Posted on 04/10/2009 10:23:20 AM PDT by Kansas58
Rush needs some more information.
The caller was trying to make the case of labor unions, in the modern economy.
As an example of "corporate greed" the caller brought up his "Father in law" who was only months away from a 20 year anniversary, which would have earned his "Father in Law" a pension.
I call BS to this!
There are Federal rules as to "vesting requirements" and NO company is allowed to revoke a pension or deny a pension to someone unders such circumstances!
The vesting must give them some degree of credit, for every year of service, after 5 years.
There is absolutely NO way that any company could completely deny a pension benefit to someone with 19 years of credited service and 19 years of service for vesting.
The caller was making this up --- or this happened 50 years ago BEFORE we had Federal laws which prevent such things from happening!
One other point: Corporate profits are pretty much unaffected by ONE year of service, for this ficticious "Father in Law" ---
Pension laws, for defined benefit plans, would require contributions into the plan every year, for this person.
It would have meant virtually nothing to any corporation, to fund the 20th year of a pension benefit for a person with 19 years of service, already.
The caller was a very polite liar.
His story just does not hold up.
I could tell right way that he was a seminar caller-—he had his phoney talking points all neatly set up with consultation by the union goons.
I thought about that too.. also, even if true his father was laid off, the caller assumed the reason was for cutting is benefits. Very few companies would take the chance of playing a game like this in these lawsuit crazy days. One 'whistle blower' on these practices would bring a company down.
One other thing I wish Rush said (albeit, I don't want to play armchair host, he is the genius, not I) would be to turn around the 'greed' comment, similar to a classic Milton Freidman speech and point out that the Unions are just as greedy, why is greed by the company wrong but the greed by the Union OK?
What if said FIL was fired or laid off .......he isn’t due vested pension then is he ?
BTTT with just a question......
Thanks !
...also, even if true, wouldn’t be this a failure of the union contract with the company?
Oh sure, drag ERISA into this.
Must we be bound by pertinent facts ALL the time? Can’t we be like the liberals and just make chit up all the time?
There's been quite a bit of that this year.
These Union guys are fun to work with sometimes.
I sell insurance and mutual funds. They would all, to a person, try to get the best price on any product, Union Label be Da**ned, foreign companies are just FINE!
(But the folks who cut THEIR checks? Well they have to be “patriotic” and pay the union scale!)
Absolutely he is GUARANTEED his pension.
It is impossible, under current law, for this story to be true.
The pension BELONGS to the worker.
Federal law sets minimums, and under FEDERAL law, this can not happen.
Chances are very high that the actual pension contract is BETTER than Federal law requires.
wWhat usually happens at 20 years or 25 years is that the retiree also gets additional benefits such as healthcare for themselves and possibly their spouse. So while it’s probably not strictly true that the person got no pension, their benefits may have been significantly reduced if they fell short of a critical aniversary.
define ‘greed’....
“I sell insurance and mutual funds. They would all, to a person, try to get the best price on any product, Union Label be Da**ned, foreign companies are just FINE!
(But the folks who cut THEIR checks? Well they have to be “patriotic” and pay the union scale!)”
I see the same thing, when they call a plumber to their home they never call union.
But the fact remains that "corporate greed" is a populist form of demogoguery. Most people would do the same thing given the opportunity.
Well, lets be honest then.
And lets show how generous the company is, for employees that make it past this 20 year deadline!
It is not evil to set deadlines, and deadlines do MEAN something!
Bump to reference during my podcast listening tonight.
My employer at the time (a big world wide company) was down sizing and we closed an office, laying off several. One was a man with 24 years of service. At 25 years he would have qualified for lifetime medical insurance. At 24 years this was denied.
Six months later, business turned and we were swamped. I was asked to bring some people back on a "contract basis". The first person I thought of was this man.
I quietly approached him (off the record) and advised him to say no, unless, the time served under contract, would count towards his overall years of service. Long story short, he came back for 18 months, at a higher salary and got his medical.
Others were not as fortunate as he.
Sorry, I have to disagree.. while, yes, there are examples of these types, most are passionate about their jobs, they are visionaries who put far more into their company that most of us ever imagine. I have known countless of these types. Our former CEO (Fortune 500 Telecom) had an absolute passion for his company. He was in before most employees, out after most left, he guided the company by very core, sound conservative principles, and we ended up being one of the few companies who actually maintained a steady profit during the past several downturns. The local newspapers ragged on him all the time for his $12Million compensation (which included stock and benefits), yet I could not find a single employee, even liberal ones, who wouldn't say he earned every penny. From what I've seen, most CEOs are like this.. unfortunately they don't make the news.. only the few bad apples make the news and it has painted all like them.
Ok, I understand .....yet I have seen some folks get fired at my company that were vested like 6 or 7 years and weren’t eligible allegedly till they had 10 years at the company and were at least 55 years of age.
BTTT again !!
Thanks , Stay safe !!!
Wanna bet? Companies cut people in order to cut costs, and one of the costs is future pension benefits. I've long since lost count of the number of employees at my company who have between 20 and 30 years in and who were laid off just shy of then next highest pension benefit milestone. It's just the way it is.
I live in Houston, and I remember a few years ago there was outrage among the local IBEW when more than half the construction (including the electrical work) at their new building was done by non-union labor.
That was awesome. =)
I was in the IBEW for 3 months when I got a summer job (age 18) through a friend of the family...had to sign up to get the job. They spent more time complaining about the company than working!
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