Posted on 03/20/2009 7:59:40 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
In a recent book review, Jerry Coyne, professor of ecology and evolution at the University of Chicago, admitted that the secular worldview of macroevolution (the development of complex life from “simpler” forms) is at odds with Christian faith...
(Excerpt) Read more at icr.org ...
Agreed!
St. Thomas Aquinas was absolutely correct!
on-ntsa
Exactly. The real issue is evolution is used to deny the existence of God. So many people of faith attack evolution when the attack should be on the denial. Evolution is just a red herring and if it didn't exist, some other specious argument would be used.
I remember an atheist friend telling me once that even though he had no belief, he still thought himself a moral person. I asked him if he came to these moral beliefs through reason. He said no. Then how I asked? Family, culture or innately he supposed. I then asked how his family and culture got those moral beliefs or how they could spring up "a priori". At that he said he would have to think about it some more.(#)
What does that prove? It just says the bodies of man as well as all living things and dust itself are made up of the same 92 elements. Big deal.
“I have a unique way of reading the scriptures...I believe what it says, even if I don’t understand what it says...”
Then help me out with this—you also posted the following:
“Gen 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.”
So, according to the bible, God made both the beast of the earth and every thing that creepeth upoin the earth after HIS kind. HIS is a pronoun that seems to refer to God. Are the beasts and the things that creep created after God’s kind?
Well, there goes the Roman Catholic Church.
Well, there goes anyone with an IQ over 75
A little flaw with your summation...When something is allegorical it means that what is claimed to be allegorical has a different meaning...
So the problem is that when you guys call scripture allegorical, you don't have a clue what the allegory is...All you know is you don't believe what it says...
As in; if it doesn't mean what it says, what is the actual meaning??? You're clueless...
I have a clear understanding of allegory, and the bible is allegorical. I’ll rephrase my point for you without using the word “allegory”: The bible is not literally inerrant.
Agree with your statement in 41. “only a fool says there is no god”. unfortunately, unlike your atribution, that is not what i said. This is the level of debate from fundamentalists/creationists. You guys can’t debate honestly. Its laughable. Honest question....how old do you think the earth is?
You wrote that the Bible was short on detail, as far as how man was created. It isn't. You've provided a nice illustration of science confirming the Biblical creation account.
Thanks!
You obviously are not familiar with the scripture you don't believe in, you didn't read all of my post...
Gen 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
What'd you think, God made cows and crows in God's image???
......secular reason...
Please explain how reason evolved from dead, materialism.
The first statement (above) from Cohen is at least an honest statement. Evolution adherents do so out of their faith in the theory. It is not scientific method which compels them. It is not observation which compels them. It is not even reason which compels them, as reason cannot be accounted for by materialism. His 'application' of logic is misplaced because in biological systems, "logic" cannot be accounted for by materialism. For that matter, in a meterialists' world reason, logic, and truth are not accounted for, nor is conceptual thinking as a result of dead, brute, materialism, so Mr.Cohen gives us no reason to believe anything he says because human thought, in his world, is goverened by only chemical reactions taking place in the cerebral cortex and there is no "reason" to believe in a chemical reaction giving rise to conceptual thought, logic, reason, or truth. Chemicals do not engage in conceptual thought, logic, reason, or truth....they simply react. So even on the extremely rare occasion when a atheist, darwinst, materialist is correct, he gives us no reason why we should believe him or anything at all, because in a materialst world reason cannot be explained to have arisen from darwinian conceptual theory.
The PUBLISHER and EDITOR of the first Bible was the Catholic Church, and the PUBLISHER and EDITOR of that first Bible never intended for every page to be taken literally. Literal translations are nearly impossible to accomplish, exactly, in MODERN languages.
To think you can get an exact, perfect, literal translation from old Hebrew to old Greek to Modern English is absurd.
Faith and science are fully compatible on the evolution issue. This is not at all to say that we have all the answers, in either discipline. We won't have all the answers until we make it to Heaven, ourselves.
“Gen 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.”
Read the rest of your own quote! It says the beast of the earth and the things that creepeth are made after HIS kind, and HIS refers to God! That’s my question: if this is literally true, then those things must be made after God’s kind, right?
Stop making sense—we’ll have none of that here!
And your church gives itself the authority to chose which portions of the bible are allegory...
Plants ultimately turning into computer programmers sound pretty unbelievable but what's even stranger is some guy dying, being nailed to a cross, getting buried, coming back alive, going to hell for few days and then going up in the sky somewhere...
If anything in the bible is allegory, THAT scenario would more likely fit the bill...
Why is it you believe that bible story and not the other ones???
Go look it up and debate it from a level of quasi knowledge.
I hope you know that is a non-sequitur in this discussion. I am arguing from a lack of mention of evolution in the Bible, which definitely, specifically asserts evolution's diametric opposite -- special creation by God Himself. I am not saying that the Bible definitely, specifically asserts DNA's diametric opposite (which I can't even begin to conjure).
Like you, I worry about our young people. Unlike you, I don't consider creationism a needless straw man; I consider creationism the scientific antidote to evolutionism. And I, like you, definitely want the question to be rightly open (which is disallowed in most schools).
To do your question justice, It’ll take a year of research. See you in March 2010.
“Why is it you believe that bible story and not the other ones???”
Perhaps you should address your question more broadly to the vast majority of Christian denominations who can clearly see the compatability of evolution with their own faith. Fortunately, the minority of literalist Christians aren’t going to get their point of view taught in science classes.
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