Posted on 09/25/2011 7:38:46 AM PDT by upchuck
Currently there are some 14 million jobless Americans. And if you’re one of the thousands of North Texans looking for work, the competition is tough.
Now, a new hiring limitation by one employer could make the job search even harder.
The Baylor Health Care System has decided that if you use tobacco, in any form, you won’t get a job with them.
“I don’t like it,” said Cassie Grooms. “I don’t think it’s fair.”
Smokers like Grooms were quick to condemn Baylor’s new policy that basically conveys: if you use nicotine, there’s no need to apply.
“We all have the right to smoke a cigarette,” Grooms said in disagreement. “I can understand not [smoking] on their property, but to not hire somebody for smoking…”
Baylor officials claim smoking has a lot to do with the high cost of health care. The FDA estimates smoking costs American employers some $200 billion a year in lost productivity and increased medical costs.
“It’s about how we continue to deal with the rising health care costs,” said Baylor CEO Joel Allison. “It’s about how do we really focus on the new model of health care around prevention and well, and how do we keep people healthy. And I think that’s very, very important for us as a city, a state and a nation.”
Smoking was banned at all Baylor campuses four years ago. But, can they legally refuse to hire smokers?
“Absolutely they can,” said Dallas employment attorney Thomas Brandt. “People think well, that’s discriminatory, but really there are only certain factors that you cannot consider when making hiring decisions.”
Things like race, gender, ethnicity or national origin cannot be considered when hiring an employee.
If increased medical costs are a consideration for banning employee tobacco use, then ponder this: obesity is also a national health crisis. According to the CDC obesity costs employers some $147 billion a year.
I can tell you this.
My employer made our workplace smokefree 7 years ago using the argument that it was to lower healthcare costs.
I told my fellow employees “Mark my words. Your insurance rates will go up next year and you benefits will go down”
I also told them that this was just a wedge issue and that by buying into the notion that we can tax people based heath care “concerns” they are passively condoning taxes for things like sodapop and snacky cakes.
Within the month of my saying this, the company started putting color codes on items in vending machines.
Green = heart healthy
Yellow = fat free
Etc..
Does anyone see where that is going? LoL
And the hilarious thing is that they will call something that is PURE SUGAR, FAT FREE!
And wise people nod their heads in agreement..
Yeah.. Yeah..
It’s fat free, it must be heart healthy..
Oh, did I mention the company is the one selling the soda and snacky cakes to the concerned health nuts?
Yes, we all have our vices LoL
BAck surgery? I ask because I was supposed to do the same. In any case let me wish you a pain free and speedy recovery.
Baylor is a Baptist Christian University....so this would be what I’d expect to happen. Nothing here move on.....
I forgot to add that health care premiums did go up the next year, and benefits were reduced.
It has been the same with every subsequent year.
“Oh, did I mention the company is the one selling the soda and snacky cakes to the concerned health nuts?”
World-class hypocrisy!
Are getting a total spinal fusion? For me, they call it a total or complete, but my neck will be left alone. Everything else will be one long bone. It’s pretty extensive. My ribs will be rearranged, my heart will shift position, pressure will be relieved off my lungs...
I won’t be so freakin’ short! :)
My FIL had his lumbar vertebrae fused two years ago and he doesn’t regret it.
Maybe they could ban rollerbladers, skydivers,extreme sportmen,skateboarders and other risky behavior.
Next maybe gun owners as well, because you never know.
It’s a well known fact that people from the island of Ruba-Dorka in the South Pacific are almost all heavy smokers.
This policy is discriminatory and a lawsuit will be filed in the morning.
Everyone has an opinion on everything. This is mine. This issue could be about an employer having the right to choose whom they hire. If they are a private employer and take no government money I think they should as long as their policies are published and they are consistent. But Baylor is not a true private employer-way too much of their income is from federal and state government funds. They state they are basing their position on the fact that insurance costs more if you are a smoker. If that is really the reason, then they should not hire anyone who has any kind of a condition that could potentially increase their insurance costs. One option would, however, appear to be for all employees to pay any additional costs in coverage if they have any condition that drives up the cost. The best option is to get totally away from employers providing insurance and everyone have their own policy. Baylor is injecting selective nannyism by using a currently hot button issue. Makes me concerned about what the next disqualifier will be. At a minimum, Baylor at least needs to exhibit some honesty.
“Besides, most smokers I know, also avoid doctors, right up until the big heart attack, die early, and actually SAVE money for the government by not living to be 90 years old on SS.”
That is a KEY POINT. Note that they say that smokers cost EMPLOYERS $200B a year. They didn’t say “society” or “government” because they know that government, for the most part only deals with health costs at age 65 (and maybe not even then, if the person is still working). But the point is EXACTLY what you say - if people die earlier due to smoking-related illnesses, than government saves a boatload. That is why Reagan thought (and was told) that signing his Social Security tax increase would make Social Security solvent forever. I have no doubt that the actuaries were convinced that was the case...but they we’re relying on lots of people dying early and dying (relatively) quickly, as many (if not most) smokers do.
It’s kind of an ugly topic to discuss, but the bottom-line is that if we were going to start wiping out smoking, then we should have adjusted the tax rates for Social Security and Medicare accordingly, rather than running up huge debts and future obligations.
Here’s a test question for you guys that support Baylor. Ask yourself what would happen if they said “smokers AND homosexuals need not apply”, due to their healthcare costs.
That is the problem.
Why do people feel that they can mess with Ruba~Dorka?
We like Ciggies and we like Orange Crush.
We are out here in the middle of no where and we aren’t buggin nobody Bra.
Lol!
And we ain’t had a war since the poison-dart incidents in 1958!
(I wonder if anyone googled Ruba-dorka... I just had to do it!)
One of the unintended consequences of globalization is the increased pressure on all employers caused by reduced profit margins. Here in Rochester, the local Excellus-Blue Cross office announced 2012 premium increases of 8-12%. No employer can continue to absorb these types of increases. The employer can't just pass these costs on to the customer. Neither can employees cover these cost increases, when a 2-3% raise is considered generous. We are just happy to have jobs. The sad truth is that each of us must assume responsibility for our own medical coverage. There are no rich uncles, flush with cash, to pay for our poor choices.
I personally would have no problem with Baylor not hiring queers because they typically have higher medical costs than straights. Same for overweight people.
“I personally would have no problem with Baylor not hiring queers because they typically have higher medical costs than straights. Same for overweight people.”
Understand, nor would I and most people on this site. But just imagine the reaction in the rest of the country, particularly in the MSM.
HR timed it, and on average it was just about 30 minutes. This seems like half-time to me.
I put in extra time at work just to keep anal jerks from using that argument with me.
At that facility, you would have needed to work 16 hours per day to have the same number of working hours as a non-smoker.
I don’t see anybody timing how long people people are in the john or how often they go. I don’t see anybody timing the quantity and frequency of coffee breaks.
At most large companies, HR can tell you the average number of minutes per hour spent on sanitary breaks, coffee and snack breaks, etc. It is part of their job. It is about the same for smokers and non-smokers. A significant difference is that smokers tend to combine any kind of break with a smoke break also.
The real fact is that with modern rules, i.e. no smoking inside, smokers are less productive than non-smokers. It is one of those non-PC facts, that smokers always want to burry, but it is coming to the fore again.
This company is a health care company. I don’t know what that implies, like sending health care workers to homes? If it does I know this I would prefer a non smoker. To hire for myself or a relative. When ever we hired health care workers for my granny and they were smokers (and most were) They needed smoke brakes about every 20 minutes. Sometimes we would need them and where were they? Yea! Out smoking on the porch! It got old fast. That was all we could hire. When they opened the door the smoke came in. If they missed a smoke brake they became nervous from lack of nicotine. Then when they came in they smelled like cigarette smoke. Please don’t get on to me about the smell too. You smokers can’t smell it but for those of us who have not ruined our noses from smoking we can smell it and it stinks. Not anything I like to smell esp when I am sick with asthma and allergies.
I have to wonder why anyone wants to be an addict to nicotine. I am against smoking but for religious reasons. Your body is the temple of the Lord and should not be fouled with such evil. I agree it should be God telling you to quit and not big brother. I just wish more of you could see how your smoke affects those around you esp people who are sick already and don’t want to get worse.
I don’t think you quite grasped my point. I know how the free enterprise system works.
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