"TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS governments are instituted among men"
What does that mean?
Are the Übertermites in the technocratic woodwork operating outside the scope of that specified, limited, purpose?
Posted on 06/07/2013 3:33:15 PM PDT by RummyChick
In the midst of revelations that the government has conducted extensive top-secret surveillance operations to collect domestic phone records and internet communications, the Justice Department was due to file a court motion Friday in its effort to keep secret an 86-page court opinion that determined that the government had violated the spirit of federal surveillance laws and engaged in unconstitutional spying.
(Excerpt) Read more at motherjones.com ...
Now look at the particulars. If that’s the set of rulings I recall, the ruling was asinine, conflating conflating monitoring of international traffic - over which no US court had authority - with monitoring of US-US communications..
“http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/17/AR2006081700650.html
A federal judge in Detroit ruled yesterday that the National Security Agency’s warrantless surveillance program is unconstitutional, delivering the first decision that the Bush administration’s effort to monitor communications without court oversight runs afoul of the Bill of Rights and federal law.”
Yup...that’s the idiocy. Conflating the CinC with the Attorney General.
“The left talks about hypocrisy, but I remember them screaming bloody murder when the Bush Administration sought to intercept international calls specifically involving a known or suspected terrorist. (International calls have been fair game for all ears since international calls were invented.)”
Yup. A key difference. I will note, however that it appears that the Obama administration went to another step further, and not simply abused the powers granted in the Patriot Act but broke the laws.
I stand corrected.
The P. Act was under the ‘leadership’ of Bush and the GOP; exactly how is that ‘elections have consequences’ material?
It’s OK when ‘our side’ shreds the Constitution, but not for the DEMS? Or, the DEMS took it TOO far?
Can anyone tell me how we have a Constitutional Republic LEFT?? Because the CURRENT ‘leadership’ is derelict and mute, if not complacent in the whole affair. What other Rights and Amendments are left that haven’t been trampled?
I’m ready for this ‘secret court’ to start hauling peeps away
It’s OK when ‘our side’ shreds the Constitution, but not for the DEMS? Or, the DEMS took it TOO far?
There is no evidence that the Bush administration operated outside the bounds of the Patriot Act.
There is increasing evidence that the Obama administration has exceeded the boundaries.
There is no law that has been written that liberal Democrats can't or won't abuse. Or ignore, if they need to. The ADA, EPA, Affirmative Action, the Patriot Act are just a few among many.
In that sense, laws are like guns. The law is perfectly neutral, it is the administration charged with enforcing it (or the administration ignoring it) that commits the abuse.
As a consequence, we must elect trustworthy and honorable people to positions of public trust. Democrats don't fit that definition -- and neither do a lot of Republicans.
Rights aren't Rights unless they apply equally to all citizens, regardless of their politics (or any of the other crap people are fond of using in disclaimers).
If power corrupts, we don't want any faction of Government to have too much--it will eventually be used in the worst way possible. It belongs with the People, anyway, as the Founders intended.
Read the amazing Mother Jones threads. 95% coming down hard on Democrats and Republicans. Angry. Obama-bashing. Bush-Bashing.
It’s not a Democrat vs. Republican anger. It’s a 0% vs. 100% government control issue.
I’m still waiting for Hillar’s response on all this. The fact she hasn’t weighed in tells me she is still considering running and wants to be careful about her statement.
At this point I take her silence as consent.
“Government lawyers are trying to keep buried a classified court finding that a domestic spying program went too far.”
Must be one of those double secret Unconstitutional ruling thingies that nobody is supposed to know about.
I remember a lot of people taking flak for same and just being incredulous watching it happen. Some of the discussions were very enlightening and I also recall closely watching dead’s posts at the time - I thought they were prescient. I was still forming my political opinions then and it was though provoking posts like that which set - or helped to set my political beliefs where they are.
Hopefully dead’s ego is sufficiently stroked now...
http://www.franklincase.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=11&Itemid=9
Come on, really? The whole P.A. shreds the Constitution, but because Bush didn’t REALLY kick us in the nuts THAT hard, it’s O.K.?
Laws are not ‘neutral’; especially when they fly in the face of the Constitution; like 99% of ‘em do today.
What WE should be doing is suing their asses off and/or running them out of town on a rail...It wasn’t THAT long ago the practice was still used. Unfortunately, IMHO, Big Gov’t has paid Paul’s complacency.
And don't worry about my ego, you can find plenty of stupid and wrong things I said back then too!
It's so interesting reading everybody's opinions and thoughts from twelve years ago, with the perspective of world events since.
You’re welcome! “you can find plenty of stupid and wrong things I said back then too” same goes for me...
And bitch at somebody else.
El gusto es mio.
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