Why God Can't Get Angry (Video)

YouTube ^ | Tues Nov 20, 2012 | offTheLeftEye

[DaveMSmith]

If we generally agree that loosing our temper at someone means that we have some more growing up to do, why would we think that God does it?

[DaveMSmith]

Revelation 22

The River of Life 1 Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations. 3 No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4 They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5 There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever. 6 The angel said to me, "These words are trustworthy and true. The Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent his angel to show his servants the things that must soon take place."

[DaveMSmith]

Can you put some of your beliefs on your profile page? It would be helpful.

[freekitty]

Agree

[grey_whiskers]

So let me see if I have this right: we're not required to filter Jesus' teachings through Paul's Hellenistic philosophy (even though Paul bragged about being of the Tribe of Benjamin, and was so zealous for Judaism that he was given power by the Jewish leaders to kill Christians); and met with Peter and others of the early Church in person; and who bragged of the inadequacy of his knowledge in exchange for the personal knowledge of Jesus; and who was persecuted and finally martyred for his faith.

BUT...

it would be better that we filter Jesus' teachings through the writings of a small cadre of people who lived two thousand years later, and who are related neither by blood, nor culture, nor language, and who are relying on multiple fragmentary sources written in dead languages; AND who seek either financial or economic gain from doing so; and who pride themselves on their intellectual attainments, and face no real persecution for their views.

Cheers!

[DannyTN]

God's anger is also a righteous anger. It's provoked by evil. That anger is tempered with mercy.

We know that God does in fact punish. He will occasionally purge evil from His creation, Sodom and Gemorrah, the violence which existed before the flood, and the coming final judgement spoken of in Revelations.

He also chastises "those whom he loves".

We are also told that the reason judgement doesn't come immediately is that the Lord is long suffering.

1Pe 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

[mad puppy]

Exactly. If you don’t think God gets worked up, then you haven’t read the O.T.

[circlecity]

Godly anger is an anthropomorphism we use to describe something we don’t have the ability to understand in any other terms

[SaraJohnson]

I’m a mom and I get angry when my children disobey and screw up. I don’t “lose my temper” but I show anger when all else (reason) is failing. Fortunately, they have always been reasonable people so I don’t show anger at them often. It scares the crap out of them. : )

Why do I do that? Because I don’t want them dealing with the suffering that comes with their disobedience to goodness or living in darkness. Life, as God designed it, gives people consequences when they embrace a mind and behavior of darkness and rebellion. The worst consequence is separation from God. I would not love my children if I did not care enough to become angry at them when they are setting about to ruin themselves and our home while I am responsible for them.

Expressing anger and “losing control” are not the same thing. Terrible consequences for terrible actions and mindsets are guarenteed in creation. Imposing consequences for misbehavior in children is a big part of parenting, too. It does not mean you are losing control; it means you care and focus enough to raise your children.

I know it is one of the anti-Christian slogans liberals have sold to young Christians that God does not ever reject anyone for sin. But that is not true. Sin has a natural consequence of separation from God and repenting (turning from sin) and asking forgiveness through Jesus is the way you reopen your relationship with God. I don’t think God “hates” people. But I think He hates the suffering and destruction of sin. He rejects sin. If you are harboring sin; embracing sin and naming evil good, He rejects you as you have rejected Him. Relationship with God is a two way street.

Life’s a rough road to hoe without His road map, especially if you look at the map and tell yourself to go in the opposite direction because you are smarter and better than the map and the designer of the map.

[Nifster]

pearls before swine in your case

[GenXteacher]

“Why God Can’t Get Angry”
Perhaps He is already angry....therefore, He has no need to get angry again.

[Nifster]

“The requirements for salvation are simple: live well, believe rightly, and you will be saved.”

Believe of the so called New Church

IF this is what you believe ( and from your post and page I think it is) you are non-Biblical in your heresy.

[Nifster]

ANd for the record this entire thread is better placed in the religion section since it neither news nor activism

[Pearls Before Swine]

Exactly. If you don’t think God gets worked up, then you haven’t read the O.T.

I usually stay a respectful distance away from threads in the Religion Forum, but this was posted to News/Activistm.

[American Constitutionalist]

The reason why God can't pour out his righteous wrath is because for this elect saints, his chosen ones Christ has already once and for all took upon himself their sins and received the punishment and God's righteous judgement on him.

Jesus Christ was or rather is the lamb of God who takes away the sins of his people.

How can God judge and show his righteous wrath and judgement on his people in whom he has already declared righteous ? already justified ?

IF ? Christ was never able put away the sins of his people then he would have never rose from the dead because the sacrifice was not acceptable.

The law could never make any man right in God's eyes... never... the law could never justify.

Those who rely on keeping the law for their justification are still dead in their sins and will be condemned by GOD in his judgement.

And for those who say that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh here as a human ?

The Gospel of John says that in the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God, and later in that very same chapter it says and the word became flesh.

Jesus Christ even said himself that He and the father are ONE.

Any one who preaches or teaches that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh is of the spirit of the anti-Christ and of the devil.

As the Apostle John said.... those who do not confess that Jesus Christ came in the flesh is of the spirit of the anti-Christ.
If anyone or any spirit teaches or preaches that Jesus Christ did not come in the flesh is of the spirit of the anti-Christ.
And no, I won't put scriptural references here for those who demand it and are to lazy to look it up.

[Sola Veritas]

“Jesus was not the Divine Human, yet when He entered the Temple. He still was a combination of Son of Man and Son of God.”

No, you make it too complex, but also NOT complex enough. He was God in human form. Jesus is God, God is Jesus. It is more correct to refer to the Lord Jesus Christ as “God the Son.” God is a Triunity:
God the Father
God the Son
God the Holy Spirit

ONE God with three faces.....it just cannot be explained in terms we humans can understand. It is beyond mortal comprehension....it is almost futile to try and make analogies because they always fall short. Just know, and more importantly believe, that God is Triune and Jesus Christ is part of that Triune God.

The hardest thing to wrap one’s mind around is that God let men hang Himself on a cross for the sins of man. On the cross, the Lord Jesus became “sin” for us and the recipient of the penalty. God literally turned His back on Himself when God the Father “forsook” God the Son at that moment He became sin for us. A great mystery, and something to marvel at....the angels certainly do...why should not we as well?

[Patton@Bastogne]

.


"The Almighty" does indeed get angry ...

wait a minute ...

there's a phone call coming in from Sodom and Gomorrah ...

oops !

the telephone line just went "dead" ...




.

[HarleyD]

God does not punish but evil has consequences.

This video is only half right. He's focused on God attributes but forgot about our attribute. God doesn't get "angry" or "vengeful" out of spite which is correct. But God's anger or wrath is just payment to all non-believers resulting from OUR behavior. God gives us the wages for our sin. Simply put, we earn hell. WE are deliberately rebellious towards God. Not the other way around. And we simply don't want to admit we're rebellious (many times even as Christians). We see pure love standing before us and we want to nail it to a tree. God would be unjust not to give us our wages. We must repent of this shameful behavior and ask God to cleanse us through His Son and change this attitude.

As for Christians God doesn't punish-He disciplines. What we see as "punishment" should be viewed as God's loving and corrective action. A small child might take being sent to their room as punishment whereas the adult looks at it as a time for the child to reflect on what he/she did and draw them back on the right path.

Heb 12:6 For the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and chastises every son whom he receives."

How we view these times of difficulties is important. We should rejoice because we know that God loves us and is improving us. It is our evil nature to view God's loving and corrective action not as loving discipline but as punishment. All things work for our good with those who love the Lord. Yet we complain constantly.

[brent13a]

You're either comfortable with an idealized construct of a Messiah that isn't the truth, or you want to know the truth.
Pauline Christianity has transformed Jesus into some sort of benign deity that will do all the heavy lifting for anyone.
The historic Jesus, if one was to walk beside him on a dusty road in 2nd Temple Israel/Galilee, they would understand him as a revivalist not a revolutionary.
Think early 1900's tent-by-the-river on the outskirts of town type of revivalism, except with original-beginning Judaism. What Jesus taught is what his/our Father imbued in him at his baptismal coronation.
What cannot be denied (by those that accept the truth and not eisegesis) is that YHWH didn't imbue Jesus with a new Judaism, or a new religion (christianity) or a different revolutionary Judaism (hellenism) but what Jesus was imbued with was the original Judaism that YHWH wanted His Chosen People (and those who wanted to enter the Kingdom) to know & follow.

History and Truth and not just Eisegesis

• The original Jerusalem Jesus Community was a hebrew/aramaic-speaking community perceived as no more than another Jewish sect in Jerusalem
• Stephen and the other Hellenists inside the Community had a disagreement with the hierarchy (James, Peter, etc) of the Jerusalem Jesus Community that led to a 'falling out' with the 'Hebrews' of the Community
• That 'disagreement' was ultimately over Stephen's Temple-less version of Judaism, which contained a less-than-full version of the Mosaic Law and his wish to allow Gentiles to join without converting in any way
• Stephen was killed and the rest of the Hellenists were thrown out of the Community and scattered to Samaria and Syria amongst other places including Damascus & Antioch
• These Hellenists, including Phillip, taught the Temple-less version of Judaism, which contained a less-than-full version of the Mosaic Law allowing unconverted Gentiles to "join"
• Paul came into contact with these Law-Free Hellenists and began pursuing and persecuting them
• Paul did not persecute the 'Hebrews' of the original Jerusalem Jesus Community, Paul's pursuits were of the Law-Free Hellenists
• Paul's "conversion" near Damascus (where he was indoctrinated by the Law-Free Hellenists) was his epiphany that he saw the error of his ways and adopted the Temple-less version of Judaism from the Hellenists and to teach to the Gentiles a morality-only and less-than-full version of the Mosaic Law
• There were two distinct independent movements within 10-20 years of Jesus' execution: a Law-Observant Community that consisted of the original Disciples and their Jewish followers and the other movement, a Law-Free Christianity started by the Hellenists and developed by Paul in Antioch

We have historical proof in other readily available, (non-Sunday-morning-devotionals) yet heavily cited, history books that before Paul's "Mission" the disciples and other followers of The Way disseminated the uncorrupted 1st Century 2nd Temple Jewish teachings of Jesus throughout Egypt and Asia, beginning to doing so just after Jesus' execution.

These Jewish missions by Matthew, Thomas, & Thaddeus Etc went to the LOST Jewish communities in the Diaspora, and taught based on just the Mission and Aims of Jesus, including an admission for Gentiles:

• If a Gentile were to be called by the Spirit of YHWH and he then sought out the missionary from Jerusalem, that Gentile would be accepted as a proselyte or convert but the Mission and Aims of Jesus never taught the disciples nor any missionary of The Way to proselytize to the Gentiles directly. Gentiles/Pagans/Heathens had to seek out The Way and discover it themselves……The Way was always originally meant to be for bringing wayward Jews back to the original hebrew way of following YHWH.

We also have historical proof in other scholarly history books that before Paul's "Mission" the disciples and other followers of The Way disseminated the original uncorrupted 1st Century Jewish teachings of Jesus throughout Egypt and Asia, without any help from Paul or the Hellenists:

• The Way was disseminated into India by Jewish Missionaries from Jerusalem and the original Jerusalem Jesus Movement, it was first to the extant Jewish communities or communities which ere created based on the original Jerusalem Jesus Movement. there were patristic (roman catholic saints) reports of copies of Gospel of the Nazarenes existing in India
•  The Way was disseminated into Egypt by Jewish Missionaries from Jerusalem and the original Jerusalem Jesus Movement, it was first to the extant Jewish communities or communities which ere created based on the original Jerusalem Jesus Movement
• The Way eventually settled in part os Syria/Persia even after the Fall of Jerusalem with the Hebrew Matthew Gospel/Gospel of the Nazarenes existing with the secluded communities of Jews who followed The Way, according to patristic (roman catholic saints) reports.
• These missions were initiated before the beginning of the Pauline Christianity and Paul's version of the 'mission to the gentiles'.

These Jewish missions by Matthew, Thomas, & Thaddeus Etc went to the LOST Jewish communities in the Diaspora and taught  based on just the Mission and Aims of Jesus including an admission for Gentiles:

• If a Gentile were to be called by the Spirit of YHWH and he then sought out the missionary from Jerusalem, that Gentile would be accepted as a proselyte or convert but the Mission and Aims of Jesus never taught the disciples nor any missionary of The Way to proselytize to the Gentiles directly. Gentiles/Pagans/Heathens had to seek out The Way and discover it themselves……The Way was always originally meant to be for bringing wayward Jews back to the original hebrew way of following YHWH.

We already know from research of Jesus' Mission & Aims that Jesus parousia/eschatology was oriented towards the Restoration of the Kingdom of Israel initiated by the Revival of the true Judaism of YHWH.

• Jesus envisioned the Restoration of the Kingdom of Israel as a world-changing event with the Kingdom of Israel being the World's guide, with Gentiles/Pagans/Heathens having an obvious place within this changed world • Obviously when the Restoration was initiated and the Judgement takes place at the 2nd Coming, those Gentiles left whom have not accepted YHWH and His Word will be given the chance to do so.



References:
Löning, Karl The Circle of Stephen and Its Mission from Christian Beginnings edited by Jürgen Becker. Westminster/John Knox Press USA 1993
Klutz, Todd Paul and the development of Gentile Christianity from The Early Christian World edited by Philip F. Esler. Routledge USA 2000
Bruce F.F. Stephen and the other Hellenists from Men and Movements in the Primitive Church by F.F. Bruce. Paternoster Press Great Britain 1979
Elmer Ian J. The Roots of the Crisis: Hebrews and Hellenists from Paul, Jerusalem, and the Judaisers by Ian J. Elmer Mohr Siebeck Germany 2009
Klijn, A.F.J. Jewish Christianity in Egypt from The Roots of Egyptian Christianity edited by Birger Pearson, Fortress Press USA 1986
Nagar, Sanjeev Christianity in Asian Countries, Mahaveer & Sons Publishing India 2010
Bird, Michael F. Jesus and the Origins of the Gentile Mission, T&T Clark USA 1988
Pines, Shlomo The Jewish Christians of the Early Centuries of Christianity According to a New Source. Central Press Jerusalem 1966

[brent13a]

The new covenant is a sharply defined renewal of the covenant of old, with YHWH's chosen people bound and devoted to the Law and prophets and living in communion and fellowship with YHWH.  (1QS, Qumran Scrolls)

The New Covenant prophesied by Jeremiah is not just simply the christian 'New Testament'. The disciples and members of the original Jerusalem Jesus Movement knew this.

The New Covenant (Torah Contract) prophesied by Jeremiah is the same as the Old Covenant (Torah Contract), with one simple caveat:

The original Covenant YHWH made with Judah was based on YHWH's provision of their own Set Apart land. In the Age-to-Come, when the Kingdom is Restored, the Covenant will need to be reestablished. YHWH's Will does not change, therefore the New Covenant will be the same as the Old, but with a new signature to seal the deal.

The New Covenant will be established when the Kingdom is Restored. Jesus, himself taught as much. The words and teachings of Jesus alone (contained in "The New Testament") are the pathway to Salvation in the Restored Kingdom, and through his originalist teachings one will be able to be part of the New Covenant with YHWH in the Age-to-Come.

Jesus' Jewish revivalist teachings and his mission in the gospels were decidedly Israel-centric. Christianity (the idealized Jesus) has dejudaized the historic Jesus and his teachings (utilizing the gnostic and stoic writings of Paul the Hellenist) in an attempt to label the christian New Testament as the New Universal Covenant. Modern Talmudism also continues the tradition, also utilizing the gnostic and stoic writings of Paul the Hellenist to disguise and belittle the Set Apart Anointing of Jesus as the spiritual Son of YHWH.

Neither the christian gospels nor the pauline writings are themselves the New Covenant. The words and teachings, of Jesus the (Chosen) Galilean Son of YHWH, alone are the guidebook and the pathway to the New Covenant with YHWH in His Restored Kingdom.

"Behold, the days come, says YHWH, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they broke, although I was an husband unto them, says YHWH: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, says YHWH, I will put my Torah in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their Elohim, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know YHWH: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says YHWH: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more." (Jeremiah 31:31-34)

The phrase “house of Israel and house of Judah” has been interpreted differently by various christian schools of thought, and it should be noted that the phrase could not have implied any group of persons outside of the Nation of Israel (i.e. the religion of Judaism) from this context. Christian tradition insinuates a mystical meaning within a wholly Jewish prophecy. Christian thought forces the phrase to become a transitional concept for the “Nation of Israel” to magically transform into the current “church” or the "whole body of christianity". This ideology is nothing more than christian supercession and eisegesis.

“House of Israel occurs 147 times in the Tanakh, and “House of Judah” occurs 35 times in Tanakh. The two phrases occur together 9 times in the Tanakh and 8 of them are in the Book of Jeremiah with 1 occurrence in Zechariah. In all of these occurrences in Tanakh, none is ever used in context for any other group of persons other than national Israel. The same is true of Jeremiah’s usage in 31:31. In this context the phrase “house of Israel and house of Judah” refers only to national Israel, who were deported and with whom Jeremiah argued about the date of restoration. Based on the fact that the Prophet Jeremiah lived and prophesied prior to the destruction of Solomon’s Temple in 587 BC the contrast in 31:31-34 could not have been a contrast between Jews and Christians but a contrast between Jews only, prior to 587 BC and transformed Jews after 587 BC. The christian idea that Jeremiah was referencing Jews and Gentiles in the same prophecy is a perfect example of christian eisegesis (supersessionism).

YHWH did not torture and kill His only human son to establish the New Covenant; it was man's religious "justice system" that put the anointed Son of YHWH on the cross. Man's sin and hubris put the Messiah on the cross; therefore, the New Covenant will uphold the Word of YHWH (which defines sin and love) when the Covenant is Restored along with the Kingdom of God.

Jesus' teachings are a revival of the first covenant because the people weren’t connected to it owing to the fact that the Judaism of that time had developed well beyond what YHWH had originally instructed and commanded, and continues to do so. The second covenant is not a "new" or "different" covenant at all, it's a Restored Covenant (just like the Kingdom of YHWH will be Restored). Jesus' job was to “fix” the original covenant by restoring it to its original intent: that we enter into the Kingdom of YHWH through faith in the Messiah's teachings (basically original roots judaism) and express our love for YHWH through obedience to His Torah and these original roots of Judaism!

The term and definition of "New Testament" is anti-Messiah; it was coined by a Christo-Pagan named Marcion who viewed Jesus as akin to one of the Greek gods of his own culture. Marcion taught that the "God of the Jews" was an evil god of wrath, judgment and terror, but that Jesus was a kind and loving god. Marcion coined the terms "Old and New Testament" to demarcate YHWH and Jesus as two separate Gods who were at war with each other; hence, the dualism in Christian churches that use the terms Old and New Testament to uphold replacement and dispensational theology. The consequences of the fatal anti-Torah and anti-Messiah deception is very far reaching; so much so, in fact, that permissiveness of Covenant breaking is commonplace throughout Christendom.

The "Restored Covenant" was foretold when Adam and Eve broke Covenant with YHWH. Then YHWH forgave their sin and promised the ultimate redemption which He Himself provided through the seed of the woman (Genesis 3:15). Just as Adam and Eve are the father and mother of all living souls, so is the Renewed Covenant offered to all inhabitants of the Earth through Jesus' Teachings.