Gates suggests US fighters for Japan

AFP via Defense Talk ^ | 1/14/2011 | AFP via Defense Talk

[ErnstStavroBlofeld]

Defense Secretary Robert Gates on Thursday suggested Japan should consider buying US fighter jets, during talks in Tokyo, as the country plans for new warplanes, a US official said.

In a meeting with Defence Minister Toshimi Kitazawa, Gates "suggested Japan consider three US planes to upgrade their fleet," the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the F/A-18 Hornet and the F-15 Eagle, the senior defence official told AFP.

Gates offered that the Pentagon could provide Japan with an analysis of the merits of each aircraft, said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Japan is taking stock of its defence hardware in the face of China's growing military might and assertive stance in the Pacific.

Gates flew to Tokyo Wednesday after a visit to China, where his fence-mending talks were overshadowed by a Chinese stealth fighter test, which came sooner than US military officials had anticipated.

During his visit to Beijing this week, Gates noted that Japan was looking for a new fighter aircraft.

"And so that would give Japan the opportunity -- if they bought the right airplane -- to have a fifth generation capability. And I might have a few suggestions for them," he told reporters on Tuesday.

[RC one]

we need to start exporting the F22.

[ErnstStavroBlofeld]

You would need an act of Congress for that.

[Ronin]

Tokyo is less enthusiastic about the F-35 than it was about the F-22 and is still hoping that something will come along and change the equation. China may have done that with the recent J-20 photos and tests, but it’s too early to say for sure.

That is not to say that the F-35 does not have its own fans in the JSDF, especially in the JMSDF who see the STOVL version as a possible back-door addition to its new helicopter carriers and thus giving Japan a power projection capability it has lacked since the war.

But with the STOVL version on double secret probation and the entire F-35 program seemingly costing more and proving less capable with every news-cycle, they might be tempted to an interim upgrade while they continue to push for an export version of the Raptor.

Of those possibilities, I think the F-15SE, which is already under consideration for export to the ROK might be a good choice. For one thing, it has the potential to give the ROK and Japan an opening for increased interoperability, which would be nice given the current trend towards closer defense ties, and for another Japan has operated F-15s for many years, so the basic bird is well known.

[RC one]

I know. We still need to do it. First we need to secretly make it obsolete of course.

[Candor7]

F22 is the way to go. Give the plans to the Japanese, let them tweak the, and sell then essential componenets. The Japanese would probably end up with a better aircraft, knowing heir design and software capabilities.If Hillery CLinton had any smarts at all, she would be pushing an f-22 dea with Japan as if her cushion was pushin. Thats a lot of momentum by the way, but I doubt she has the will or hutzpah left. Obama has done her in.

Obama has a lot of ground to make up to resecure Japan as an ally in the face of Chinas expansionism.An F22 deal would do most of whats needed, and put China in a spinning tizzy, which is exactly where they should be.China now owns the West Pacific, which is why N.Korea is acting as it does.

[RC one]

I think stealth tech is great but we shouldn’t be putting as much faith in it as we have. It’s definitely a good trick but it shouldn’t be our only trick. What’s more, as other nations come to develop stealth planes of their own, we have to start thinking about making stealth obsolete. In this way, we are controlling the situation as opposed to being controlled by it. I think UAVs with semi-autonomous guidance are the way to go. They can outmaneuver anything and you don’t lose a pilot when you lose a plane. They aren’t as sexy but they have the potential to be way more effective.

[Yo-Yo]

we need to start exporting the F22.

Japan was interested in the F-22 at $150 million per copy. They're less interested at the $350 million per copy it really cost when you amortize development costs over 187 aircraft and add in the current unit flyaway costs.

[RC one]

if they were exportable, the cost would be spread out over more than 187 aircraft. It’s definitely time to look at exporting the F22. I guarantee Russia and China will be exporting theirs.

[Moltke]

Will a map of Pearl Harbor be included with each plane?

[Yo-Yo]

If they were exportable, you would sell maybe a total of 100 more, lowering the per unit development costs by maybe $20 million.

People seem to forget how long and how much over budget the F-22 development process was. Had the US ordered another batch of F-22s instead of closing the line at 187, those aircraft were projected to have a unit flyaway cost of around $150 million. That's just the cost to build one, excluding any sunk development costs.

Japan, Australia, and Israel were all hoping to get the F-22 for just the unit flyaway costs, leaving the US to fully subsidize the development costs.

The main reason the F-22 was never sold to those countries is because the avionics would have to be made suitable for export, and those costs were projected to be in the tens of billions of dollars alone.

It's been my contention for a while now that if we're going to limit ourselves to 186 aircraft (after the loss last year in Alaska) then we should at least have 186 of the latest block aircraft.

We should sell off the 97 or so earlier block aircraft to those other countries, and replace them with the latest model.

Why, you may ask? Read this: The F-22 can't do what??? and also read the underlying article Sharpening the Raptor's talons.

[Candor7]

UAVs are indeed the way to go.

But Japan needs to know we are still allies.