US markets plunge after arrest of Chinese tech executive

The Hill ^ | 12/6/2018 | alexander bolton

[bitt]

The Dow Jones Industrial Average plunged by almost 500 points Thursday morning, the first day of trading after U.S. authorities secured the arrest of a Chinese technology company executive, fueling fears that the trade war with China is heating up.

News broke late Wednesday that Canadian law enforcement had arrested Meng Wanzhou, chief financial officer of Huawei Technologies, a major Chinese tech firm that has been linked to the Chinese military.

U.S. officials have requested her extradition, citing a suspected sanctions violation.

[cuban leaf]

This one never gets old. And what I eventually realized is that WE are the child in the video all grown up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlN28DoL5qA

This explains why we are doomed, and it’s beyond a human solution. We are in this fall all the way to the rocks below.

Check out the numbers at the end and remember they are MUCH worse now. Just wait until our debt service alone is greater than the GDP.

[teevolt]

I think when it’s all said and done with this current monetary/fiscal track we’re on, the inflection point will go back to ‘87 with Greenspan’s rescue of black Monday. The system just expects it now, free lunch mentality, but central banks are slowly getting boxed in after 30 years of it. Back then interest rates were around 10%, and total debt (fed, state, personal) to GDP was reasonable, plenty of room to financial engineer some credit expansion, different now.

[CincyRichieRich]

Oh please, let’s not be this stupid. One Chinese executive is assigned the market cratering...not any other MSM or Soros or Steyer or anti-Trump sell off? No, no, not that.

Tired of the lies.

[poinq]

This is very big. China is going to respond to this. This women and lots of chinese money is going to leave the US. And maybe it should. But lots of Chinese are going to be worried their money here will be confiscated. Last night, after this story, but while China was open and we weren’t, the S&P futures lost 35 points when nobody was trading. The CME (our overnight futures exchange) had to stop trading several times. 35 S&P points is like the Dow crashing 350 points. This morning we crashed another 300 Dow and 30 S&P.

So keep watching. This means war. China millionaires may choose somewhere other than the US and Canada. Which could be ok. But it will also move the markets a lot. And China could start to arrest our business guys over there. That could dissuade them from doing business in China. Trust me this is big.

[Buckeye McFrog]

I still see us as completely collapsing within the next one to three years. Maybe more, but not much more.

I take the opposite view. I think the entire world views collapse as such a horrible prospect that they'd be willing to support ANY lie, for as long as they have to, in order to stave it off.

[cuban leaf]

The house I lived in in seattle, just before the crash ten years ago, was worth $540k. The crash brought it down to $310k.

It is currently worth $1.4 million.

This is gonna leave a mark.

[cuban leaf]

I think the entire world views collapse as such a horrible prospect that they’d be willing to support ANY lie, for as long as they have to, in order to stave it off.

---

I completely agree with that statement. Where we disagree is the timing. I have believed that is exactly what HAS BEEN going on for over a decade. My point is that eventually nobody will be able to do anything about it.

I compare it to the family that lives high on dads income and lots of credit card debt. One day dad loses his job. The family continues to live as they did simply by collecting more and more credit card debt until all the cards are maxed out. Not today, not next week, maybe not even next year - but eventually the sheriff is going to put them on the curb and they can’t do a thing about it.

The western economy is very close to that point. And the sheriff is not controlled by any human being. He comes whether anybody wants him to or not. Fact is, you can’t keep kicking the can. Sure, governments can just go nuts printing money, and that just may be the last phase before the sheriff shows up.

It will not go on indefinitely and it will not be a soft landing in the end. It will come down hard. It’s not a matter of if, but when.

[poinq]

One other thing. China is not too happy with money flowing to the US. So its possible that China is happy that the US moved against this women. They want their companies to do business ere. But they do not want their people to escape China to move here with their money. So, China could feed into this. Fear of the US within China is a good thing for them.

[blackberry1]

And a recession finishes Trump off. His agenda would be left unfulfilled.

Starting a recession over trade would doom his to a one term presidency.

[SunkenCiv]

Another chink in the armor, eh? Shows that a large number of market traders believe they're getting rich because the companies whose stocks trade on the exchanges are utterly corrupt. /paranoid rant

AAPL and Samsung have both lost sales to Huawei, yet AAPL (didn't check Samsung) fell another $4 and change thus far today. And my tiny little portfolio isn't in tech at all right now, and got a little airsick today as well.

Apple itself gave a slightly weaker than expected forecast at its most recent report, calling for December (fiscal first) quarter revenues of $89 billion to $93 billion. That forecast would set a new record for Apple, but the street was at the high end going into the report. Since then, the street average has come down by a little more than $1 billion, but it likely is going lower. As you can see in the graphic below, there's at least one analyst that remains quite positive, expecting almost $101 billion, along with substantial EPS growth. -- Apple: Don't Buy The Bounce | Dec. 4, 2018 8:03 PM ET | by Bill Maurer

Once I've got my target out of my current positions, I'd be surprised if AAPL isn't a buy. And yeah, this will be a while in the future. It's not an unfamiliar trading pattern with AAPL, going back to the late 1980s.

[newnhdad]

I’ve been saying that for months. I would not be surprised if that came to light after any statute of limitations runs out.

[sparklite2]

Prove me wrong...

---

No, prove yourself right. Why expect someone else to validate your fantasies?

[BeauBo]

“China is going to respond to this.”

Good chance that this market manipulation is their response. They routinely manipulate their own markets on a massive scale, so they have the skills, as well as enough assets to implement.

The communist Chinese also routinely use economic incentives and punishments to achieve political ends around the world - it is their specialty.

Perhaps they had a hand in the perfectly timed stock market crash in 2008 as well, that put pro-communist Obama into office.

Today’s downturn comes just a week after Beijing summoned the heads of Wall Street firms for a meeting. The communists have been preparing for maximum pressure operations over the trade war, as devastating tariffs were scheduled for January 1st. This is a big enough threat to them, that they would pull out the biggest (or secret) weapons that they normally hold in reserve.

It is highly likely that communist China has prepared strategies and mechanisms to use economic measures as a weapon against the USA - both long term gradual strategies, and short-term weapon-like attacks.

The virtual shooting of the “trade” war Superpower conflict may be underway. Better now, while we still have the better cards to play, than waiting until it is too late.

[Freedom56v2]

How does that leave a mark?
Do you still own it?

[Freedom56v2]

Thanks. I did go read some of that thread.

[grey_whiskers]

BFD.

[Agamemnon]

The house I lived in in seattle, just before the crash ten years ago, was worth $540k. The crash brought it down to $310k. It is currently worth $1.4 million.

So you are saying you cashed out in the trough or you've ridden the market up?

FReegards!

[cuban leaf]

We rented. It was the right thing to do at that time. We paid a fraction of what it would have cost to own it. And when the bottom fell out, it cost us nothing.

[minnesota_bound]

My stock went down and now back up later in the day.
Hope that Trump does not tweet.

[Professional]

I’ve been a RIA for 26 yrs. The actions of the market today had squat to do with this...