on end to conduct anti-terrorism operations. As long as the ‘host’ country aint killing Americans then we let them have self-sovereignty. Kind of like how we operated in the Phillipines for decades. We could even have an intermediate zone that we patrol but it would be autonomous. Let them have their taste of freedom. A referendum every 10 years to see how large the boundaries of the intermediate autonomous zone should be.
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/4043681/posts
___________________________________________________________________
How about the border conflicts in South America?
***EmBASEee strategee.
China and their treatment of Uighurs?
***If we can, and if they’re killing Americans and it’s America Firsty, then yes. emBASEee strategee.
Is there anywhere you don’t want to go to war?
***Wherever they’re not killing Americans. But wait, this whole thing was just a gigantic red herring argument, typical of... you guessed it, Putinistas. Like yourself.
What branch did you serve in?
***Red herring. What branch were you section 8’d out of?
Constellis, formerly BlackWater, is hiring mercenaries.
***Cool. I hope they secure democracy wherever they see red herrings such as yours.
Why don’t you sign up?
***I will go. Just set up a gofundme account so I can spend YOUR money, I can’t afford it. I’ll join the Nuke suitcase nuke program and post regular updates about how your money is spent. Where can YOU go to sign up to be a pantywaist appeaser, hmmmm?
Lol. “Racing” after a week. Ridiculous. Bite the hook suckers.
Budapest Memorandum is not legally binding.
Your views on this war are as important as your views on fusion. You just run your mouth recklessly.
It doesn't look like it has much in the way of anti-missile defenses.
It looks like a fat target to me. But, the Ukrainians may think it better not to strike it immediately. The Ukrainians are winning the propaganda war.
The ship ties up Russian resources...
There is no reliable source of info. So what? The DM is still FOS.
Reasonably good start. I withdraw my accusation that you guys could do it. Now we just need 20 or 30 more articles like it.
From the article:
“For background, Moskva was severely damaged in mid-April after being struck by Ukrainian Neptune shore-based anti-ship cruise missiles while sailing the Black Sea. “
That goes directly against the Russian cheeky claim that it was their own incompetence which sunk the ship.
Budapest Memorandum is not legally binding.
***Standard Putinista response. It is an accession to a ratified United Nations TREATY. All 3 presidents of each respective nation SIGNED it.
Your views on this war are as important as your views on fusion.
***Yet Another Red Herring from the PUtinista crowd. You guys never stop.
You just run your mouth recklessly.
***I suppose you think your endless use of classic fallacies is a proper example of sound reasoning. You’re just a Putinista troll.
It looks like a fat target to me.
***Those old ships were heavy, steel hulls. Antiship missiles might be far less effective, plus it’s not carrying ammunition to blow up.
POTUS isn’t an Emperor, his signing means nothing.
You just name call like most Neocon trash.
Don’t bother posting to me again, after the last word if you like.
How’s your hero Andrea Rossi doing?
Correct, target rich environment.
Oryx was reporting on other conflagrations before this one.
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/
Also ISW
https://www.understandingwar.org/
POTUS isn’t an Emperor, his signing means nothing.
***Asked & Answered. Again. You’re a dog that keeps returning to his vomit argument, again and again.
https://freerepublic.com/focus/chat/4057032/posts?page=66#66
You just name call like most Neocon trash.
***I’m paleocon, not neocon. You engage in name calling yourself, pretending to be above it all. I stopped caring about name calling when I noticed Jesus confronted false teachers of His day, calling them ‘vipers’, ‘unmarked tombs’, and ‘sons of satan’. You criticize me for name calling, do you criticize HIM?
Don’t bother posting to me again, after the last word if you like.
***You’re just a troll. I have started treating you like a troll.
How’s your hero Andrea Rossi doing?
***Who? I haven’t posted an article from him for more than a decade. How far back do you go for trolling?
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