mmmmm.... steak....
Posted on 10/14/2011 7:43:04 AM PDT by taildragger
I ran the following concept by a friend who's wife is a CPA and by extension lives the tax code :-), and was no slouch himself at college level accounting. He agrees with my following assessment, and Fellow Freeper's I'd like to get your thoughts as well...
I think what Herman has done is brilliant, here is what I think it is....
Herman splits the baby in half.
999 is both a Flat Tax and a Fair Tax via the sales tax component.
Both Fair and Flat Taxers will never agree, but they both get enough of their plan to still put a steak in the heart of the current tax code.
IMHO the Fair and Flat supporters should consider that rather than fighting and creating an intramural squabble that could stymy the conservative movement, they might want to reconsider and get aboard 999....
The genius of 999 is that it won’t pass. But if Herman Cain is elected you can push for the Fair Tax or the Flat Tax or whatever the hell you want.
Herman Cain is your best chance of blowing up the current tax system and replacing it with something more sensible.
I agree. But fix the title of the thread (typo genious = genius). Distracts from the message in a less than subtle way.
He needs to campaign that way.
“Whether you adopt my plan or some other plan, the point is to dismantle the current code and take the power out of Washington and put it in the hands of taxpayers.”
Two problems with 999. First it raises taxes on older folks on a fixed income, which will eventually raise a lot of opposition. Second it includes reduced tax areas called “Empowerment Zones.” These reek of giving special tax breaks to favored parts of the population, at the expense of everyone else. Social engineering, like “Empowerment Zones,” is exactly what has messed up the current tax system.
mmmmm.... steak....
Consider Mrs Cain will not comment on the Steak or try to take away for Fries....
I understand the fairness argument, but there’s another big picture aspect to this that conservatives ignore to their peril. It is undeniably factually true that since 1980, changes in the tax code have shifted burden from where it was to a new place; from the very wealthy to the middle class.
You can argue that it is more fair to make the middle class bear more of the burden; you can also argue that the richest are job creators and it benefits the nation to have the rich get richer and the middle class get poorer.
But you can’t help but admit that in the 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s, America had more wealth and political power invested in the middle class.
You are not conservative if you think America in 1940 - 1980 was a socialist haven unfair to rich people. I’m sorry, but I refuse to accept that. I think we had it right back then. We as a nation were richer, paying down our debt, and living in families where the mom could stay at home and raise kids, 15-year mortgages that actually led to home ownership, public colleges that were virtually free, and political campaigns that were based on our money.
The problem with 9-9-9 is that it further tilts the revenue source away from the 1940 to 1980 pattern. It will result in more unemployment, more tough times, weaken citizens, and greater debt. You want a tax code that makes America great? How about the 40 years of experience of financial greatness and prosperity and declining debt?
Out of the blue he appeared.
I hope that the GOP which loves to choose candidates for us doesn’t bury him and give us another McCain.
As usual the screaming and ranting comes from the nearly half who pay NO TAXES now. That includes the really poor and also the super rich corporations like GE who make zillions and are able, with the help of friends in congress, shelter all of it from any kind of tax whatsoever. For any of this to succeed the Income Tax must be repealed!
WA PingI like the basics, but in the short term there will still be some life changes necessary to make things work. In my state of Washington we have a 6.5% state sales tax and a 8.9% county sales tax and a combined state and federal gas tax of 55.9 cents per gallon.
Now, when I add in Cain's 9 percent tax on all consumer purchases, a 9 percent “business” tax and a 9 percent income tax it starts getting a bit sticky because I am a small business owner operating on an LLC pass through (income) corporation status.
I am also thinking about what this will do to my mother who subsists on social security. She will not pay a business tax, but will lose almost 10% of her monthly stipend resulting from the national tax on all her purchases and utilities.
A consumption based tax is the most fair tax in any sense, as long as it is applied evenly across all classes of goods and services. It is applied to users/consumers in direct proportion to consumption/use.
The problems are very easy to fix. The problem of raising taxes on the retired is fixed by exempting social security. The problem of fear of higher rates is fixed with a balanced budget amendment and fed spending limit amendment. The libs do not like it—a clue we ought to be for it.
“As usual the screaming and ranting comes from the nearly half who pay NO TAXES now.”
1. People are stupid if anyone thinks that they pay no taxes now. Taxes are imbedded in the retail price of everything that we buy.
2. For the last year, it’s been pretty well understood that *everyone* will have to sacrifice to save our nation, yet now that there’s a plan to share the sacrifice, people don’t want to do it. “Taxes for thee, but not for me!”
3. If the corporations are thriving and the economy is thriving, we will suffer *less* as we’re dealing with this mess.
you sir nailed it..............”IT’s” all about power! More and more of the sheeple are beginning to understand that these dimocrat AND republican legislators talk one thing in interviews and when a mike is around but behind closed doors they are exactly the same on one point. That is power !! They don’t want to change a damn thing! They just enjoy the power they get to wield each day and enriching themselves to the point of millions over the average 30 years they are there. The “system” of two parties is corrupt as any third world country.
I see Norquist was on yesterdays Morning Joe and claimed that replacing part of the income tax (production tax) with a sales tax (consumption tax) is bad because it just gives Dems a future opening to raise more taxes, even if this is a flat (non-progressive-non-redistribution) tax,
I disagree. Democrats under Obama-care have proved that when in power they can create any new tax they want, they are not limited to raising current types of taxes. He is flat wrong.
A sales/consumption tax makes us more competitive in creating jobs because it does not apply to exports unlike the income tax. Yes, that means we pay a consumption tax that those in other countries wont pay buying our exports. When China does this it is called unfair and cheating by the 'we cant compete' whiners.
Right now Cain is the best I see of the lot.
I congratulate Herman Cain. Objective accomplished. You have received more attention for what is otherwise nothing but a political gimmick. 999 will never see the light of day.
There are unseen taxes in virtually everything she buys which probably add up to more than 9%.
I don't understand ALL the effects of the 999, but I do think it will hurt those who are in the lower bracket and on SS.
True. But, those taxes remain and are joined by the new 9%, no?
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