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Secession ball stirs controversy
The SunNews.com ^ | 12-3-2010 | Robert Behre Charleston Post

Posted on 12/03/2010 4:39:40 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo

Event marks war's anniversary

CHARLESTON -- The shots are solely verbal -- and expected to remain that way -- but at least one Civil War Sesquicentennial event is triggering conflict.

The Sons of Confederate Veterans plan to hold a $100-per-person "Secession Ball" on Dec. 20 in Gaillard Municipal Auditorium. It will feature a play highlighting key moments from the signing of South Carolina's Ordinance of Secession 150 years ago, an act that severed the state's ties to the Union and put the nation on the path to the Civil War.

Jeff Antley, who is organizing the event, said the Secession Ball honors the men who stood up for their rights.

"To say that we are commemorating and celebrating the signers of the ordinance and the act of South Carolina going that route is an accurate statement," Antley said. "The secession movement in South Carolina was a demonstration of freedom."

The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People plans to protest the event, said Charleston branch President Dot Scott. She deferred further comment to Lonnie Randolph, president of the state NAACP.

"It's amazing to me how history can be rewritten to be what you wanted it to be rather than what happened," Randolph said. "You couldn't pay the folks in Charleston to hold a Holocaust gala, could you? But you know, these are nothing but black people, so nobody pays them any attention."

When Southerners refer to states' rights, he said, "they are really talking about their idea of one right -- to buy and sell human beings."

Antley said that's not so.

"It has nothing to do with slavery as far as I'm concerned," he said. "What I'm doing is honoring the men from this state who stood up for their self-government and their rights under law -- the right to secede was understood."

Antley said, "Slavery is an abomination, but slavery is not just a Southern problem. It's an American problem. To lay the fault and the institution of slavery on the South is just ignorance of history."

Antley said about 500 people are expected to attend the ball, which begins with a 45-minute play and concludes with a dinner and dancing. S.C. Senate President Pro Tem Glenn McConnell, an ardent Civil War re-enactor, is among the actors in the play. The actual ordinance of secession document also will be on display.

Randolph said the state NAACP is consulting with its national office in Baltimore regarding the format of the protests, which also could extend to other 150th anniversary events. "There is not one event that's off the table," he said.

Asked whether there could be good Sesquicentennial events, Randolph said, "If there were a dialogue to sit down and discuss that event 150 years ago and how it still negatively impacts the lives of so many people in this state and around the country, that would be a good discussion, but not an event to sit down and tell lies about what happened and glamorize those people who thought America was so sorry and so bad that they wanted to blow it to hell. That's what they did -- that's what they attempted to do, and we want to make that honorable?"

Charleston is receiving increased national attention as the nation's plans for the Sesquicentennial move forward. This was where it began, with the state becoming the first to secede on Dec. 20, 1860, and firing the first shot on April 12, 1861.

Most of the Lowcountry's Sesquicentennial events have been announced with little controversy -- many involve lectures by respected historians and scholars.

In its vision statement for the observance, the National Park Service said it "will address the institution of slavery as the principal cause of the Civil War, as well as the transition from slavery to freedom -- after the war -- for the 4 million previously enslaved African Americans."

Michael Allen of the National Park Service said he is aware of plans for the Secession Ball but noted that most Sesquicentennial events have found common ground among those with differing viewpoints.

"Now some people might be upset with some pieces of the pie. I understand that," he said. "I think that's the growth of me, as a person of African decent, is to realize that people view this in different ways."

Allen said other Sesquicentennial commemorations being planned will mark events that have a strong black history component, such as Robert Smalls' theft of the Confederate ship Planter and the 54th Massachusetts' assault on Battery Wagener.

"At least what's being pulled together by various groups, be they black or white or whatever, will at least be more broad based and diverse than what was done in 1961," Allen said. "Hopefully, at the end of the day, all Carolinians can benefit from this four-year journey."

Tom O'Rourke, director of the Charleston County Park and Recreation Commission, said Sesquicentennial organizers were fooling themselves if they thought the Confederate side of the story was going to be buried in the observances.

"I think there will be controversy, I think there will be hurt feelings, and I think that as this anniversary passes, we will question what else we could have done to tell the whole story," he said. "But I am OK with all of that. ... I think all discussion is progress."

Read more: http://www.thesunnews.com/2010/12/03/1847335/secession-ball-stirs-controversy.html#ixzz1737LSVRv


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: South Carolina
KEYWORDS: antiamerican; civilwar; confederacy; dixie; history; itsaboutslaverydummy; kukluxklan; partyofsecession; partyofslavery; proslaveryfreepers; scv; secession; southcarolina; treason; whitehoodscaucus; whitesupremacists
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To: rockrr
No thanks. I’ve seen all your crap - none worth the time of day.

I've got a horse that's worth more than your mobile home and a picture of me and him on your wall would actually increase the value of your, ahem, property.

LOL!!

741 posted on 12/14/2010 9:20:56 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: TheBigIf; mstar; cowboyway; Idabilly; central_va
From the Confederate democrats to the Progressive democrats – both belonged to the KKK coven or klavern and both have never believed in equal rights to representation for all. (TBI)

The Republican Party Platform of 1868 did not believe in equal representation for all. As a matter of fact, their second principle reads:

Second—The guaranty by Congress of equal suffrage to all loyal men at the South was demanded by every consideration of public safety, of gratitude, and of justice, and must be maintained; while the question of suffrage in all the loyal States properly belongs to the people of those States.

IOW, give sufferage to the negroes in the Southern states, but leave the question of negro sufferage to the individual states in the North. This isn't promoting equal representation for all by any stretch of the imagination.

742 posted on 12/14/2010 9:22:03 AM PST by southernsunshine
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To: cowboyway

What a waste of a perfectly good horse.


743 posted on 12/14/2010 9:22:29 AM PST by rockrr ("I said that I was scared of you!" - pokie the pretend cowboy)
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To: southernsunshine

sufferage = suffrage


744 posted on 12/14/2010 9:23:01 AM PST by southernsunshine
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To: TheBigIf
Look at the names of the confederate democrat KKK leaders: “Cyclops,” “Wizard,” “Grand Dragon.” The Imperial Wizard meets with “klaverns,” which sounds a lot like “covens.”

And if a butterfly chances to flap his wings in Beijing in March, then, by August, hurricane patterns in the Atlantic will be completely different.....what the hell are you talking about, idiot?

745 posted on 12/14/2010 9:26:48 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: TheBigIf; central_va; cowboyway; rockrr; rustbucket; mstar; southernsunshine
Found this for ya!

150th Anniversary of Lincoln’s Election: Understanding the 1848 connection

Don't know much about history, especially 1848 One of the flaws of the education received in public schools is that world events are often not considered when studying American history. Few students are aware of the 1848 revolutions in Europe and the military and political impact they had on the United States, including the election of 1860.

In those revolutions, many Europeans took action against their governments. Among them were followers of Karl Marx and Frederich Engels who wanted to dismantle the capitalist system and the church and replace them with a centralized government. They were putting their beliefs into action. The followers attempted implementing their socialist ideals on governments across Europe through force. The revolutionaries organized armed revolts against the central government in nations across Europe. Germany, France, Austria-Hungary, Belgium and Italy were faced with the challenge of armed socialists rising up against the governments of those nations.Many reasons were given for the uprisings and the revolutionists wanted many changes, most of which involved wanting more centralized governments more say in government and more government programs. The socialists in Europe capitalized on the unrest and used the dissatisfaction to further their socialists agendas.

The fighting involved storming the government buildings and fighting in the streets of many cities throughout Europe (Buda, Paris, Baden, Dresden, Berlin, etc.). It was during those uprisings, that the red flag which has so long been associated with socialism was used in combat. The commander who first raised the red flag of socialism in that uprising was August Willich (The colors of black, red and gold were often used in this uprising). Willich was personal friends with Karl Marx and Frederick Engels. Engels served as Willich’s aide-de-camp during the uprisings in Baden.

(Note: In the European system of government, the people did not often have a say in the policies and practices. The weak if not lack of a voice was one of the motivating factors behind such uprisings. The intellectuals believed that the uprising route was the only option open to them to change the government structured then in place. Socialist writers like Marx and Engels capitalized on the dissatisfaction of the people with the government and the competition between the workers and the rulers. It was in 1848 that the Communist Manifesto was first published and with its publication, came a radicalization of thought which led to action as in the 1848 revolutions.)

The 1848 uprising in Berlin Abraham Lincoln, who admired the 1848er's and employed many of them as generals and in his administration. Abraham Lincoln's support of the 1848 revolutions The young American politician, Abraham Lincoln, admired the revolutionaries. He went so far as to make a public speech in support of their efforts. Although some historians attribute this speech to support of Texas and its War for Independence from Mexico, that war took place in 1836. Texas was later annexed in 1845, which was three years before Lincoln made his speech.Consider the uproar if the schools presented the reality in the historic context that Lincoln was actually speaking in favor of socialist revolutions and communist uprisings then underway in Europe.

Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable, a most sacred right - a right which we hope and believe is to liberate the world. Nor is this right confined to cases in which the whole people of an existing government may choose to exercise it. Any portion of such people, that can, may revolutionize, and make their own of so much of the territory as they inhabit.”-Abraham Lincoln, 1848

------------------

1848er's in America: Organizing for Change Once in America, the forty-eighters developed a support system which encouraged other 48er’s to come to America as well. Some of those coming to America continued spreading their socialist and communist ideas through newspapers they began publishing in many States.Karl Heinzen published the Pioneer. Heinzen was known for his extreme views and some viewed him as bordering on 'anarchism'.

They also began organizing and participating in local politics. They brought their brand of socialism with them. The 48’ers Eric Scmidt and Carl Schurz had been critical in obtaining support in Illinois for Lincoln. Schurz along with Gustave Koerner authored the plank in the newly-formed Republican Party platform known as the “Dutch Plank” which was anti-nativist in its nature, so as to endear the Republicans to the many immigrant Germans which lived in the area. Prior to this time, the politicians catered to those Americans then living in the nation. It was considered expedient for the party to 'include' the immigrant vote by having a plank in its platform condemning 'nativism' which was popular at the time. Carl Schurz wrote his wife that the candidate Abraham Lincoln considered him the "foremost of all" of those campaigning for his election.

In preparation for the election, Abraham Lincoln himself, purchased the German language Illinois newspaper "Illinois Staatsanzeiger." Although the image of Lincoln portrayed to the voters is that of a poor, humble, country lawyer, the reality was different. It is for this reason that its purchase was done quietly so as to avoid public exposure. The reality was that a large number of Lincoln's clientele were railroads, not the working man. He was a wealthy tool of the railroad industry, but needed to have a different image. He was employed by the Illinois Central Railroad, which at that time was one of the largest in the world. Poor lawyers would not have had the money to purchase a whole newspaper, nor could the working man identify with them.

Besides purchasing the newspaper, Lincoln had allies with former 48er’s who were working as journalists at the time. Casper Butts, Friedrich Kapp and Gustave Struve wrote to their fellow German immigrants about the importance of supporting the candidate Abraham Lincoln. Forty-Eighter, Edward Solomon also campaigned extensively for Lincoln in the northwest and ended up becoming governor of Wisconsin in 1862. One of the Forty-Eighter journalists, Karl Heinzen wrote: “If you have to blow up half a continent and cause a bloodbath to destroy the party of barbarism, you should have no scruples of conscience. Anyone who would not joyously sacrifice his life for the satisfaction of exterminating a million barbarians is not a true republican.”

It was imperative that Lincoln influence the delegates to the Republican convention held in Chicago that year. The 48'ers were in attendance in strength. Frederick Hassaurek, August Willich, Frederich Kapp, Gustave Koerner and Carl Schurz were among those in attendance. Lincoln’s efforts at befriending the 48'ers paid off. He won nomination as the Republican candidate.

When the 1860 Presidential election results came in, Lincoln won due to having the larger number of electoral votes due largely to the winning of Illinois and the northwestern States. With his election, the Union began dis-integrating. The same Lincoln who proclaimed that people had the right to shake-off their government now took the opposite position now that he was in office and faced with a similar crisis as faced in Europe in 1848.

In Texas and many of the Southern States, the politics played out differently. The previously outspoken 48er's were encouraged to stand with policies of State's Rights since such a stance was opposed to the tyranny of the State. This message resonated with many of the 48'ers who came from some of the regions of Europe where the States opposed the unification of a single nation state.

In the aftermath of the election, the forty-eighters who helped Lincoln began wanting rewards for their services to him. Among them were experienced soldiers who began volunteering for service. Winning the electoral votes of Illinois and the Northwest was critical to Lincoln’s election. Had one in twenty voted differently, Lincoln would not have been elected. The 48’ers were critical in Lincoln’s election.

Even Frederich Engles said "Had it not been for the experienced soldiers who had entered America after the European Revolution-especially from Germany-the organization of the Union army would have taken still longer than it did".

The 48’ers were also important in military affairs. Since they had military experience, they were considered a valuable asset for the United States military which needed experienced officers in their efforts at suppressing the Southern States.

When the military forces of the States remaining in the Union had been defeated at the First Battle of Manassas, Abraham Lincoln sought the counsel of the forty-eighter, General Giuseppe Garibladi on how best to handle the situation unfolding before him. Lincoln had him brought to the United States to obtain his counsel on how to unite the States. Garibaldi had participated in numerous uprisings in Europe and South America, with recent success in forcing many of the Italian States into a unified nation.

Some in the Southern States saw the threat for what it was. The theologian, James Henry Thornwell proclaimed at that time "The parties of this conflict are not merely abolitionists and slave-holders they are atheists, socialists and communists, red republicans, Jacobians on one side and friends of order and regulated freedom on the other. In one word, the world is the battleground-Christianity and atheism are the combatants and the progress of humanity is at stake".

http://hubpages.com/hub/150th-Anniversary-of-Lincolns-Election-Understanding-the-1848-connection

746 posted on 12/14/2010 9:27:51 AM PST by Idabilly ("I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. ...)
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To: cowboyway

I am talking about the Coven that you defend moron.


747 posted on 12/14/2010 9:38:45 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: rockrr; TheBigIf; Idabilly; central_va; mstar; southernsunshine; manc
that’s exactly who you are.

That's a serious accusation that you and the-bi-gif are making, punkrr. What proof do you or the the-bi-gif have that anybody is a democrat, a klansman or both? If you have proof, shouldn't one of you two creeps alert the mods so that the ban hammer may be applied to the culprit(s)? And if you don't have proof shouldn't you STFU?

BTW, who are you, punkrr? You've claimed to have been born and raised in at least two different Southern states and you once posted a picture of your 'back yard' which turned out to be a snagged photo from Google Images. (Hint to the uninitiated: punkrr is a low life, scum sucking, liberal troll)

748 posted on 12/14/2010 9:41:33 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: Idabilly

Funny but the first piece you posted about the 48ers discussed their desire to have a republic and defend liberty. Now you post some pure propaganda that simply implies that they were socialist. The fact still remains though that it was Confederate democrats who formed the People’s party (a socialist party) after the war which then went on to merge with the democrat party and gave rise to the fascist progressive movement. Of course both the Confederate democrats and the Progressive democrats revered the Coven or klavern of the KKK and both continually fought to undermine the Constitution.


749 posted on 12/14/2010 9:44:52 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: Idabilly

Just as an anectdotal observation of 53 years.

I have personally known as in (known they were members) 3-4 real white supremacists who belonged in organizations.

1) Upstate New York.....Christian Identity

2) Pennsylvania....Klan....was at Greensboro...had worked as a project manager for my dad...dad fired him for his membership.

3) Jacksonville FL....hardcore Christian Identity...former serious military...he is southern no question

4) Hudson valley...NeoNazi...Hammerskin sort...very angry...stays informed, I’ll give him that

I did know a few Citizens Council folks in Jackson MS way back in the 60s but they were more like League of the South...not violent personally...and were more segregationist than anything else..not zealots but worried about the implications of black political power

I like how when you corner them with Yankee racism then they try to play the Democrat card.

OK count me on the record. I think the radical GOP of Reconstruction was every bit as destructive to civility as was any fire-eater and that 100 years later that it was a coalition of liberal and moderate GOP (not Magnus or Barry or WFB) aligned with Yankee Democrats that instituted all this social BS that now threatens to kill us and has crippled our ability to function as a culture. The liberal Dems of the 1960s did it for votes and the dumbassed GOP did it for guilt.

I will take a John C Stennis over a Lowell Weicker, Tom Dewey or Jacob Javitz any day of the week.

Politics is never so simple in retrospect except to simpletons.


750 posted on 12/14/2010 9:44:52 AM PST by wardaddy ("Out Here" by Josh Thompson pretty much says it all to those who will never understand anyhow)
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To: TheBigIf; Idabilly
The terrorist KKK murdered republicans. Your claim is pure propaganda that they contained many republicans.

As unlikely as is my agreeing with Ida about anything, she's right about this. The 1920s Klan revival, while primarily aligned with the Democrats in the south, it was largely Republican in the Midwest. In Indiana, which the Klan entirely controlled, they operated basically as the Republican machine. Look up Governor Edward L. Jackson, D.C. Stephenson, and the Madge Oberholzer scandal.

751 posted on 12/14/2010 9:45:12 AM PST by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: cowboyway

My only accusation ‘cow boy gay’ is that the KKK has been the revered Coven or klavern of the Confederate and the Progressive democrats. It is not my concern that you support and defend them.


752 posted on 12/14/2010 9:47:28 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: rockrr
What a waste of a perfectly good horse.

If you want to see a waste look in the mirror.

753 posted on 12/14/2010 9:47:54 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: TheBigIf
I'm trying to be nice. Do you not know what a “48er” was? Hitler said he was fighting for liberty, same as Lincoln. Both had the same goal...expanding Government.
754 posted on 12/14/2010 9:50:20 AM PST by Idabilly ("I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. ...)
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To: TheBigIf
I am talking about the Coven that you defend moron.

You're an idiot...

755 posted on 12/14/2010 9:51:19 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: Bubba Ho-Tep

Yea just as we have now there are RINOs. Your instance hardly qualifies as ‘many’ republicans. There were progressive republicans. Just as we have many republicans that will be able to brought up in future debates as having supported the green movement or gay rights fascist movement, etc…

The mainstay of the KKK was always as a terrorist wing of the democrat party and is well known for targeting and murdering republicans.


756 posted on 12/14/2010 9:56:12 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: TheBigIf
My only accusation ‘cow boy gay’ is that the KKK has been the revered Coven or klavern

Boy are you ever an idiot. Where did The Coven get you?

You yankees are The Coven, you mental midget, and I can't stand you creeps!

Where are you posting from, anyway? A mental ward?

757 posted on 12/14/2010 9:57:59 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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To: cowboyway

Wow! What a comeback. You brought up the Coven and then you get upset when it is proven that it is you that defends a coven or klavern.


758 posted on 12/14/2010 9:58:03 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: cowboyway

It is you moron who apart of a Coven.

Look at the names of the confederate democrat KKK leaders: “Cyclops,” “Wizard,” “Grand Dragon.” The Imperial Wizard meets with “klaverns,” which sounds a lot like “covens.”

You just keep proving how stupid you really are.


759 posted on 12/14/2010 9:59:48 AM PST by TheBigIf
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To: TheBigIf
You brought up the Coven and then you get upset when it is proven that it is you that defends a coven or klavern.

Put down the bong and back away slowly!

760 posted on 12/14/2010 9:59:56 AM PST by cowboyway (Molon labe : Deo Vindice : "Rebellion is always an option!!"--Jim Robinson)
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